Recommitted Brodie Grundy [re-signed until 2020]

[schmuttt]

Max Gawn on current form is absolutely worth 800K imo

 

[Apex36]

Max Gawn on current form is absolutely worth 800K imo

Gawn is the current AA and most dominant ruck in the game though. Grundy is not.

 

[schmuttt]

Gawn is the current AA and most dominant ruck in the game though. Grundy is not.

Not disagreeing with your assessment of Grundy, just saying I do believe the best couple rucks are worth around that valuation.

 

[RedWhite&Blue]

So you're saying you want to pay 2018 Grundy what he'd be worth in 2022? Madness.

Heavily front end the contract and then it tapers off at the end, Doesn't matter when they get the cash as long as they get it by the end of their contract - it's what the dogs did with Tom Boyd.

 

[Apex36]

Heavily front end the contract and then it tapers off at the end, Doesn't matter when they get the cash as long as they get it by the end of their contract - it's what the dogs did with Tom Boyd.

The contention here is for $800k per year, which he's not worth, regardless of a front ended contract. Boyd's contract will still average out to $1m a year regardless of how it's front or back ended, which is ridiculous. You guys should just be thankful that the one good game he's played in his career so far happened to be in a grand final.

 

[Mofra]

The contention here is for $800k per year, which he's not worth, regardless of a front ended contract. Boyd's contract will still average out to $1m a year regardless of how it's front or back ended, which is ridiculous. You guys should just be thankful that the one good game he's played in his career so far happened to be in a grand final.

6m over 7 years is not a 1m per season average, and if you don't meet the minimum 95% salary cap threshold in one year you lose a portion of the non-payment in the subsequent year so it does actually matter if your TPP drops below the mandated minimum.

Additionally, if a club only pays 95% in one year there is a 105% rule in a subsequent year that team can avail of.

Our list management is fine thanks, you've just shelled out $500k pa for Chris Mayne who is only named as an emergency and $600k pa for Wells so you have far more problems in your own backyard than the reigning premiers do, especially considering we have the added bonus of $400-450k of last year's cap being paid for by Essendon (the 2016 portion of Crameri's contract).

 

[Apex36]

6m over 7 years is not a 1m per season average, and if you don't meet the minimum 95% salary cap threshold in one year you lose a portion of the non-payment in the subsequent year so it does actually matter if your TPP drops below the mandated minimum.

Additionally, if a club only pays 95% in one year there is a 105% rule in a subsequent year that team can avail of.

Our list management is fine thanks, you've just shelled out $500k pa for Chris Mayne who is only named as an emergency and $600k pa for Wells so you have far more problems in your own backyard than the reigning premiers do, especially considering we have the added bonus of $400-450k of last year's cap being paid for by Essendon (the 2016 portion of Crameri's contract).

Making up 95% of the cap is poor justification for heavily overpaying for an unproven player, but if it makes you feel better have at it.
As for Mayne and Wells, the numbers you're quoting are high, just as I did for Boyd, but regardless of that, you're right, they were fairly s**t decisions. Unlike dogs fans, I won't sugar coat it or try to justify their contracts by pretending that front loading doesn't end up averaging out to the same $$$.

 

[Mofra]

Making up 95% of the cap is poor justification for heavily overpaying for an unproven player, but if it makes you feel better have at it.

That's your take - and given your ignorance of how the cap works, I'll take it with a grain of salt.
To pay less than 95% of the cap, reducing trade and list flexibility in subsequent years, would be the height of stupidity.

As for Mayne and Wells, the numbers you're quoting are high, just as I did for Boyd, but regardless of that, you're right, they were fairly s**t decisions. Unlike dogs fans, I won't sugar coat it or try to justify their contracts by pretending that front loading doesn't end up averaging out to the same $$$.

Media outlets have stated Mayne is $2m over 4 years, Wells $1.8m over 3 years.

But back to Boyd: No Tom Boyd, no flag. Simple equation. The lack of genuine tall talent stopped us from getting to a GF in our 2008-10 prelim years, we didn't make the same mistake again.

