Buckley's Trading

[doppleganger]

Dawes draws a key defender away from Hogan though

Cam Pederson finished higher in Melbourne's BnF last year than Dawes.

What did the Dees give to get Pederson? Im sure they aren't paying him 500K+ like the Dees are paying Dawes. Offloading Dawes when he actually had value was genius.

 

[Cousin of Daicos]

Bucks is pretty much the opposite of Mick.

Micks drafting via picks was deplorable, but his trading of players was pretty damn good. Bucks is doing an absolutely mind boggling job with draft picks and ATTAINING top draft picks we have no right to, but his bringing in of players from other clubs has been woeful.

Eh, you take the good with the bad. Long term, Bucks' way is better.

 

[soreplums]

Bucks is pretty much the opposite of Mick.

Micks drafting via picks was deplorable, but his trading of players was pretty damn good. Bucks is doing an absolutely mind boggling job with draft picks and ATTAINING top draft picks we have no right to, but his bringing in of players from other clubs has been woeful.

Eh, you take the good with the bad. Long term, Bucks' way is better.

I don't think MM brought in a heap of quality players. Ball and Jolly yes, but there were many flops that cost us in what we gave up. Jordan Lewis would be handy for us

 

[September Action]

You can but it would be completly pointelss and meaningless.

I guess I was alluding to the notion that the trades, which at the time looked quite scary, ALREADY look ok. Without even factoring the potential future upside. Is that ok, Timmy...?

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

I guess I was alluding to the notion that the trades, which at the time looked quite scary, ALREADY look ok. Without even factoring the potential future upside. Is that ok, Timmy...?

Fair enough although I never had an issue with any of them personally. We are attempting to rebuild on the run and have been doing that even before Bucks took over. There has been massive list turnover since the day after we won the flag in 2010. We are just about there now and now the improvement will be more incremental and organic....perhaps one big scalp recruit next year as icing on the cake.

One of the benefits of being a premiership side or regular finals side is the trade value of your players. Sell them while they are at maximum value while you can if they are not part of your plans. Malthouse did it with Tarrant and others, Bucks is doing the same. StKilda failed to do it. The only exceptions are Thomas and Beams who walked, but the argument is the same. The loss doesnt hurt if you get good trade value from them. Who you draft is always scary but as they say in the classics, In Hine We Trust.

 

[Cousin of Daicos]

I don't think MM brought in a heap of quality players. Ball and Jolly yes, but there were many flops that cost us in what we gave up. Jordan Lewis would be handy for us

Clement? Medhurst? Brown?

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

I don't think MM brought in a heap of quality players. Ball and Jolly yes, but there were many flops that cost us in what we gave up. Jordan Lewis would be handy for us

We would have taken Egan with our pick regardless. Its a myth that it was a trading mistake. It was a drafting mistake. Pre Hine.

 

[Baltimore Jack]

Clement? Medhurst? Brown?

Licuria, Holland

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Clement? Medhurst? Brown?

Brown was pure luck. He fell into our laps with a third round draft pick. Its ridiculous that a versatile tall former top ten draftee with 170 games and no injuries to his name, no off field issues, and still only 27 years old, would be available that late in the draft.

The last freebie as good as that in the draft was when Malthouse gifted Sav Rocca to North the same way. Maybe they were returning the favour.

 

[Maggie5]

I am really interested is it Hine or the coach?
Does say a Hine go to the coach and say, look these are they players I think would be a good fit and then the coach say, we have gaps in these areas and then they both go through the lists. Who then would have the final say?
Or does the coach say, I need this, this and this, go find them?

As to who is the better at trading, the only way you can really say is to look at the first two years of both coaches so far.

Buck's record to date hasn't been the best IMO.

 

[BradE]

Here is some other food for thought re Dale Thomas and Carltank......
They bought DT for 700K as season to do nothing but lost Eddie Betts to Adelaide as they could no longer afford to match his offer for nothing. Eddie Betts has been far more use than DT and they could certainly use him now up forward. If they had not bought DT they would have had the option of keeping Eddie or at the very least being compensated with an early 2nd round pick for him (which they lost because they brought in a free agent in DT). So in effect losing DT not only gave us either Freeman or Scharenberg (depending on how you look at it) and saved us 700K but it also essentially stuffed Carltank royally!!!! I say we win big time on this!!!!

