Autopsy Brisbane defeats Hawthorn, Rd 11, 2019

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thejockey

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The expectation is for our senior players to lead as they should and perform reasonably consistently. The reality if that occurs is we would be 7-4 right now not 5-6.

We have had some major moments this season where we have desperately needed our senior group of leaders to step up and they have vanished as a collective.
I’m talking about the expectation on the collective of the ‘team’ not individual players

I don’t disagree with your assessment of those players
 

vanders

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We're getting good experience into guys like Worpel Cousins Lewis and Scrimshaw and getting miles into the legs of Scully and JOM, the concern is that the senior guys who they are meant to be learning from are playing like sh*te.

The young guys will have more experience going into next season but the senior guys like Smith Frawley Stratton and Gunston will be another year older and some of them are already 30+ and aren't going to be getting much better.

Unless Shauny Burgoyne transfers some of his magic dna across to them :moustache:
 

BobHawk

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I am just amazed in reading some of the comments in this thread. People either have very short memories or just don't get what happened with Hodge. Sadly, it is a bit like this country's social and political discourse in 2019. All emotion and zero logic. Hodge retired as a result of the club's strategy to move the team into the next phase of winning a premiership. IMO he looked at the end of the road anyway. Brisbane came in with a godfather offer during the trade period because they needed experience and leadership. According to reports the Suns tried the same with Rough & McEvoy. I suspect Rough was probably told he may struggle to keep his spot (similar situation to Mitchell & Lewis) and would be better off taking an offer from another club. Now he is playing at BH.

Thinking that Hodge should have stayed at the club based on a loss to Brisbane is just well, amazing. We are a fair way from where we need to be and have two < 20 gamers in the midfield and our KPF has played < 10. Out setbacks have been not only the loss of Mitchell but missing out on Lynch and Shiel during last year's trade. A KPF and, you guessed it, an A grade midfielder (and pleas don't start arguing about the merits of those two players based on current form).
 

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Roddy

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Listen to what Clarko said in the presser. As Hawk supporters we are spoiled rotten. We have periods of overwhelming and glorious success, which we get very used to, and then when those periods draw to their natural conclusion, we expect it to happen again in the blink of an eye. Football, and life, doesn't work that way. Be patient. As he says, he is on his third quest for more silverware for the club, but it doesn't happen overnight.
 

eldorado

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Listen to what Clarko said in the presser. As Hawk supporters we are spoiled rotten. We have periods of overwhelming and glorious success, which we get very used to, and then when those periods draw to their natural conclusion, we expect it to happen again in the blink of an eye. Football, and life, doesn't work that way. Be patient. As he says, he is on his third quest for more silverware for the club, but it doesn't happen overnight.
 

Mrzohs

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shattered with the result based on the way we started very similar to the richmond game all over them the first 40mins.
Without a damaging forward we don't put teams away or seem to get full reward when this is happening.
That being said we got totally out worked after quarter time.

Turning point M.Lewis has a snap 20meters out to level the scores in the last he misses, the ball goes up the other end and brisbane kick a freakish goal to be 2 goals up with roughly 5 mins to go.

The boys tried there guts out the attitude was there. best on ground for me was harris andrews he destroyed us!
it's not the first time a defender has done that against us, i can't help to think if we played our best mark up there teams wouldn't be able to do that. Pitts,Cegs,Lewis were fairly average as aerial threats, that being said lewis took a couple of grabs in the 4th qtr.
 

BJK#5

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No I think you are missing the frustration.

People are ok with our youngsters having massive dips in performance and understand where we are at however pi55ed off when our senior players do not rock up to a game.

IF and it’s a big IF those that have gone through playing 4 GFs in a row are mentally cooked and need a sea change then we need to be proactive and freshen the joint up.

This board will have a meltdown if I suggest some of the names we should be looking to move out while they have a fraction of currency but some tough decisions will need to be made at end of year.

