cam cloke

[CarltonFan]

Charbzilla, my post here:

I see absoluetly no reason why we are playing him. Is he protecting a young Kreuzer from the ruck? no. Is he providing an effective decoy for Fev? no. Is he dragging an effective opposition defender out of their defence? no, too often it is Clokes man sweeping the ball out. Is he crashing packs/ bring the ball to our small forwards? no. Is he a good waterboy? no. Is he kicking goals? no. Is he the future of our forwardline/rucks? no.

say 'no' to cloke.

is not based on one week. its based on 6 weeks.

 

[Charbzilla]

thanks mate i did read it however i still think u were 'recalling fresh memories'.

He does protect Kreuzer is the ruck, because they rotate the positions! Check!
He does provide a decoy in the forward line! Check!
Crashing packs? Not as enough as we are hoping! Watch this space!
Kicking goals? No again, because others are! Watch this space, again!

Waterboy? Now your just getting rediculous.

Keep the faith mate, we don't have anyone infront of him as an option at the moment.

 

[blue gunslinger]

thanks mate i did read it however i still think u were 'recalling fresh memories'.

He does protect Kreuzer is the ruck, because they rotate the positions! Check!
He does provide a decoy in the forward line! Check!
Crashing packs? Not as enough as we are hoping! Watch this space!
Kicking goals? No again, because others are! Watch this space, again!

Waterboy? Now your just getting rediculous.

Keep the faith mate, we don't have anyone infront of him as an option at the moment.

I agree with 30yo and Charbzilla. Cloke has done plenty. Yes he could have done it better and done more. Perhaps the buildup with Carlos has him mentally unprepared and it has caused him to lose confidence. Perhaps he is not 100% fit. However I do not see anyone in the Ants that offers more. Carlos did play well however since his return so has me a little perplexed as to why he was dropped

 

[CarltonFan]

Nope dont think that at all. Against Essendon some have said we needed to have Carlos in. We did not lose that game because of poor defense we lost because we did not put scoreboard pressure on when we had control early and our mids and forwards did not put the same pressure they had the weeks before. Not a selection issue.

Against the Swans we were poor all over the field but again had the chance to ice the game early and failed to take our chances. Again no one selection or failure to select was at fault, the 22 we had were perfectly capable of winning but we did not play well.

Against the Hawks, the only questionable selection was Bentley and I have no issue with the MC trying players out to see if they are up to it. Retrospect is a wonderful tool, unfortunately only couch selectors seem to posses it.

NEXT.

what was it this week? the humidity?

face it, Rattens coaching and player selections has and will continue to cost us games.
what are we possibly gaining by playing players like Cloke? please answer me this.

 

[Azzurri Blues]

he is a deadset dud....

has been useless the last 2 weeks....

we can't send him back cause we ain't got no one to cover him....

 

[blue gunslinger]

the wablues own Cam Cloke did take a mark - I did see it with my own 2 eyes.
That is about all I am going to say right now

 

[40yearBLUE]

what was it this week? the humidity?

face it, Rattens coaching and player selections has and will continue to cost us games.
what are we possibly gaining by playing players like Cloke? please answer me this.

We made 4 changes. But of course you would have preferred 8 I am guessing. And of course in hindsight (again). Cloke out for ? Carlos? Maybe. Wiggins out for ? Hartlett? Maybe (by the way I am not advocating these changes just trying to anticipate what exactly you would do, future coach?

And of course you would want JR dropped not sure who you want in for him, Grigg perhaps but I think he may be injured, but then you would want JR out so bad that you would pick Grigg anyway.

Let me see who else is there, AJ for Elard? Thornton for Bano, Simmo for Browne, Stevens for Garlett. If there are any other players you dont like I doubt there is anyone left given the injuries, oh well theres Tiller, Hill and Stanton I suppose. I wouldnt put it past you to call them up.

This is the problem for knee jerk off commenters like you. You make silly statements, someone like me comes along and forces you to own them, then you fight for that position until you have no choice but to keep reitterating it even though the vast weight of evidence tells you that your position is untenable.

So come on future coach, we are losing, make your moves. Before you know it the Bullants players will all be in the ones and the Bullants will have mostly familiar names playing for them.

