Rumour Buddy to retire at seasons end?

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Mitchell Madness

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Not only that but my understanding of the rules at the time is if he retires then all of the remaining contract has to be accounted for in the following year's cap. He is due something like $1.4m in 2020, $1.5m in 2021 and $1m in 2022. So if he retired at the end of this year he would be taking up nearly $4m of next year's cap space which would leave the Swans in deep deep do do, basically unable to field a team. They would be forced to keep him on the list for the last 3 years and then the contract could be spread normally over 3 years of cap space - this however would mean he is tying up a list space without playing.
The club is allowed to reduce contract length, but all money must be paid. Won't allow an extension to reduce pressure though
 

Damon_3388

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I would hope for Sydney's sake that Buddy's deal was structured something like this:

2014 - $1,750,000.00
2015 - $1,750,000.00
2016 - $1,750,000.00
2017 - $1,000,000.00
2018 - $1,000,000.00
2019 - $1,000,000.00
2020 - $750,000.00
2021 - $500,000.00
2022 - $500,000.00

It'd still be a cap hit, but obviously less than $1M/year for the next few.

Also, do we know for sure that the $10M/9 years was base, or base plus incentives and some match payments? Would be very different if it turns out the Swans aren't actually on the hook for the full $10M unless he plays and plays well.

I'd like to see Buddy play on. Obviously I don't think he's got another three seasons in him (and he's already had two years in Sydney ruined by health issues - 2015 and 2019 - and played underdone throughout another - 2018), but I'd like to see him have a big preseason and get himself down to like 95-96kg and see if that helps his mobility/longevity and extends his career like a similar change did for Nick Riewoldt and Matthew Richardson.
 
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Wesley2

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Sorry man but you're just wrong.

It's about the contract duration and salary for any given player. Not how a player came to another club
How a player came to a club is 100% relevant in the case of restricted free agency.


• "An explicit acknowledgement that the long-term specific financial commitment over the nine-year agreement will apply to the Swans' total player payments for each of the nine years, regardless of how many years Franklin is available to play for the club."

As I've mentioned, the length of the deal allowed you distinct (and fair) advantages. By offering such a large deal, knowing any club would struggle to match (and if they did match and Buddy chose to remain, HFC would be under the exact conditions as above) they circumvented the part of restricted free agency where they would be liable to trade for 2014 Buddy Franklin. This would be a considerable price, meaning they would have to trade capital for him, made all the more difficult knowing they still want to bid on Callum Mills.

But their offer got them around it, their list stayed intact, gained Franklin and pick 3 in Mills.

You cannot have that advantage and then just throw your hands in the air and walk away from the restricted free agency deal and it's obligations because it's suddenly gotten very scary. It would be the end of free agency as clubs would be offering 15 million contracts to stars and changing the deals as they see fit a few years later, with no consequence.
 
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Damon_3388

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Obviously it will limit who Sydney can bring in, but the cap hit for Buddy's contract might actually be a blessing in disguise. The Swans will have Kurt Tippett's contract, plus Jarred McVeigh, Kieren Jack and Heath Grundy coming off the books at the end of the year. If they play on/are retained, Daniel Menzel and Nick Smith could be coming off as well. That frees up a lot of room, without anyone to necessarily pay it to (the only out-of-contract youngsters they have that would likely be getting a decent payrise would be Zak Jones and Ryan Clarke), so to meet the salary cap floor while they have a young list, Buddy's contract may help without the need to overpay youngsters or MOR recycled players.
 

kranky al

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How a player came to a club is 100% relevant in the case of restricted free agency.


• "An explicit acknowledgement that the long-term specific financial commitment over the nine-year agreement will apply to the Swans' total player payments for each of the nine years, regardless of how many years Franklin is available to play for the club."

As I've mentioned, the length of the deal allowed you distinct (and fair) advantages. By offering such a large deal, knowing any club would struggle to match (and if they did match and Buddy chose to remain, HFC would be under the exact conditions as above) they circumvented the part of restricted free agency where they would be liable to trade for 2014 Buddy Franklin. This would be a considerable price, meaning they would have to trade capital for him, made all the more difficult knowing they still want to bid on Callum Mills.

But their offer got them around it, their list stayed intact, gained Franklin and pick 3 in Mills.