On top of that we've signed virtually every player on our list we wanted to keep. Freo out-bid us for Hamling but they were offering way overs and we picked him up as a DFA from Geelong anyway.

I'll take the premiership over criticism from an anonymous internet alias any day of the week.

 

[Apex36]

That's your take - and given your ignorance of how the cap works, I'll take it with a grain of salt.
To pay less than 95% of the cap, reducing trade and list flexibility in subsequent years, would be the height of stupidity.

I'm perfectly aware of how the cap works smartarse. I'm also very aware that there are other ways to reach the minimum threshold without paying an unproven 9 game player close to $1m a year on a super long term contract. You don't seem to be. Thats cool though.

Media outlets have stated Mayne is $2m over 4 years, Wells $1.8m over 3 years.

Media outlets have also said Mayne $1.8m over four and Wells $1.65 over 3 with the third having triggers, but everyone likes to grab and hold on to the highest number they can. As for me, I prefer to talk to people in the know in regards to my clubs dealings rather than relying on media designed to get clicks.

But back to Boyd: No Tom Boyd, no flag. Simple equation. The lack of genuine tall talent stopped us from getting to a GF in our 2008-10 prelim years, we didn't make the same mistake again.

On top of that we've signed virtually every player on our list we wanted to keep. Freo out-bid us for Hamling but they were offering way overs and we picked him up as a DFA from Geelong anyway.

I'll take the premiership over criticism from an anonymous internet alias any day of the week.

Dunno if you missed it, but I already mentioned that Boyd's only good game of his career happened to be in the GF. Congrats, you guys lucked out there. Enjoy the flag, it's a good feeling.

 

[loki04]

I'm perfectly aware of how the cap works smartarse. I'm also very aware that there are other ways to reach the minimum threshold without paying an unproven 9 game player close to $1m a year on a super long term contract. You don't seem to be. Thats cool though.


Media outlets have also said Mayne $1.8m over four and Wells $1.65 over 3 with the third having triggers, but everyone likes to grab and hold on to the highest number they can. As for me, I prefer to talk to people in the know in regards to my clubs dealings rather than relying on media designed to get clicks.

Dunno if you missed it, but I already mentioned that Boyd's only good game of his career happened to be in the GF. Congrats, you guys lucked out there. Enjoy the flag, it's a good feeling.

They have? never seen that personally can you show me the link to the article in reference.

 

[Scotland]

$1m p.a. for Chris Mayne and Daniel Wells. Oh deary me.

 

[adammania9]

Yet another thread that has drifted off to a Mayne/Wells deal discussion. Incredible.

 

[citizen-erased]

Yet another thread that has drifted off to a Mayne/Wells deal discussion. Incredible.

yep. lets keep it on topic.

Tom Boyd - just under a mil a year
Gawn - worth approx 800k a year, but not out of contract
Grundy - not quite Gawn, but he is unique in that he can play as an extra mid. Out of contract.

A few more rounds of the ban on 3rd man up will make this interesting, as your out and out ruck may just become a little more valuable.
Essendon got decent enough service from McKernan & Daniher, but up against McEvoy and Vickery. Not much of a sample yet.

I didn't see Collingwood's game on Friday, but im going thursday. interested to see how he goes and if my assessment of him being a top 3 out of contract commodity this year stands.

 

[Schraderbrau]

But back to Boyd: No Tom Boyd, no flag. Simple equation. The lack of genuine tall talent stopped us from getting to a GF in our 2008-10 prelim years, we didn't make the same mistake again.

On top of that we've signed virtually every player on our list we wanted to keep. Freo out-bid us for Hamling but they were offering way overs and we picked him up as a DFA from Geelong anyway.

I'll take the premiership over criticism from an anonymous internet alias any day of the week.

That's a slight exaggeration imo. You were a way of Collingwood and Geelong in those years.

As for Boyd, he paid for himself last September. Whatever he does from here on in is a bonus imo

 

[TradeDraft]

Yet another thread that has drifted off to a Mayne/Wells deal discussion. Incredible.

and Collingwood Bashing What a Shocker

 

[Mofra]

That's a slight exaggeration imo. You were a way of Collingwood and Geelong in those years.

