Moved Thread Brayshaw vs Walsh vs Rozee

[WilloTree]

I see Brayshaw and Butters on another level. It's the Bont factor, the will to do things when they matter.

Butters is a ripper. How good was the '18 draft for Port! Rozee, Butters and Duursma.

There's something wild about nailing three picks. Freo took Young, Serong and Frederick (at pick 61) in 2019.

Imagine both teams without those 3. Quietly hoping the Amiss, Erasmus, Johnson trio turn out as good.

As to the OP. We've had a bit more time to digest now.

It's Rozee for the fans of elite skills and fast free flowing entertaining footy, and Brayshaw for the grunt, will and determination to succeed through effort and 2 way running.

I feel for Sam Walsh a bit. Looked early like he'd be the pick of the bunch easily. He's been so poorly developed as an elite footballer though. He's basically as good as he was in his first year (which was pretty awesome) but just didn't add to his game.

Walsh is still very young though, so I'm sure eventually someone will get to work with him and turn him into a star. I don't think changing clubs would help, it would probably make it worse. Not having stability in the coaching ranks can't help. It would be hard to knuckle down when every few years you're hearing a different voice with different ideas. The problem here is Vossy is dreadful, so he'll have to wait a while yet.

 

[WilloTree]

Walsh as a junior was a ball winner that was dominant in the inside while having the elite endurance to play an outside game as well. He was also a much more composed player on the outside. Not very tricky or skillful but he would use his agility (which is surprisingly elite - you wouldn't expect it given he isn't the fleetest of foot but he tested very well) and strength to either evade the tackle or break through it and dish off to someone in a better position. His footy IQ would have been one of his strengths, just always knew where to run and where his teammate would be.


Put Walsh in the Geelong/Hawthorn/Sydney development pipeline and he's got a few more tricks rather than see the ball and go for a hack kick around the corner.

We're on the same wave length dude.

 

[hammo24]

Butters is a ripper. How good was the '18 draft for Port! Rozee, Butters and Duursma.

There's something wild about nailing three picks. Freo took Young, Serong and Frederick (at pick 61) in 2019.

Imagine both teams without those 3. Quietly hoping the Amiss, Erasmus, Johnson trio turn out as good.

As to the OP. We've had a bit more time to digest now.

It's Rozee for the fans of elite skills and fast free flowing entertaining footy, and Brayshaw for the grunt, will and determination to succeed through effort and 2 way running.

I feel for Sam Walsh a bit. Looked early like he'd be the pick of the bunch easily. He's been so poorly developed as an elite footballer though. He's basically as good as he was in his first year (which was pretty awesome) but just didn't add to his game.

Walsh is still very young though, so I'm sure eventually someone will get to work with him and turn him into a star. I don't think changing clubs would help, it would probably make it worse. Not having stability in the coaching ranks can't help. It would be hard to knuckle down when every few years you're hearing a different voice with different ideas. The problem here is Vossy is dreadful, so he'll have to wait a while yet.

something you might not know he’s (rozee) is insanely good at other sports.

parents have must some insane genes

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

Did I miss something last year when Walsh made the AA squad or 2021 when he was touted as one of the best 3rd year players of all time and a top 5 player in the competition?

The waffle in here its is as if he's one of the worst players in the comp

 

[WilloTree]

I’m late to this thread but why isn’t butters included in this list? he’s gone passed them all

Butters is outstanding. Probably should be added to the OP, but at the time it was started he wasn't looked at in the same fashion.

I'm also not sure he's gone passed them. Maybe joined them though. They seem pretty different players as well to judge 'gone past'.

See if you can guess who the stats below belong to (the 6.5 tackles might give it away - hahaha)

 

[WilloTree]

Did I miss something last year when Walsh made the AA squad or 2021 when he was touted as one of the best 3rd year players of all time and a top 5 player in the competition?

The waffle in here its is as if he's one of the worst players in the comp

I don't think anyone is saying he's poor (well, maybe some). Certainly not me. He's a very very good player and will be for ages. But, I think you've answered your own question when you state "Walsh made the AA squad".

The other two made the team.

 

[RAPPA]

Did I miss something last year when Walsh made the AA squad or 2021 when he was touted as one of the best 3rd year players of all time and a top 5 player in the competition?

The waffle in here its is as if he's one of the worst players in the comp

He's comparatively playing at a significantly lower level than the counterparts. We all know how these threads work. He is however going backwards this year compared on previous years, whereas the others are building.

