Women's Footy Brisbane Lions Women's Team - Official Discussion

[jatz14]

All I know it's that they all go in pies.

Foetal pie? You are a sick puppy.

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[Skoob]

Players do not even need to inform anyone bar the club Dr in the first trimester, and that info would be medical privilege, so the Dr can not tell the club.

The player can play with medical approval past the first trimester.

So, not only will they not stop a known pregnant player from playing, in the first trimester, they cannot stop them playing, and if they get medical approval, they cannot stop them past that.

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It's hard to imagine any coach or club doctor allowing a known pregnant player to take the field, even if the player made the choice to do so. It would be redundant for the AFL to structure rules to control the situation. I also wouldn't be surprised if players are lectured on the risks and importance of declaring any health condition, including pregnancy.

 

[dlanod]

Foetal pie? You are a sick puppy.

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The speciality pies are the best.

 

[jatz14]

Even known, neither club nor Dr get a say first trimester, and only Dr gets a say past that, and even then it's in consultation with the player.

So it isn't up to the club, known or not.


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[Skoob]

Even known, neither club nor Dr get a say first trimester, and only Dr gets a say past that, and even then it's in consultation with the player.

So it isn't up to the club, known or not.


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Last time I looked, the team is selected on a weekly basis, by the club (coaches), not by players insisting they will play.

 

[acuguy]

As soon as a player knows they are pregnant then it should be a mandatory self reporting process. I am not advocating for mandatory testing but as soon as you know you should be banned from playing.

 

[dlanod]

As soon as a player knows they are pregnant then it should be a mandatory self reporting process. I am not advocating for mandatory testing but as soon as you know you should be banned from playing.

Ok, and if they don't self-report and don't tell the club until it becomes obvious? Delisting? Banned for life? Because they're going to effectively be serving a nine month ban anyway, so anything less than that is meaningless.

 

[acuguy]

You anti-life dlanod?

 

[The Flying Belgian]

 

[MacMum]

As soon as a player knows they are pregnant then it should be a mandatory self reporting process. I am not advocating for mandatory testing but as soon as you know you should be banned from playing.

Agree....but common sense isn't common anymore. If a player then doesn't report her pregnancy, it would be on her for the consequences if she selfishly keeps playing.

 

[acuguy]

Agree....but common sense isn't common anymore. If a player then doesn't report her pregnancy, it would be on her for the consequences if she selfishly keeps playing.

Equality does not undo biological responsibility. The world has gone mad Macmum

 

[lionbear]

This was discussed when I went to Uni, the concern for the league is not the player, it’s the unborn child, if they have suffered some condition or damage that is proven to be through footy, can they sue the league regardless of wether Mum has waived her rights to sue or not?

This was discussed in terms of basketball, which at the time had a very strict you announce you are pregnant and you must step down. A player apparently chose to hide it from the league to play in the olympics.

The lawyer said it was the right policy as he felt the league had a right to protect a child on the court.

 

[SizeMatters]

This was discussed when I went to Uni, the concern for the league is not the player, it’s the unborn child, if they have suffered some condition or damage that is proven to be through footy, can they sue the league regardless of wether Mum has waived her rights to sue or not?

This was discussed in terms of basketball, which at the time had a very strict you announce you are pregnant and you must step down. A player apparently chose to hide it from the league to play in the olympics.

The lawyer said it was the right policy as he felt the league had a right to protect a child on the court.

Can't let pregnant women play contact sport and the fact we have people arguing for it really baffles me. Contractural agreement, quarterly pregnancy testing, and if found positive must sit out the season.

 

[Hollow Knight]

Can't let pregnant women play contact sport and the fact we have people arguing for it

Haha s**t, that's an interesting interpretation. Far out.

Contractural agreement, quarterly pregnancy testing, and if found positive must sit out the season.

What a massive overreach. Not to mention that the season doesn't even go for a quarter of a year.

Club doctors are responsible for clearing/non-clearing players for medical situations. What makes this situation any different? You think a bunch of blokes with business degrees at AFL House can do it better?

2017 and we still have people who think women are somehow less able to make informed medical decisions for themselves and they need strangers to make decisions for them.

 

[Jivlain]

Can't let pregnant women play contact sport and the fact we have people arguing for it really baffles me. Contractural agreement, quarterly pregnancy testing, and if found positive must sit out the season.

That is just completely ridiculous. Should all fertile-age women be forced to get pregnancy tests before buying a beer too, just in case?

Tests can be false positives, miscarriages can happen naturally, including relatively early, and abortion is also an option.

If there's a risk the doctor won't sign off on it. That's sufficient. That's all the policy needs to be.

 

[SizeMatters]

Haha s**t, that's an interesting interpretation. Far out.



What a massive overreach. Not to mention that the season doesn't even go for a quarter of a year.

Club doctors are responsible for clearing/non-clearing players for medical situations. What makes this situation any different? You think a bunch of blokes with business degrees at AFL House can do it better?

2017 and we still have people who think women are somehow less able to make informed medical decisions for themselves and they need strangers to make decisions for them.

Quarterly as to not risk injury to any unknown fetuses. Maybe semiannually would be a better? Also the AFLW will be ~5 months if including the rigorous training that they undergo.

Never said that the player managers would be doing the medical checking... more so to inhibit females through fulfilling contractual obligations which I believe should be implemented by the AFL if it has not already been. If it hasn't then once again the AFL is behind the 8ball in regards to female sporting competitions globally. What can of worms could be opened if a fetus is damaged by a negligent mother to be? Contractual obligations at least cover the AFLs arse from any potential legal ramifications to an certain extent.

