Traded Bryce Gibbs [traded to Adelaide] - (cont. in Part 2)

[Kane McGoodwin]

I'll say it one more time:
- Carlton was negotiating with GWS for Marchbank
- They wanted a 2016 first round pick, but we wouldn't give them 5
- We knew Touhy was leaving and we were trying to package him up to get a first for gws
- Reids announcement to the press convinced GWS that we would trade Gibbs and sabotaged the agreement we had, because they were holding out for that pick which would be better than anything Geelong could offer.

It's not about being upset or holding a grudge (which is how you've tried to twist my comments), it's that the announcement actually diminished the value in the trade as we would simply have to pass those picks elsewhere instead of the more favourable deal we had structured. This is evidenced by the fact that the gws deal didn't go through until gws knew for sure you guys weren't trading for Gibbs.

Funnily enough I thought we had gone through all this on your team board after the trade, and stumbled upon your posts agreeing with my point.

I agree Reid shouldn't have come out & made a media statement before anything had been agreed... but it is a big stretch to say this stopped the trade that would have otherwise occurred.

Imo, it didn't occur because SOS values Gibbs higher than the Crows do... Which is fine.

 

[slashin_velvet]

I agree Reid shouldn't have come out & made a media statement before anything had been agreed... but it is a big stretch to say this stopped the trade that would have otherwise occurred.

Imo, it didn't occur because SOS values Gibbs higher than the Crows do... Which is fine.

I'm not saying it stopped the trade specifically - I'm saying it increased our asking price to make up for the damage of announcing it early - and you weren't prepared to meet that increased value.

 

[marty36]

I'm not saying it stopped the trade specifically - I'm saying it increased our asking price to make up for the damage of announcing it early - and you weren't prepared to meet that increased value.

Made no difference carlton always wanted overs Adealide werent prepared to pay it, Port could have had a crack if they wanted and I have no doubt they would have investigated the posibility as Gibbs wanted to live in adaelide and Port didnt pursue it either. Simple facts are Carlton wanted too much for what Adealide or Port would have been prepared to pay

 

[1990crow]

A pick 15 player with no guarantee of making it or Gibbs? At this point I would say Gibbs undoubtedly. Emma Quayle hit it on the head when she cautioned that going too young too fast can stifle a developing list. Gibbs is one of our most consistent and durable players and one of our best and most important too. He's a leader of the club and we have no ready replacement. His loss could have caused big headaches for Carlton moving forward. At least now the club has time to plan and younger players have a year longer to develop without the immediate stress of Gibbs' sudden loss falling on their shoulders.



He doesn't have the option to "walk". He's under contract for the upcoming season, the season after that and the season after that. You can offer whatever you like, but if Carlton decide they're better off with Gibbs than what you offer, he'll happily stay at the Blues just like last time.

Wouldn't that damage the club culture to hold a player that doesn't really want to be there for two seasons?

 

[slashin_velvet]

Wouldn't that damage the club culture to hold a player that doesn't really want to be there for two seasons?

Only if the player is desperate to leave. Even then - didn't hamper GWS having McCarthy sit out the year. This doesn't appear to be the case with Gibbs who has been incredibly professional since returning to the club.

 

[Monkey King]

Wouldn't that damage the club culture to hold a player that doesn't really want to be there for two seasons?

You're mistakenly thinking that this is leverage in the Gibbs situation. The whole "they'll take what we give em or the player walks" thing just isn't going to work here, as evidenced by what eventuated last trade period. According to all reports, Gibbs is happy as Larry at Carlton, despite having a preference to live closer to family. If this is what you're after, then as I said, probably better to focus your attention on uncontracted players.

 

[Monkey King]

I agree taking the heat of players is a debate on why Gibbs should have been kept but not mentoring, if you want a mentor for the players, Gibbs isnt your man ...

Gibbs was VC after Murphy went down last year and during the season Bolton spoke of his value as an onfiled extension of the coaching panel. Pavlich couldn't replace that. We just don't have enough of these blokes at the Blues, so regardless of how you rate him in this area, it definitely contributes to the reason Carlton didn't want to let him go.

 

[marty36]

You're mistakenly thinking that this is leverage in the Gibbs situation. The whole "they'll take what we give em or the player walks" thing just isn't going to work here, as evidenced by what eventuated last trade period. According to all reports, Gibbs is happy as Larry at Carlton, despite having a preference to live closer to family. If this is what you're after, then as I said, probably better to focus your attention on uncontracted players.

Unless they come a knocking like gibbsy did

 

[Elite Crow]

I guess the exact same question needs to be asked by crows supporters.

For us, potentially both could have an equivalent impact. Gibbs could help our next premiership by guiding our youth and being a mentor, also relieving pressure on young kids new to the game.

A high end first round pick (top 5ish) would probably help get us closer, but a pick closer to 15 in one of the more even drafts, not so sure. Doedee or Gallucci aren't players I'd be saying are any more of a certainty to drag a team into contention.

