Brad's assessment discussion - Rebuild?

Hearts to hearts

Brownlow Medallist
Mar 16, 2001
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I’m struggling to align the story that Brad was all for a youth drafting policy, and wasn’t happy being thwarted, with the fact that his selection policies right to the end were slanted away from taking risks on talent development and towards known quantities, even if they were known to be limited.

Great point about how many first round picks we have already, between drafts, trades and free agency - plenty of room to improve on the club’s side to see what the guys we have are capable of, before we start discarding players cheaply to see what we can get from new draftees.

I heard someone in the media over the weekend say how hard it was for players when the coach leaves because suddenly they don’t have credits in the bank - they have to prove themselves from scratch. Perfect summation to me of why a coaching change is likely to be good for the team’s performance.

Let’s see what we have before deciding whether to start a fire sale to help Hutchy’s ratings at trade and draft time. We have supplied drama on the coaching front and likely more to come with footy administration - we needn’t feel obliged to take the theatrical route with the list.
 

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HBFlanker

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Jul 23, 2008
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Lets think about this logically.

More players this season will be shown the door than any other year.

Locks to be moved on are Thompson, Tyson, Hrovat, Campbell, Wright. Jacobs i also think is in serious trouble to hold his spot

Players that i would like to be see moved on are Macmillan and Atley.

This all rests upon if we decide to trade one of Brown, Goldstein or Cunnington. These are the only three that have any value for us to fast track a rebuild.

We cannot move on this many players, which may save Atley and Macmillan, but they are not in my best 22. Same with Marley Williams.

My round 1 team for next year:

Murphy Tarrant EVW
Mcdonald Durdin Daw
Dumont Cunnington Polec
Wood Larkey Thomas
Ziebell Brown Zurhaar
Goldstein Higgins LDU

Anderson Scott Ahern Simpkin

EMG: Garner Pittard Walker

Backline obviously undertakes a massive overhaul, however it needs to happen. Forward line may be a bit tall, but JZ will roll through the middle.

I think this team is actually quite solid, however depth will be a big issue
 

King Corey

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The only club that has actively pushed out 'guns' to usher in youth was Hawthorn with Croad and (a willing) young McPharlin in 2001. They turned them into Hodge, Ladson and Mitchell.

That was very much an outlier in football history and one of those flukey moves that seems to only work for Hawthorn. St Kilda got in a similar trade situation with Lockett and after some initial fanfare didn't really have much to show for it a few years later.

Struggle to think anyone else since traded 'against their will' who held club status at the time and helped set up their previous club for a future premiership.

If we initiated trading Brown or Cunnington for draft picks it'd be a very high risk move almost completely unsupported by any successful precedent.
 

big_e

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Lets think about this logically.

More players this season will be shown the door than any other year.

Locks to be moved on are Thompson, Tyson, Hrovat, Campbell, Wright. Jacobs i also think is in serious trouble to hold his spot

Players that i would like to be see moved on are Macmillan and Atley.

This all rests upon if we decide to trade one of Brown, Goldstein or Cunnington. These are the only three that have any value for us to fast track a rebuild.

We cannot move on this many players, which may save Atley and Macmillan, but they are not in my best 22. Same with Marley Williams.

My round 1 team for next year:

Murphy Tarrant EVW
Mcdonald Durdin Daw
Dumont Cunnington Polec
Wood Larkey Thomas
Ziebell Brown Zurhaar
Goldstein Higgins LDU

Anderson Scott Ahern Simpkin

EMG: Garner Pittard Walker

Backline obviously undertakes a massive overhaul, however it needs to happen. Forward line may be a bit tall, but JZ will roll through the middle.

I think this team is actually quite solid, however depth will be a big issue
We should put aside any talk of trading players or cutting players until we see how they perform under a new regime.

Oh, and trading our best players now to maybe get better in a few years is nonsensical.
 

big_e

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The only club that has actively pushed out 'guns' to usher in youth was Hawthorn with Croad and (a willing) young McPharlin in 2001. They turned them into Hodge, Ladson and Mitchell.

That was very much an outlier in football history and one of those flukey moves that seems to only work for Hawthorn. St Kilda got in a similar trade situation with Lockett and after some initial fanfare didn't really have much to show for it a few years later.

Struggle to think anyone else since traded 'against their will' who held club status at the time and helped set up their previous club for a future premiership.

If we initiated trading Brown or Cunnington for draft picks it'd be a very high risk move almost completely unsupported by any successful precedent.
Agree on this. Just some extra detail around that move:

Hawthorn were pretty average for a few years - tenth, ninth and 15th in the first years after that move (all under Schwab).

Even Clarko's first years weren't great - 14th, 11th and finals only in 2007.

Luke Hodge's first final was game number 111 for him.
 