Now that the silliness is done, there is no doubt we need to change, but not the personel. We need to learn to apply pressure and want the ball for the entire game, not just hang in each quarter and decide that we can win it in the last 10 minutes. We need to get some structure back, we have conceded the corridor too many times. We need to get better at delivering the ball into our forward 50, we get it in more than enough times but are not converting anywhere near enough, and misses are obviously hurting us also, we again had more scoring shots. 5 striaght points at the start of the third, straight kicking would have seen us hit the lead and go away with it. And equally poor kicking in the last. Cloke failing to make the distance and Russel not clearing the man on the mark, Murph and Army doing the hard running forward but then just bombing or spraying kicks, but to be fair that kind of running saps strength, and because we did not have good moving targets we had the wild snaps for the brilliant goal. But then the way they were clearing it maybe the snap was the best option we couldnt buy a contested mark inside 50 in the second half.

It is disappointing, we are not playing well. Our start to the season perhaps flattered us. We may be a bit further off than some of us, me included, gave us credit for. But there is still a lot of season to come and it is quite unpredictable. Apart from the top 2 or 3 sides there is not much separating the rest. The form lines are very hard to follow.

But posting rubbish because you're disappointed will only make you look silly, it wont win us any more games.

 

[XXX KINGS]

Mate stop trying to defend a clear **** up from the match comitee, this guy is clearly not up to it, an absolute spud. I'd prefer Fisher in the side over this guy at least he can take a mark.

 

[CarltonFan]

Firstly, this thread is about Cloke and in all of your posts you have failed to answer this ONE question:

what are we possibly gaining by playing players like Cloke? please answer me this.

ive said Cloke 'out' for ages, infact at the start of the year when everyone made there best 22 predictions i didnt have him in. He is not up to AFL standard. Today's footy is fast fast fast, take a look at the bombers, and we cant play fast footy with players like Cloke. He drops marks when we need him to take them, he loses 50/50 contests like against jordan lewis last week, he puts on Zero 'frontal pressure', he is useless when the ball hits the deck, he makes leads at the wrong time and he is simply not desperate enough. Everything about him spells DUD.
I'll say it again, Ratten and the MC have made mistakes this year that has and will continue to cost us games.

We made 4 changes. But of course you would have preferred 8 I am guessing. And of course in hindsight (again). Cloke out for ? Carlos? Maybe. Wiggins out for ? Hartlett? Maybe (by the way I am not advocating these changes just trying to anticipate what exactly you would do, future coach?

And of course you would want JR dropped not sure who you want in for him, Grigg perhaps but I think he may be injured, but then you would want JR out so bad that you would pick Grigg anyway.

Let me see who else is there, AJ for Elard? Thornton for Bano, Simmo for Browne, Stevens for Garlett. If there are any other players you dont like I doubt there is anyone left given the injuries, oh well theres Tiller, Hill and Stanton I suppose. I wouldnt put it past you to call them up.

i see what you've did here. You cant answer the questions so you make up a bunch of dribble and deflect deflect deflect.

where did i call for 8 changes? where did i call for russell to be dropped? where did i call for AJ to be dropped?
i didnt. why make up rubbish? dont put me in the same boat as most of the other idiots on this board.

How can you say that im a hindsighter when i make a call about a player and the MC before the game? I dont call for players to be dropped after one bad game, im not loke that. i make calls after they are given a few chances.

This is the problem for knee jerk off commenters like you. You make silly statements, someone like me comes along and forces you to own them, then you fight for that position until you have no choice but to keep reitterating it even though the vast weight of evidence tells you that your position is untenable.

I have made the calls on a few players and your retort is "no. you are wrong. you post rubbish."
It is you that has not provided one shred of 'evidence' to back up your claims.
I said Cloke must get the chop, that is my position, until you provide me with some 'evidence' as to why that is wrong then my position is very tenable.

So come on future coach, we are losing, make your moves. Before you know it the Bullants players will all be in the ones and the Bullants will have mostly familiar names playing for them.