You cannot have that advantage and then just throw your hands in the air and walk away from the restricted free agency deal and it's obligations because it's suddenly gotten very scary. It would be the end of free agency as clubs would be offering 15 million contracts to stars and changing the deals as they see fit a few years later, with no consequence.
There is a consequence but isnt there - one player holds that club to the deal and they are fwarked for ten years
 

Wesley2

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There is a consequence but isnt there - one player holds that club to the deal and they are fwarked for ten years
It's not the player holding the club to the deal, it's restricted free agency.

If the consequence of a single deal is enough to make a club "fwarked for ten years" maybe an option would be NOT make the offer? Make the offer something more manageable? You'd risk losing the player or trading for them but it's also not the end of the world. You'd have 10 million dollars in the cap, or an elite player minus some other players/picks.
 

ScottBo

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Hawks supporters have a Stalin-like knack for rewriting history. The repeated suggestion he left Hawthorn just to win premierships? They make it sound like he left a struggling bottom of the table team to join the premiers. Hello, if that had been his sole plan surely he would've stayed with the top of the table team he'd just won one with? He went to Sydney to be with his then girlfriend, get out of the fishbowl. He might've said he wanted to win one there, but it would've been a by-product of all the other factors.

I saw Franklin at training on Thursday. He was running at full tilt, pinging them from 60. As I said on our board, if we were still in the hunt for finals I believe he would've played. If he's retiring in a few weeks -- and I don't -- it doesn't appear to be because of his body. Which is first hand evidence, unlike anything the op has produced.
 

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Blackhawk42

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Hawks supporters have a Stalin-like knack for rewriting history. The repeated suggestion he left Hawthorn just to win premierships? They make it sound like he left a struggling bottom of the table team to join the premiers. Hello, if that had been his sole plan surely he would've stayed with the top of the table team he'd just won one with? He went to Sydney to be with his then girlfriend, get out of the fishbowl. He might've said he wanted to win one there, but it would've been a by-product of all the other factors.
I'm pretty sure he was quoted at the time of saying he chose Sydney over GWS because he wanted success straight away.
The irony in that was GWS beating Sydney in the first game he played in Swans colours.

Hawthorn fans wouldn't have cared if he left for GWS. We were mad because he left to chase success instead by did so by joining our second biggest rivals at the time.
 

Punts

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I'm pretty sure he was quoted at the time of saying he chose Sydney over GWS because he wanted success straight away.
The irony in that was GWS beating Sydney in the first game he played in Swans colours.

Hawthorn fans wouldn't have cared if he left for GWS. We were mad because he left to chase success instead by did so by joining our second biggest rivals at the time.
He didn’t leave for success, he had plenty of it with you guys.

Of course he was going to choose us first because we were still there abouts and had a chance with finals etc

The sole reason was his partner and that’s the fact
 

Blackhawk42

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He didn’t leave for success, he had plenty of it with you guys.

Of course he was going to choose us first because we were still there abouts and had a chance with finals etc

The sole reason was his partner and that’s the fact
He asked about going to Sydney instead of GWS after the 2012 grand final.
Also, GWS is still in Sydney. He 100% chose the Swans to chase immediate success.
 

Corpuscles

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I saw Franklin at training on Thursday. He was running at full tilt, pinging them from 60. As I said on our board, if we were still in the hunt for finals I believe he would've played. If he's retiring in a few weeks -- and I don't -- it doesn't appear to be because of his body. Which is first hand evidence, unlike anything the op has produced.

NO! That is not how you do it!

You were supposed to say something like, you heard someone say (have to check who it exactly was as a "sauce") that he was smashed drunk at training and heard Buddy say something about pulling the pin!

THEN, it all becomes believable!

Go the Dees!
 

Hawk Dork

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Hawks supporters have a Stalin-like knack for rewriting history. The repeated suggestion he left Hawthorn just to win premierships?
Superstar Sydney recruit Lance Franklin says he left Hawthorn to chase more premierships
Neil Cordy, staff writers, News Corp Australia Network
October 9, 2013 4:21pm
LANCE Franklin says he didn't join Sydney to escape the Melbourne "fishbowl".
Speaking at the SCG as he was paraded in red and white for the first time, the new Sydney Swan said joining family and friends was the overwhelming factor for his decision to leave the Hawks after nine seasons to take up a massive nine-year, $10 million offer.