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Only Forwards

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I’m struggling to align the story that Brad was all for a youth drafting policy, and wasn’t happy being thwarted, with the fact that his selection policies right to the end were slanted away from taking risks on talent development and towards known quantities, even if they were known to be limited.

Great point about how many first round picks we have already, between drafts, trades and free agency - plenty of room to improve on the club’s side to see what the guys we have are capable of, before we start discarding players cheaply to see what we can get from new draftees.

I heard someone in the media over the weekend say how hard it was for players when the coach leaves because suddenly they don’t have credits in the bank - they have to prove themselves from scratch. Perfect summation to me of why a coaching change is likely to be good for the team’s performance.

Let’s see what we have before deciding whether to start a fire sale to help Hutchy’s ratings at trade and draft time. We have supplied drama on the coaching front and likely more to come with footy administration - we needn’t feel obliged to take the theatrical route with the list.
Cracking post this.

All Brad's postulation now is auditioning for other employers. I'd appreciate now if he took our colours off while doing it.

We are where we are and the winds of change are upon us.

The decisions we as a club make in these moments will shape the club for a decade to come.
 

barney136

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I think Brads future in football may well be in the list management area, he is well suited to that area and maybe just maybe not fully finished at North Melbourne yet.
 

B4Bear

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Jul 6, 2011
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Unless Garner can get a sustainable run at it, injury free, for the rest of the year I think he will be shown the door.

Same with Jacobs.

The club has shown amazing loyalty and patience with perpetually injured players; based on nothing more than a handful of good games spread over a number of years.

For every Tarrant there have been five busts.
 

justroyal

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Jul 1, 2014
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Ok my confusion lies here:
Did Brad suggest to the board that with the possibility of going through a rebuild meant he did or did not want to be the coach during that period?
 

Elite Master

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May 20, 2011
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We have all been critical that Brad has selected very old and experienced teams even after the heavy cuts made at the end of 2016. Are we now led to believe that Scott (who now is claiming we needed a full scale rebuild and not a 'reset'), had his hand forced by the club to play a mature team to stay competitive?
 

Only Forwards

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We have all been critical that Brad has selected very old and experienced teams even after the heavy cuts made at the end of 2016. Are we now led to believe that Scott (who now is claiming we needed a full scale rebuild and not a 'reset'), had his hand forced by the club to play a mature team to stay competitive?
There are some cognitive leaps we're being asked to make that just do not add up when you look on what was said over the journey, compared to what is being spoken about now.

For mine there is a lot of revisionist $hit being said because no club is taking on a my way or the high way coach. Or more accurately 'we had to retire the old blokes because I'd play them' type coach.

The board will do what it has to and keep cutting.

I eagerly await Friday to see where we're at as a club. Our loudest voice now is on field. To that end win, just f***ing win. Shove it up all of them.
 

King Corey

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I think Brads future in football may well be in the list management area, he is well suited to that area and maybe just maybe not fully finished at North Melbourne yet.
If a club is hoping for a list that any given moment is bereft of key defenders with 50-100 games in the 20-25yo bracket or small crumbing forwards or outside players, then he's definitely the man for the job.
 

The Y Factor

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I’m struggling to align the story that Brad was all for a youth drafting policy, and wasn’t happy being thwarted, with the fact that his selection policies right to the end were slanted away from taking risks on talent development and towards known quantities, even if they were known to be limited.

Great point about how many first round picks we have already, between drafts, trades and free agency - plenty of room to improve on the club’s side to see what the guys we have are capable of, before we start discarding players cheaply to see what we can get from new draftees.

I heard someone in the media over the weekend say how hard it was for players when the coach leaves because suddenly they don’t have credits in the bank - they have to prove themselves from scratch. Perfect summation to me of why a coaching change is likely to be good for the team’s performance.

Let’s see what we have before deciding whether to start a fire sale to help Hutchy’s ratings at trade and draft time. We have supplied drama on the coaching front and likely more to come with footy administration - we needn’t feel obliged to take the theatrical route with the list.

Carlton, Gold Coast and Melbourne have all gone heavily to the draft - ten years later - ZERO

They have all the ‘top end ‘ talent a club could need. ITS NOT A GUARANTEE

North need to be very balanced IMHO.

If there is a chance to trade a player or two and bring in some young quality to compliment our list - great

If we can get more games into the many round 1 and 2 players on our list and see if they cut it - even better

If we focus on using our top picks to get more young talent - perfect

However - if the next hall @ 60+, Marley @100+, Pittard @ steak knives comes along - yes please

Good culture - doable game plan - earn selection = Roo 4 Life
 

Snake_Baker

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To this end, Carey is right. No player should be seen as untouchable.
Carey actually proved that by his own scenario, but the list critiques have been absurd, so the analysis goes out the window.

We'll account for a young struggling Gold Coast, but then we get the best side in the comp down in Hobart. Push them all the way and the ignorant list claims will instantly evaporate.
 
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