As mentioned earlier I believe our wins have been very very scrappy and I can’t really think of one of Smith Stratton Gunston Breust Frawley Poppy Shiels that has played to their potential this season.

That is what everyone is concerned about.
Frawley does not deserve to be on that list.

Has been for the most part consistently good this season and it frustrates me that he gets no love from a lot of the people that love to sink the boot in to him when he has a poor game.
 

darthmann

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why are people giving sh*t to sicily for his performance, he made a couple of mistakes but so did everyone? he had as many marks as andrews and the 2nd most touches out of any hawk player. His disposal efficiency is usually 5-10% better but he was often rushed into clearing it out of defence. I get that kick down the middle was frustrating but it looked more to me like it was a set play that none of the mids/rucks recognised and structured up for. My mate's friends with sicily and while he lets his emotions go sometimes he's actually pretty switched on, it's hard to keep your composure when every single game the crowd are booing you and the opposition are niggling you and talking sh*t about you to get a reaction.

AFL players aren't robots just because they're in the national spotlight
 

vanders

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About the most biased commentary I've heard on television all season. Just because he can deliver in a sober tone didn't make it any less obnoxious.
David King was terrible in the Collingwood Freo match yesterday too. His barracking for the Pies and groaning when they did something bad or Freo did good was so blatant, same with Roos in our game.

Makes you wonder how much these blokes are betting on these games.
 

Maybloomer

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I agree. There was a lot of talk pre-game that this was going to be a "season defining match", "an 8 point game" will "set us up for a finals push". Someone even went as far as saying a top 4 finish wasn't out of the realms of possibly. o_O
“Middle of the road” side is pretty accurate but it’s a pretty wide road. The frustrating thing to swallow will be seeing who makes the eight this year and knowing you had those teams’ measure with a little luck with injuries.
245ED033-B75E-49E3-B328-D8698943235F.jpeg
 

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hk89

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We were -26 in contested ball. That's a smacking and tells you a lot about intensity.
It is a smacking, but given contested possession is mostly a midfield stat, IMO it says more about our midfield than whether our non-midfield players are lacking intensity. We are also generally a team that tends to be more uncontested than contested, so losing contested possession isn't always that significant for us. In fact, we are are often at our best when our uncontested possession numbers far outweigh our contested, because it usually shows we are getting the game on our terms. We've lost contested possession in every one of our wins this year, usually not by a lot, but it was by a lot against Adelaide and that didn't stop us winning comfortably. In fact I think we've only won contested possession once this year, and we lost that game , against Saints.

We won the tackle count by a larger percentage than we lost the contested ball count, and that is also a proxy for intensity, so I'm not convinced it was all about intensity, and rather our midfield getting pantsed badly after quarter time.
 

tige19

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We were -26 in contested ball. That's a smacking and tells you a lot about intensity.

Sure their mids got on top. But I'm still staggered we went no where near Neale. He's only the top possession winner in the game. Surely at half time we can come up with something here? We lack a plan B. Costs us games regularly.
As I’ve said a dozen times man, AFL footy is all about midfields, this is why I’m so big on Fremantle entering into period of a sustained window. Have a look at their midfield depth, they are looking really well equipped for a long tilt at it..

Fyfy - Elite
Mundy - Elite/V-good
Brayshaw - Good
Walters (best mid/fwd in Comp) - Elite
Cerra - developing/capable
Langdon - Vgood
Hill - VGood

Add in blokes who can hold their own going through there -

Blakely
Tucker
Conca

They literally bat 10 deep with a combination of Elite- Very good - Good - adaquete mids.. this is why they are always in games, the difference with us is stark. First of all, without Titch we do nor have 1 elite mid, Freo have Fyfe + Mundy (although old now) + Walters, we then have a sprinkling of capable mids but only 1 that really is considered very good.