 

Damon_3388

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He asked about going to Sydney instead of GWS after the 2012 grand final.
Also, GWS is still in Sydney. He 100% chose the Swans to chase immediate success.
And Buddy made two Grand Finals with the Swans, and was among their best players the first (2014) and tried hard without much reward in the second (2016). Yeah, the ultimate success didn't come, but you've got to get to the dance in the first place. The way some people go on is like the Swans never even made the finals with Buddy, when they were a legitimate top 4/premiership contender for the remaining years of his prime that he had (2014-2016, ages 27-29), and then were still a top 6 side in the last two seasons before the current one.
 

Damon_3388

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Can't wait to sign Coniglio on a 60 year contract.
Seriously, I'd like to see the league put either a 5- or 7-year limit on contract length, and not allow multi-year contracts to extend past the year a player turns 33. Would still allow clubs to make big long-term offers, but also saves them from themselves a bit with ridiculous sums to be paid to blokes who might not even be playing, through either age or injury.

That would meant that either way, a player like Coniglio (born 1993) could be offered a maximum 7-year deal at the end of this year, as he turns 33 in 2026.
 

CheapCharlie

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How a player came to a club is 100% relevant in the case of restricted free agency.


• "An explicit acknowledgement that the long-term specific financial commitment over the nine-year agreement will apply to the Swans' total player payments for each of the nine years, regardless of how many years Franklin is available to play for the club."

As I've mentioned, the length of the deal allowed you distinct (and fair) advantages. By offering such a large deal, knowing any club would struggle to match (and if they did match and Buddy chose to remain, HFC would be under the exact conditions as above) they circumvented the part of restricted free agency where they would be liable to trade for 2014 Buddy Franklin. This would be a considerable price, meaning they would have to trade capital for him, made all the more difficult knowing they still want to bid on Callum Mills.

But their offer got them around it, their list stayed intact, gained Franklin and pick 3 in Mills.

You cannot have that advantage and then just throw your hands in the air and walk away from the restricted free agency deal and it's obligations because it's suddenly gotten very scary. It would be the end of free agency as clubs would be offering 15 million contracts to stars and changing the deals as they see fit a few years later, with no consequence.
The issue is whether all future salaries for players are treated fairly and the same under the salary cap. The status of the player is irrelevant to that.
 

ScottBo

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Superstar Sydney recruit Lance Franklin says he left Hawthorn to chase more premierships

That's only a lesson to to not trust headlines, the impression being it is the reason why he left the Hawks. He's not saying he's leaving the Hawks because he thinks he has a better chance of winning a premiership at the Swans. At the time he's leaving the best team in the comp. And is there a player who joins a club who doesn't trot out that he's not hopeful of snaring a premiership?

"I'm going to miss (my former Hawthorn teammates) to bits, but I won two premierships with Hawthorn Football Club, I walk away from Hawthorn Football Club very proud of what I did for that football club, now I"m at Sydney and hopefully we can win a few more premierships."
 

Wesley2

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The issue is whether all future salaries for players are treated fairly and the same under the salary cap. The status of the player is irrelevant to that.
No, that assumes that standard deals and restricted free agent contracts follow they same rules and they do not.

Restricted free agent contracts have different rules, deal with it.
 

Maddo11

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The issue is whether all future salaries for players are treated fairly and the same under the salary cap. The status of the player is irrelevant to that.
They are.

If you draft a player, then offer them a contract, they sign and then retire, that money is no longer under the cap.

If you pick up a restricted free agent (where the club they're coming from has the opportunity to offer the same contract and have the player remain) then you are held to that contract regardless of if they play 1 game or 150.

Seems pretty fair.
 

CheapCharlie

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No, that assumes that standard deals and restricted free agent contracts follow they same rules and they do not.

Restricted free agent contracts have different rules, deal with it.
You are basing your argument on how the AFL has written their conditions not on whether the same fair and equitable rule applies to each and every individual player


They are.

If you draft a player, then offer them a contract, they sign and then retire, that money is no longer under the cap.

If you pick up a restricted free agent (where the club they're coming from has the opportunity to offer the same contract and have the player remain) then you are held to that contract regardless of if they play 1 game or 150.

Seems pretty fair.
So, there are two different rules for salary cap for someone doing the same job and retiring?
 

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