I must have missed all the blokes making 'informed' medical decisions for themselves? Please if that happened every second player would be banned due to taking illegal substances unknowingly. This isn't some normal working class female visiting a family GP, which I agree they are more than capable of making medical decisions for themselves, but a national sporting code with many rules and regulations and a reputation that must be upheld. Once again I ask, what will happen if a pregnant AFLW athlete damages her fetus while playing? Who is at fault? Who has to pay? I know for one thing the AFL will have it's name dragged through the mud.

 

[SizeMatters]

That is just completely ridiculous. Should all fertile-age women be forced to get pregnancy tests before buying a beer too, just in case?

Tests can be false positives, miscarriages can happen naturally, including relatively early, and abortion is also an option.

If there's a risk the doctor won't sign off on it. That's sufficient. That's all the policy needs to be.

Totally different scenarios and can't be compared. The AFL has an obligation to fulfil.

Adding additional physical trauma will only increase these likelihoods though. Only adding to my argument that the AFL should regulate against pregnant women playing AFLW.

Agree with the final point to an extent however I still believe it has to be 'hard coded' into laws of the game. Risks can be subjective in the medical field and what one doctor perceives as a risk another won't.

 

[Jivlain]

Totally different scenarios and can't be compared. The AFL has an obligation to fulfil.

Adding additional physical trauma will only increase these likelihoods though. Only adding to my argument that the AFL should regulate against pregnant women playing AFLW.

Agree with the final point to an extent however I still believe it has to be 'hard coded' into laws of the game. Risks can be subjective in the medical field and what one doctor perceives as a risk another won't.

That really just gets back to who's best equipped to make a medical decision - a trained and qualified doctor constantly updating their knowledge, or a suit at AFL House?

And while medical opinions may vary from time to time, it's got nothing on the variation of opinion amongst "dudes with MBAs" on how women's bodies function.

 

[dlanod]

You anti-life dlanod?

Wow. You a * wit, or do you just play one on BigFooty?

I'm pointing out the fundamental problems with enforcing your stance. Obviously you don't seem to have any answers for the issues pointed out so you resort to ad hominem attacks. If you don't want a discussion, write a blog.

 

[MacMum]

While being a firm believer of women being able to make their own decisions re their bodies or whatever, unfortunately some women just don't act responsible enough in their decision making.

...imo the choice to keep playing sport would depend on the type of sport being played. Some are less physical than others. The idea that a woman would WANT to continue playing aussie rules after learning she is pregnant tells me that she is doing what she wants, not what is best for her baby.

Personally I was horrified when I found out Serena Williams played the aussie open while pregnant. It turned out ok, but it also is not a rough contact sport.

There has to be some sort of policy in place for pregnancy in AFLW imo........but I do disagree with mandatory testing.

It's a tricky one, but really shouldn't be.

 

[Davemonkey]

I find the mandatory testing line a little flabbergasting. Does everyone woman in the competition have to take part? What about those not in a sexual relationship with a man? There are a fair number of women with same sex partners in the league, and if I remember correctly they have to go to a fair bit of extra effort to get pregnant. I can’t dare to speak for them but I think it would fall in to the bureaucraticly insulting realm.
How about when they get around to allowing trans-women into the league? Given the way mandatory drug testing is uniformly managed surely she needs to be tested as well right? “In the interests of fairness”

As much as I am frustrated on many of their stances I think this is one for the AFLPA & the AFLW to sort out.

 

[Skoob]

You anti-life dlanod?

You're anti-choice then I take it?
Are you one of these people who stand out the front of family planning clinics, yelling at women about what they should do with their bodies and fertilised egg?
Silly argument.
Women will make a decision on playing based on medical advice. If they choose to play against that advice, then that is their decision. Their body and their fetus.
We don't need to get into a philosophical debate about what constitutes a "child", but to label a fetus as such is emotive claptrap.

 

[acuguy]

Wow. You a **** wit, or do you just play one on BigFooty?

I'm pointing out the fundamental problems with enforcing your stance. Obviously you don't seem to have any answers for the issues pointed out so you resort to ad hominem attacks. If you don't want a discussion, write a blog.

I asked you a question and you attack me. My view is that there should be a mandatory self reporting and then you cannot play if you are pregnant. I am not advocating for mandatory testing.

 

[acuguy]

You're anti-choice then I take it?
Are you one of these people who stand out the front of family planning clinics, yelling at women about what they should do with their bodies and fertilised egg?
Silly argument.
Women will make a decision on playing based on medical advice. If they choose to play against that advice, then that is their decision. Their body and their fetus.
We don't need to get into a philosophical debate about what constitutes a "child", but to label a fetus as such is emotive claptrap.

Nah mate, I am not. I am pro life, but I respect choice. I just don't want to ever hear of a woman knowingly entering the playing field of a very physical sport and putting her unborn child at risk. If that makes me unreasonable, then i am happy to be unreasonable.

 

[Skoob]

Nah mate, I am not. I am pro life, but I respect choice. I just don't want to ever hear of a woman knowingly entering the playing field of a very physical sport and putting her unborn child at risk. If that makes me unreasonable, then i am happy to be unreasonable.

I think that, right there is a very reasonable wish. I think most would agree with that. What many don't agree with is your next step of framing rules around it as if you get a say in it. You see, I would hate to hear of a pregnant woman killing herself and potential unborn child whilst base jumping, however I don't think there should be laws preventing her from participating in that pastime if she so chooses.