A pick 15 player with no guarantee of making it or Gibbs? At this point I would say Gibbs undoubtedly. Emma Quayle hit it on the head when she cautioned that going too young too fast can stifle a developing list. Gibbs is one of our most consistent and durable players and one of our best and most important too. He's a leader of the club and we have no ready replacement. His loss could have caused big headaches for Carlton moving forward. At least now the club has time to plan and younger players have a year longer to develop without the immediate stress of Gibbs' sudden loss falling on their shoulders.



He doesn't have the option to "walk". He's under contract for the upcoming season, the season after that and the season after that. You can offer whatever you like, but if Carlton decide they're better off with Gibbs than what you offer, he'll happily stay at the Blues just like last time.

What if that pick 15 was a Talia, Smith or a Lever?

As for Doedee, Milera and Gallucci, too early to say but lets talk again at the end of the year.

You guys dont seem to have much faith in your drafting team.

 

[slashin_velvet]

Unless they come a knocking like gibbsy did

Pretty sure his father came out and said you guys had been in his ear all year, and he decided late in the year it was the right move to make if they could get it to work. It was made clear to Adelaide that we would only move on a contracted player for a trade that favored us. You didn't want to, and tried to pressure us into buckling under media pressure. Clearly a poor judgment of character and the situation. Reid tried on the big boy panties and wet himself.

 

[slashin_velvet]

You guys dont seem to have much faith in your drafting team.

Why would we? Have you seen our list? We've had years of missed draft selections - and found ourselves at the bottom of the ladder. Whilst I'm hopeful our new recruiting team does a better job, there's simply not enough information to draw any reasonable conclusions.

Funnily enough, the three players you listed as "what ifs" for pick 15, were not available at pick 15 in their respective drafts. All went at 13 or 14. This years draft was more level than many of those before it, so a lower pick holds even less value. I don't think its as cut and dry as Adelaide supporters on here wish it was - and its clear many of your own clubs supporters were disappointed they you didn't pay overs to get Gibbs.

 

[marty36]

Pretty sure his father came out and said you guys had been in his ear all year, and he decided late in the year it was the right move to make if they could get it to work. It was made clear to Adelaide that we would only move on a contracted player for a trade that favored us. You didn't want to, and tried to pressure us into buckling under media pressure. Clearly a poor judgment of character and the situation. Reid tried on the big boy panties and wet himself.

Gibbs isnt 8 years old, I cant believe you are saying its Mummy and Daddy who orchestrated the whole thing, youre dellusional

 

[Monkey King]

What if that pick 15 was a Talia, Smith or a Lever?

Yes. Even if that. Talia and Lever have both had senior guys around them as they develop. Not much point filling a side with young guys and then throwing them to the wolves without much senior support. Even if that draft pick does work out okay, you might risk screwing up a player like Cripps along the way, leaving him to shoulder too much of a load and him suffering for it of and deciding to bail back to WA.

And then there's the actual reality of a pick 15. Most first round picks don't make it. That's just a fact. So it could really go either way and I wouldn't back any recruiter to guarantee that a pick 15 will land that kind of quality every draft. So yeah, it could be a Cripps, but it could be a Seb Tape. On the balance of the whole, a bird in the hand is far too compelling.

 

[Elite Crow]

Why would we? Have you seen our list? We've had years of missed draft selections - and found ourselves at the bottom of the ladder. Whilst I'm hopeful our new recruiting team does a better job, there's simply not enough information to draw any reasonable conclusions.

Funnily enough, the three players you listed as "what ifs" for pick 15, were not available at pick 15 in their respective drafts. All went at 13 or 14. This years draft was more level than many of those before it, so a lower pick holds even less value. I don't think its as cut and dry as Adelaide supporters on here wish it was - and its clear many of your own clubs supporters were disappointed they you didn't pay overs to get Gibbs.

You really are splitting hairs there, 13,14,15. There were no academy picks back then either.

So pick 15 could have picked up a pick 10 equivalent player if you're using that angle.

 

[Monkey King]

Gibbs isnt 8 years old, I cant believe you are saying its Mummy and Daddy who orchestrated the whole thing, youre dellusional

Lol. You should re-read that post more carefully and edit yours.

 

[slashin_velvet]

Gibbs isnt 8 years old, I cant believe you are saying its Mummy and Daddy who orchestrated the whole thing, youre dellusional

Lolwut?

 

[marty36]

Lolwut?

why write crap on what ross Gibbs said

http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/sport...s/news-story/0fe4cd0b94e65ec5f39b189acdfc5e76

Didnt say at all the crows were in his ear?

 

[Monkey King]

Honestly, I'd be hoping that we'd have a strong enough culture to pull the likes of Rockliff into line (which I think we do at present). That said, he doesn't seem as bad as, say, a Dustin Martin, and I think he'd only improve us. Trengove I'm really not sure about, I don't know if he can get back to his best form with the injuries he's had. What we need is a proven star (one that is uncontracted, too). Whether the AFC sees that as a need is a different story.