I guess this is where we are different. You want to continue to play Cloke and Wiggins etc... and I want to play Browne and Austin.
Have faith in the kids, play the kids, lets develop a team that will win a premiership.
I can handle losing games because the kids make mistakes, what i cant and wont take is losing games because the senior members make mistakes.
Lets take a look at the bombers again. Matty Knights has given the youngsters enourmous responsibility. Pears & Hooker this week did the job on Roughead and Franklin. This is exactly the kind of thing i want to see from the MC and Ratts, give the kids a go, and give them a role to play.
Dont waste time with duds.

Lets develop a forwardline with some structure. Yesterday for aboout the zillionth time we did the old, get the ball to HF, then bomb it in long to Fev. We've done that for several years. I was glad to see Waite go forward, Austin given a job to do down back, but it was all too late (im not talking about in the match, im talking about 7 rounds in), because the players had no idea what they were doing out there, and it all comes back to the coach.

Now that the silliness is done, there is no doubt we need to change, but not the personel.

is this a joke 30? because im not laughing. cloke and wiggins are examples of the personnel currently stoping us from being a great side.

We need to learn to apply pressure and want the ball for the entire game, not just hang in each quarter and decide that we can win it in the last 10 minutes. We need to get some structure back, we have conceded the corridor too many times. We need to get better at delivering the ball into our forward 50

now this is something we agree on .

But posting rubbish because you're disappointed will only make you look silly, it wont win us any more games.

30, its you that is posting rubbish after a loss. First it was inaccuracy, then it was generally being poor, then its not enough intensity. you make excuses for the coach and MC and you are not holding them accountable.

what i posted before the loss is that player selections and the coach has cost us games. And i was proven right again. We had zero structure, we failed to come up with an effective game plan to combat Freo's flooding tactics, which they have been playing for 3 weeks now, and we played duds who are not desperate enough/capable of winning the hard ball and moving it on quickly and with precision. It all comes down to the coach and the MC.

 

[40yearBLUE]

Mate stop trying to defend a clear **** up from the match comitee, this guy is clearly not up to it, an absolute spud. I'd prefer Fisher in the side over this guy at least he can take a mark.

Another Monday expert.

 

[40yearBLUE]

Firstly, this thread is about Cloke and in all of your posts you have failed to answer this ONE question:

I'll say it again, Ratten and the MC have made mistakes this year that has and will continue to cost us games.

i see what you've did here. You cant answer the questions so you make up a bunch of dribble and deflect deflect deflect.

where did i call for 8 changes?

I guess this is where we are different. You want to continue to play Cloke and Wiggins etc... . It all comes down to the coach and the MC.

I have edited this to stop boring the crap out of decent supporters. Yes thats the implication I am making.

You want Cloke, the next bloke wants Wiggo, the next JR,.......

Then next week you want someone else and so do the other BLEATERS.

Turning a side around takes time, I remember the calls for Bombers job, about 18 months before lofting the cup. If the Cats did not have a strong board like we do, they would have done just that. But strong executive and coaches ignore the baying for blood and just get on and do the job.

WHERE YOU AND I DIFFER, IS NOT IN OUR OPINIONS OF WHO SHOULD BE DROPPED AND WHO SHOULDNT, BECAUSE IF YOU BOTHER TO CHECK I HAVE NEVER ADVOCATED ANY PLAYER BE DROPPED. NOT ONCE. EVER. PERIOD.

I AM A SUPPORTER OF THE CLUB. THE CLUB. NOT THE PLAYERS, THE CLUB.

When you start supporting the club you will start to earn some respect until then you are just another potter, with little more than a keyboard and an opinion.

 

[CarltonFan]

failed to answer the cloke question again. well done 30 lmao

 

[40yearBLUE]

failed to answer the cloke question again. well done 30 lmao

It not for me to answer, what part of that dont u get. Its for me to be patient, and SUPPORT my club. I wont be dignifying any more of your posts with a response so save yourself the time and everyone else the boredom.

 

[blue gunslinger]

When Fev went off it was a good chance for a Cloke or Kreuz or Wiggins to really step up and make a difference. Players must start taking their opportunities.