Omera - Vgood
Worpel - Good/Developing
Shiels - Good
Cousins - capable
Scully - Good
Henderson - Good
Smith - Capable (sharp decline)

That’s it... we really needed Chad to become our Freos version of Walters,
There’s no reason he couldn’t but his recruitment thus far has been a write off in year 1.

Our issue isn’t actually our forward line, with quick and constant supply we’ve seen what Gunno can do, we’ve seen what Mitch can do, it’s the pure ineptness of our league worst midfield that is the downfall of this side.

Chad needed to level us up, he hasn’t and that’s played a big part.
 

tige19

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Our forward-line should be way better then what it is given how talented Gunston, Breust and Wingard are. It’s breaking down though due to the lack of midfield depth and also not having a key forward has also played a massive part.
See my latest post man
 

eldorado

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As I’ve said a dozen times man, AFL footy is all about midfields, this is why I’m so big on Fremantle entering into period of a sustained window. Have a look at their midfield depth, they are looking really well equipped for a long tilt at it..

Fyfy - Elite
Mundy - Elite/V-good
Brayshaw - Good
Walters (best mid/fwd in Comp) - Elite
Cerra - developing/capable
Langdon - Vgood
Hill - VGood

Add in blokes who can hold their own going through there -

Blakely
Tucker
Conca

They literally bat 10 deep with a combination of Elite- Very good - Good - adaquete mids.. this is why they are always in games, the difference with us is stark. First of all, without Titch we do nor have 1 elite mid, Freo have Fyfe + Mundy (although old now) + Walters, we then have a sprinkling of capable mids but only 1 that really is considered very good.

Omera - Vgood
Worpel - Good/Developing
Shiels - Good
Cousins - capable
Scully - Good
Henderson - Good
Smith - Capable (sharp decline)

That’s it... we really needed Chad to become our Freos version of Walters,
There’s no reason he couldn’t but his recruitment thus far has been a write off in year 1.

Our issue isn’t actually our forward line, with quick and constant supply we’ve seen what Gunno can do, we’ve seen what Mitch can do, it’s the pure ineptness of our league worst midfield that is the downfall of this side.

Chad needed to level us up, he hasn’t and that’s played a big part.
If we can snare Cogs, and Mitchell back, it's transformed.

Cogs is so critical.
 

Flamin Joe

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Turning point M.Lewis has a snap 20meters out to level the scores in the last he misses, the ball goes up the other end and brisbane kick a freakish goal to be 2 goals up with roughly 5 mins to go.
I know he's only young and still learning, but fu** me when I saw him shaping up with the angle he was on I had a feeling this wasn't going to end well.

That should of been a straight kick any day of the week. KISS = Keep It Simple Stupid.
 

hk89

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If we can snare Cogs, and Mitchell back, it's transformed.

Cogs is so critical.
Doesn't even need to be a Cogs level player. With Mitchell back in O'Meara, Shiels, Worpel and Cousins will all start to look better. Anyone that can fill the talent gap we have between O'Meara and the rest of the mids at the moment would be very handy. Doesn't need to be top shelf, just able to contribute more than Worpel and Cousins can right now (which isn't to say they are terrible, just a lot of load on the shoulders of kids with very little experience). Even another Shiels level player would be useful at the minute.
 

Lotus

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why are people giving **** to sicily for his performance, he made a couple of mistakes but so did everyone? he had as many marks as andrews and the 2nd most touches out of any hawk player. His disposal efficiency is usually 5-10% better but he was often rushed into clearing it out of defence. I get that kick down the middle was frustrating but it looked more to me like it was a set play that none of the mids/rucks recognised and structured up for. My mate's friends with sicily and while he lets his emotions go sometimes he's actually pretty switched on, it's hard to keep your composure when every single game the crowd are booing you and the opposition are niggling you and talking **** about you to get a reaction.

AFL players aren't robots just because they're in the national spotlight
I miss the fiery Sicily, can he be more expressive but not getting a free kick against? Just let it go but within the rules. He got that natural ability to get the crowd going, just need to learn it to his advantage.
 

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