Yeah Trengove sure doesn't fit the proven star catagorey but it would be a cheap shot at a player who may deliver in spades. Then again, as you say, his body might hold him back from ever recapturing the potential he showed early and you blokes need someone to step in and contribute quality midfield football from season one. It's tough coz there's not a lot out there who fit the bill. Fyfe perhaps.

But if you think Rockliff would fit in well, then yeah, he's probably your best upcoming option.

 

[slashin_velvet]

why write crap on what ross Gibbs said

http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/sport...s/news-story/0fe4cd0b94e65ec5f39b189acdfc5e76

Didnt say at all the crows were in his ear?

"The Crows have had a couple of cracks at Bryce before and haven’t quite got it right and they went harder this time so there was genuine hope that he would be able to come home."

How do you "go harder" for a player, and in the same breath suggest they came to you without any persuasion?

As Trigg had said of Betts - you guys had him "stitched up" 18 months before he was a free agent. Every club does it, and you guys have form on the public record.

 

[marty36]

"The Crows have had a couple of cracks at Bryce before and haven’t quite got it right and they went harder this time so there was genuine hope that he would be able to come home."

How do you "go harder" for a player, and in the same breath suggest they came to you without any persuasion?

As Trigg had said of Betts - you guys had him "stitched up" 18 months before he was a free agent. Every club does it, and you guys have form on the public record.

So your talking crap, they ""went hard" with an offer obviously not hard eough!

Bryce advised he wanted to come to Adelaide, not Adelaide approached Gibbs, are you saying this isnt correct and Gibbs Lied that infact we went after him, although Gibbs has contradicted that?

In that article that Rosco clearly states he wanted to come to adelaide for family reasons, not Adelaide chased him?

There is your direct quote from his dad so where is your BS from

 

[marty36]

"The Crows have had a couple of cracks at Bryce before and haven’t quite got it right and they went harder this time so there was genuine hope that he would be able to come home."

How do you "go harder" for a player, and in the same breath suggest they came to you without any persuasion?

As Trigg had said of Betts - you guys had him "stitched up" 18 months before he was a free agent. Every club does it, and you guys have form on the public record.

And yes we saw who was coming out as an FA, what club doesnt, if carlton dont they are incompetent and may explain a few things

 

[slashin_velvet]

So your talking crap, they ""went hard" with an offer obviously not hard eough!

Bryce advised he wanted to come to Adelaide, not Adelaide approached Gibbs, are you saying this isnt correct and Gibbs Lied that infact we went after him, although Gibbs has contradicted that?

In that article that Rosco clearly states he wanted to come to adelaide for family reasons, not Adelaide chased him?

There is your direct quote from his dad so where is your BS from

Your offer to Gibbs was hard enough because he clearly decided he would move to your club....but you gooses didn't look at the whole picture before opening your mouths.

Bryce advised that he decided to return to Adelaide, but Ross made it clear that Adelaide had made numerous attempts at him in the past - and went "harder" at him this time. Maybe were both interpreting Ross' words in a way that makes sense to our opinion of the situation, but to me, Ross is saying publically that Adelaide pursued Bryce - and that it wasn't a last minute drop on their doorstep situation.

 

[marty36]

Your offer to Gibbs was hard enough because he clearly decided he would move to your club....but you gooses didn't look at the whole picture before opening your mouths.

Bryce advised that he decided to return to Adelaide, but Ross made it clear that Adelaide had made numerous attempts at him in the past - and went "harder" at him this time. Maybe were both interpreting Ross' words in a way that makes sense to our opinion of the situation, but to me, Ross is saying publically that Adelaide pursued Bryce - and that it wasn't a last minute drop on their doorstep situation.

Its pretty damn clear, how are we reading into the fact Bryce wants to return to Adelaide, He has said it, Ross has said it, Carlton said it , Adelaide said it. How isnt that clear, there has been zero, no , zippo suggesting by anyone that Adelaide chased gibbs. You reading into the fact Adelaide harder after gibbs in terms of maybe agreeing to terms or offering up a first rounder is laughable.

Every party involved has clearly stated why Gibbs wanted to come to Adelaide and not one has said we approached him.

 

[Monkey King]

Every party involved has clearly stated why Gibbs wanted to come to Adelaide and not one has said we approached him.

Actually Ross Gibbs did say you'd had a couple of cracks at him before. I think you're being a little naive to think Gibbs just called the Crows out of the blue having never been approached. And nothing I've read discounts the possibility; just that Gibbs informed the Crows of his actual willingness to request a move at the 11th hour. You really think that this is the first time the two parties ever discussed the possibility?

 

[slashin_velvet]

Every party involved has clearly stated why Gibbs wanted to come to Adelaide and not one has said we approached him.

In the article you linked to, Ross (the guy I referred to originally) is quoted as saying that Adelaide had "had cracks at him in the past" and "went harder" this time.

No dispute Gibbs decided he wanted to return to South Australia. What's less clear to me who initiated the idea of Gibbs moving to Adelaide. If it was purely a genuine need to return to SA, he would have nominated both SA teams. Instead he elected the club that his father has stated as "having a crack" at him in the past. Maybe I'm wearing blue coloured glasses.