 

[fevolation87]

Guys, the only change I can think of is when Warnock and Sauce comeback. Maybe play those two guys in the ruck and Kreuzer at CHF but than again we need him in ruck but that is the only thing I can think of.

The other thing I could think of is (I'm going to get fried sooooooooooo bad for this and I'm sorry for saying it) Drop Wiggo and play Fisher with Cloke in the forward 50 (I'm so sorry for saying this). The only reason I think this might work was in 07 Fisher was our third forward he kick 39 goals and in a game in Brisbane round 21 Cloke kicked 4 as our third forward.

I think the main reason Cloke is doing crap is he is getting the second best defender week in, week out. He can't handle that but maybe if Cloke and Fisher in the side at least one of them may get an easier opponent and become "serviceable" players.

 

[Beloved]

Mate stop trying to defend a clear **** up from the match comitee, this guy is clearly not up to it, an absolute spud. I'd prefer Fisher in the side over this guy at least he can take a mark.

Until Fisher can't kick a goal and we beg for Cloke back into the team.

 

[serenityNow]

Firstly, this thread is about Cloke and in all of your posts you have failed to answer this ONE question:



ive said Cloke 'out' for ages, infact at the start of the year when everyone made there best 22 predictions i didnt have him in. He is not up to AFL standard. Today's footy is fast fast fast, take a look at the bombers, and we cant play fast footy with players like Cloke. He drops marks when we need him to take them, he loses 50/50 contests like against jordan lewis last week, he puts on Zero 'frontal pressure', he is useless when the ball hits the deck, he makes leads at the wrong time and he is simply not desperate enough. Everything about him spells DUD.
I'll say it again, Ratten and the MC have made mistakes this year that has and will continue to cost us games.



i see what you've did here. You cant answer the questions so you make up a bunch of dribble and deflect deflect deflect.

where did i call for 8 changes? where did i call for russell to be dropped? where did i call for AJ to be dropped?
i didnt. why make up rubbish? dont put me in the same boat as most of the other idiots on this board.

How can you say that im a hindsighter when i make a call about a player and the MC before the game? I dont call for players to be dropped after one bad game, im not loke that. i make calls after they are given a few chances.



I have made the calls on a few players and your retort is "no. you are wrong. you post rubbish."
It is you that has not provided one shred of 'evidence' to back up your claims.
I said Cloke must get the chop, that is my position, until you provide me with some 'evidence' as to why that is wrong then my position is very tenable.



I guess this is where we are different. You want to continue to play Cloke and Wiggins etc... and I want to play Browne and Austin.
Have faith in the kids, play the kids, lets develop a team that will win a premiership.
I can handle losing games because the kids make mistakes, what i cant and wont take is losing games because the senior members make mistakes.
Lets take a look at the bombers again. Matty Knights has given the youngsters enourmous responsibility. Pears & Hooker this week did the job on Roughead and Franklin. This is exactly the kind of thing i want to see from the MC and Ratts, give the kids a go, and give them a role to play.
Dont waste time with duds.

Lets develop a forwardline with some structure. Yesterday for aboout the zillionth time we did the old, get the ball to HF, then bomb it in long to Fev. We've done that for several years. I was glad to see Waite go forward, Austin given a job to do down back, but it was all too late (im not talking about in the match, im talking about 7 rounds in), because the players had no idea what they were doing out there, and it all comes back to the coach.



is this a joke 30? because im not laughing. cloke and wiggins are examples of the personnel currently stoping us from being a great side.



now this is something we agree on .



30, its you that is posting rubbish after a loss. First it was inaccuracy, then it was generally being poor, then its not enough intensity. you make excuses for the coach and MC and you are not holding them accountable.

what i posted before the loss is that player selections and the coach has cost us games. And i was proven right again. We had zero structure, we failed to come up with an effective game plan to combat Freo's flooding tactics, which they have been playing for 3 weeks now, and we played duds who are not desperate enough/capable of winning the hard ball and moving it on quickly and with precision. It all comes down to the coach and the MC.

 

[BringBackSimmo]

Cloke out for ? Carlos? Maybe.

I thought O'hAilpin looked reasonably good up forward against the Hawks, i would of rather seen him stay in the side then Cloke ...