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

I am really interested is it Hine or the coach?
Does say a Hine go to the coach and say, look these are they players I think would be a good fit and then the coach say, we have gaps in these areas and then they both go through the lists. Who then would have the final say?
Or does the coach say, I need this, this and this, go find them?

As to who is the better at trading, the only way you can really say is to look at the first two years of both coaches so far.

Buck's record to date hasn't been the best IMO.

Bucks has a bit of catching up do do obviously but flags arent easy to win. Hes only one bounce of the ball from being equal on zero flags with Malthouse. Our depth is as good as its ever been. What we dont have compared to Malthouse is the top end quality. That will come as our young talent gets another 20-40 games under their belts. OUr oldest player just turned 31, the next two oldest are only 28-29 and both are fringe players (Young and Dwyer)

As for talent identification I'd say the committee decides what they need across the list both for immediate and long term, and Hine does the finding and has a large say in the choosing.

 

[Maggie5]

Bucks has a bit of catching up do do obviously but flags arent easy to win. Hes only one bounce of the ball from being equal on zero flags with Malthouse. Our depth is as good as its ever been. What we dont have compared to Malthouse is the top end quality. That will come as our young talent gets another 20-40 games under their belts.

As for talent identification I'd say the committee decides what they need across the list both for immediate and long term, and Hine does the finding and has a large say in the choosing.

Wasn't a criticism, merely a question as I can't recall the trading of names MM traded in his first two years.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Wasn't a criticism, merely a question as I can't recall the trading of names MM traded in his first two years.

I might be wrong but one of his first mistakes from memoery was trading Michael for Molloy

 

[Maggie5]

I might be wrong but one of his first mistakes from memoery was trading Michael for Molloy

Could be right but Michaels was going anyway wasn't he, wanted to leave?
Hopefully, someone that follows it a bit more could help as am really interested.

 

[soreplums]

Clement? Medhurst? Brown?

Tick, tick. Brown was drafted

 

[soreplums]

Licuria became a very good player for us and Holland did well too. But for every good player traded in was a Chad rintoul, Chad morrison, Andrew Williams, Steve McKee etc. plus also need to look at who we traded out for these players.

Hindsight is a beautiful thing, but I would have been really happy to take Ryan O'Keefe for Nick Davis when we had the chance

 

[ace andy]

We would have taken Egan with our pick regardless. Its a myth that it was a trading mistake. It was a drafting mistake. Pre Hine.

Hine drafted Egan

 

[ace andy]

I might be wrong but one of his first mistakes from memoery was trading Michael for Molloy

Yep. I think there may have been minor draft picks swapped as well. Can't remember if Mal wanted out though or if Collingwood wanted to part ways due to his party ways and influence on Tarrant.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Yep. I think there may have been minor draft picks swapped as well. Can't remember if Mal wanted out though or if Collingwood wanted to part ways due to his party ways and influence on Tarrant.

There was a lot of the latter.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Hine drafted Egan

OK I',m mistaken then. Regardless it was a drafting error not a trading error. We got our man. It was just the wrong man.

 

[si tacuisses]

Licuria became a very good player for us and Holland did well too. But for every good player traded in was a Chad rintoul, Chad morrison, Andrew Williams, Steve McKee etc. plus also need to look at who we traded out for these players.

Hindsight is a beautiful thing, but I would have been really happy to take Ryan O'Keefe for Nick Davis when we had the chance

And on Malthouse trading for players, let us not forget: pick 12 for Cameron Wood.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

And on Malthouse trading for players, let us not forget: pick 12 for Cameron Wood.

No problems with that decision. We needed to pay up to get a ruckman to assist Fraser at the time. Didnt work out but the strategy was sound. The next year Leroy landed in our laps and then Malthouse after being put on death row bought exactly what we needed.....Jolly (and Ball).

Three years running we looked for ruckmen. Bad, better, best. Third time lucky!

 

[ksardog]

I would hav thought the recruiter would hav the major say on who we draft

The coach would hav the major say on who we trade in our out.

 

[ksardog]

No problems with that decision. We needed to pay up to get a ruckman to assist Fraser at the time. Didnt work out but the strategy was sound. The next year Leroy landed in our laps and then Malthouse after being put on death row bought exactly what we needed.....Jolly (and Ball).

Three years running we looked for ruckmen. Bad, better, best. Third time lucky!

Exactly, its all well and good saying get him, but the fact is that player has to be available and then we hav to satisfy the other club in what we offer them. Its far easier if u r finishing at the bottom of the ladder to offer early draft picks.