As for Boyd, he paid for himself last September. Whatever he does from here on in is a bonus imo

We were 7 points away in 2009, with Brad 183cm Johnson and Mitch 188cm Hahn as our marking targets. We desperately lacked the get-out kick under pressure in those years.

As an aside, quite a few of us on the Bulldogs board thought we were thin on the list for mature ruckmen with only Roughy and Campbell as genuine no 1 rucks (plus English developing but is a few years away) - Boyd's shoe-horned into the role but we saw last Friday what happens to part-timers against genuine no 1 rucks like Grundy. I expect the new ruck rules make the top 5-10 ruckmen in the comp far more valuable.

 

[Julia#13]

I think the bottom line is, right now Grundy is not worth 800,000. If he continues to develop and reach Gawn's level, then he will be worth it. The best thing to do for Grundy and Collingwood right now is to sign a two year deal at 600,000, prove he's the best ruckman in the comp and sign his next deal with a hefty increase. They can even work in triggers in this new contract for bonuses like top 5 in b/f and making all-australian 40 squad.

 

[Schraderbrau]

We were 7 points away in 2009, with Brad 183cm Johnson and Mitch 188cm Hahn as our marking targets. We desperately lacked the get-out kick under pressure in those years.

As an aside, quite a few of us on the Bulldogs board thought we were thin on the list for mature ruckmen with only Roughy and Campbell as genuine no 1 rucks (plus English developing but is a few years away) - Boyd's shoe-horned into the role but we saw last Friday what happens to part-timers against genuine no 1 rucks like Grundy. I expect the new ruck rules make the top 5-10 ruckmen in the comp far more valuable.

English will be a gun in a few years so at least your set in that respect.

 

[citizen-erased]

I think the bottom line is, right now Grundy is not worth 800,000. If he continues to develop and reach Gawn's level, then he will be worth it. The best thing to do for Grundy and Collingwood right now is to sign a two year deal at 600,000, prove he's the best ruckman in the comp and sign his next deal with a hefty increase. They can even work in triggers in this new contract for bonuses like top 5 in b/f and making all-australian 40 squad.

If Collingwood offered him 600k, and a club like Essendon offered 750k, why not move?
was pretty good tonight too.

 

[captain cotch 9]

and Collingwood Bashing What a Shocker

Sit down Eddie

 

[Herne Hill Hammer]

Brodie Grundy is good but 1M or near that is reserved for the best of the best ruckmen, (Cox, Nic Nat, Sandi) And Grundy hasn't yet shown he'll be in the best 5 ruckman in the comp yet IMO.

You'd have to pay that money to pry him loose. What's the point in leaving for the same money and all of the expense and hassle that goes with it. You have to make it worth someone's while.

 

[Herne Hill Hammer]

Yeah I completely disagree. I think that's how you can ruin a list, On potential he's still not close to a million a year. Here are a list of the recent players from memory, who have been on 1m per year.
Fyfe
Sandilands
Pavlich
Riewoldt
Franklin
Ablett
Nic Nat
Johnno Brown
Judd
Tom Boyd
Tom Scully
Now besides Boyd and Scully, does Grundy belong with the rest of the names? IMO No. Best of the best make that kind of coin besides very strange situations (Boyd and Scully).

Ablett, Judd, Franklin, Boyd and Scully all had to leave to get that money.

 

[Moist Biscuit]

You'd have to pay that money to pry him loose. What's the point in leaving for the same money and all of the expense and hassle that goes with it. You have to make it worth someone's while.

Success? Not all players are motivated by dollars. Still not worth 800k and there's nobody who can convince me otherwise. Not many ruckmen get that kind of money so usually you need a big point of difference.

 

[Moist Biscuit]

Ablett, Judd, Franklin, Boyd and Scully all had to leave to get that money.

You're misinterpreting my post. I'm saying compared to the other players he's not close to deserving 800k per year. You're all ludicrous if you would offer him that.

 

[Moist Biscuit]

and Collingwood Bashing What a Shocker

Cry me a river.