 

[JyeDye]

Did I miss something last year when Walsh made the AA squad or 2021 when he was touted as one of the best 3rd year players of all time and a top 5 player in the competition?

The waffle in here its is as if he's one of the worst players in the comp

Victim of his own high standards. Funny seeing 'not tough' as a complaint against him though. Watched him for 5 years now and never seen him shirk a contest, played with a ****ed back and tried to get straight back into it ASAP. Laughable stuff really, he's down on his output since missing two preseasons. The other two are guns as well, there's not even a rivalry between any of these teams so no idea what the pile on is about.

 

[WilloTree]

Victim of his own high standards. Funny seeing 'not tough' as a complaint against him though. Watched him for 5 years now and never seen him shirk a contest, played with a ****ed back and tried to get straight back into it ASAP. Laughable stuff really, he's down on his output since missing two preseasons. The other two are guns as well, there's not even a rivalry between any of these teams so no idea what the pile on is about.

I think that was just 1 poster?

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

I don't think anyone is saying he's poor (well, maybe some). Certainly not me. He's a very very good player and will be for ages. But, I think you've answered your own question when you state "Walsh made the AA squad".

The other two made the team.

Old mate Hayward certainly has been. Walsh has definitely had a downturn in form since Voss took over, he's playing some strange high half forward/extra mid role which sees him not playing at many CBA's but still roaming around like a midfielder between arcs.

Voss has tailored the team to be built around Cripps which is why Cripps was the centrepiece last year winning the Brownlow. Teague tailored it around Walsh and when it was all about him he truly shone as an out and out superstar.

The question mark is that in both those seasons he's had major surgeries in pre season and has lacked a defined role, is it Voss being crap or Walsh simply lacking the preparation many AFL players need to succeed? Hard to know until either Voss is gone or Walsh has a proper pre season.

 

[Handyandy]

Old mate Hayward certainly has been. Walsh has definitely had a downturn in form since Voss took over, he's playing some strange high half forward/extra mid role which sees him not playing at many CBA's but still roaming around like a midfielder between arcs.

Boak was asked to do the same strange role when Voss was at ports and it almost prematurely ended his career.
Walsh is obviously playing with an injury, as wines is.

 

[WillHayward]

Walsh as a junior was a ball winner that was dominant in the inside while having the elite endurance to play an outside game as well. He was also a much more composed player on the outside. Not very tricky or skillful but he would use his agility (which is surprisingly elite - you wouldn't expect it given he isn't the fleetest of foot but he tested very well) and strength to either evade the tackle or break through it and dish off to someone in a better position. His footy IQ would have been one of his strengths, just always knew where to run and where his teammate would be.


Put Walsh in the Geelong/Hawthorn/Sydney development pipeline and he's got a few more tricks rather than see the ball and go for a hack kick around the corner.

"As a junior".

That's his problem.

Still plays an under 12 style of game chasing the ball around..

He's simply rubbish at AFL level now. Game has gone past him. Running around in circles racking up stats doing dinky kicks and handballs is no longer tolerated in the AFL.

People are slow to realise he's now legitimately s**t.

 

[WillHayward]

Old mate Hayward certainly has been. Walsh has definitely had a downturn in form since Voss took over, he's playing some strange high half forward/extra mid role which sees him not playing at many CBA's but still roaming around like a midfielder between arcs.

Voss has tailored the team to be built around Cripps which is why Cripps was the centrepiece last year winning the Brownlow. Teague tailored it around Walsh and when it was all about him he truly shone as an out and out superstar.

The question mark is that in both those seasons he's had major surgeries in pre season and has lacked a defined role, is it Voss being crap or Walsh simply lacking the preparation many AFL players need to succeed? Hard to know until either Voss is gone or Walsh has a proper pre season.

"Out and out out superstar."

Yep ok Luke Darcy

Give it a spell.

He's not in the top 5 players of the 13th placed slide.

So he's not top 100 in the comp.

Now that doesn't make him s**t. But it makes miles away from being a star.

 

[SSSSSS]

"As a junior".

That's his problem.

Still plays an under 12 style of game chasing the ball around..

He's simply rubbish at AFL level now. Game has gone past him. Running around in circles racking up stats doing dinky kicks and handballs is no longer tolerated in the AFL.

People are slow to realise he's now legitimately s**t.

Which is exactly my point.

Put him in a club with a strong development pipeline and he's one of the best mids in the business.

Carlton didn't refine his game.

 

[Mr Cheese]

"As a junior".

That's his problem.

Still plays an under 12 style of game chasing the ball around..

He's simply rubbish at AFL level now. Game has gone past him. Running around in circles racking up stats doing dinky kicks and handballs is no longer tolerated in the AFL.

People are slow to realise he's now legitimately s**t.

Got to respectfully disagree. He tore us apart last year when we were up and about. Clearly a player who needs a pre-season, and to be in a run and gun team (Carlton are not that currently). He may end up not as good as the other two, but I don't think he'll ever be s**t when fully fit.

If he's clear for the rest of the year and does the same next, then I'll accede the point, but to put him in the same bracket as Scully is premature at this juncture.

On SM-G955F using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Sphynx]

Butters is a ripper. How good was the '18 draft for Port! Rozee, Butters and Duursma.

There's something wild about nailing three picks. Freo took Young, Serong and Frederick (at pick 61) in 2019.

Imagine both teams without those 3. Quietly hoping the Amiss, Erasmus, Johnson trio turn out as good.

Duursma averages like 13.5 disposals a game across the last 2 seasons.

He doesn't belong with the other two, yet gets consistently attributed with their success because he was drafted in the same year.

 

[WillHayward]

Got to respectfully disagree. He tore us apart last year when we were up and about. Clearly a player who needs a pre-season, and to be in a run and gun team (Carlton are not that currently). He may end up not as good as the other two, but I don't think he'll ever be s**t when fully fit.

If he's clear for the rest of the year and does the same next, then I'll accede the point, but to put him in the same bracket as Scully is premature at this juncture.

On SM-G955F using BigFooty.com mobile app

Scully had plenty of good games.

 

[WillHayward]

Which is exactly my point.

Put him in a club with a strong development pipeline and he's one of the best mids in the business.

Carlton didn't refine his game.

But he's not because his only elite physical attribute is endurance running

Not fast not strong and a s**t kick and s**t overhead.

 

[The Hobo]

His little handball game was ok when his disposal was acceptable, but he's butchering so many kicks right now. You don't notice it in the stats because they're diluted by the 3 disposals he gets for every proper kick. (short kick/hb to a close target, receive, hb again, receive and then kick)

Most of the Carlton midfield are poor kicks and yet they ignore Saad when he's free. Saad is an elite kick.

 

[Mr Cheese]

Scully had plenty of good games.

True and not saying you won't be proved right, but Walsh's 21 & 22 seasons eclipse anything Scully put together. Whether you value them or not, getting 30 Brownlow votes in a season is excellent, as is a top 6 Coaches Vote finish. He might have plateaued, regressed, who knows? But we won't be able to say one way or the other for a while yet.

On SM-G955F using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

"Out and out out superstar."

Yep ok Luke Darcy

Give it a spell.

He's not in the top 5 players of the 13th placed slide.

So he's not top 100 in the comp.

Now that doesn't make him s**t. But it makes miles away from being a star.

Currently he might not be, if he was he'd definitely be in the lower half for sure. My only reference to being an out and out superstar was his 2021 season where even you put him in the top 10 players in the competition in another thread by the looks of things.

30 Brownlow Votes, 6th in Coaches votes and 2nd in the MVP is testament to how good his best was in 2021.
His 2022 was still very good but not as influential as his 2021 season.

You seem to think I'm disagreeing with the argument that he's currently doing SFA playing ring around the rosie along with the rest of Carltons midfield, I'm not.

This season I'd much rather have Rozee in Carlton's midfield but long term I'd still back Walsh in to get back to his best or improve from that benchmark.

 

[CasuallyDressed]

Wardlaw will be better than all of them in a couple of seasons. First time I've seen him play today, best young player in the league. A more dynamic version of Daicos

Lol made a decision that Wardlaw will be better than Daicos, Walsh, Rozee and Brayshaw on 4 quarters of footy.

BigFooty never fails to deliver the laughs.

 

[Sphynx]

Lol made a decision that Wardlaw will be better than Daicos, Walsh, Rozee and Brayshaw on 4 quarters of footy.

BigFooty never fails to deliver the laughs.

His post was miles off.

Wardlaw plays nothing like Daicos........can't say I disagree with the rest of it.

 

[WilloTree]

Duursma averages like 13.5 disposals a game across the last 2 seasons.

He doesn't belong with the other two, yet gets consistently attributed with their success because he was drafted in the same year.

Oh I agree he's not in the same class. But, he did play his 50th game in his 4th season, so pretty valuable part of the list.

 

[port_adelaide_1870]

Rozee starting to separate from the pack. Walsh and Brayshaw nearly on the same level at this point. Both are your average good AFL midfielder