Cam O'Shea Anyone?

[pebblesofsand]

If someone can explain why you need a third tall I'm happy to hear but all I see is the game going away from tall forwards.

You're right about the tall forwards but wrong about what it means for O'Shea.

Because of the reasons you say we need a one really good tall tall (Carlisle) who'll play every week, one OK tall tall (Brown) - who will only play occasionally and a quality 3rd tall (Dempster - who will play every week) and a second good 3rd tall (O'Shea) who will play the weeks that Brown is not required.

Where does that leave Gilbert - bench/midfield with the occasional big "don't argue" and a mongrel floating punt into the forward line.

 

[plugger66]

You're right about the tall forwards but wrong about what it means for O'Shea.

Because of the reasons you say we need a one really good tall tall (Carlisle) who'll play every week, one OK tall tall (Brown) - who will only play occasionally and a quality 3rd tall (Dempster - who will play every week) and a second good 3rd tall (O'Shea) who will play the weeks that Brown is not required.

Where does that leave Gilbert - bench/midfield with the occasional big "don't argue" and a mongrel floating punt into the forward line.

But how did the WB win a flag with bugger all talls and how did the Swans get there with not a great deal of talls. Id rather ball winning runners. And id rather Gilbert over O'Shea if we do need a tall down back.

 

[King_Steele]

But how did the WB win a flag with bugger all talls and how did the Swans get there with not a great deal of talls. Id rather ball winning runners. And id rather Gilbert over O'Shea if we do need a tall down back.

Hamling & Roberts are KPD's

Wood the third tall, interceptor

How is this any different to Carlisle, Brown & Dempster/O'Shea?

 

[Ducky Tie]

Very dangerous precedent to go with the approach of copying the dogs. Their finals series was undoubtedly amazing and their flag very deserved but their body of work over the season was not the benchmark of the comp.

 

[Sir Skid]

IMO the next time we challenge for a premiership it will be with competitive flexibility on setups to leverage the team we are playing each week.
To think we're going to go in with Brown each week is naive.
Teams with 2 power forwards sure but other teams it would be detrimental to us and we'd be better to set up for more spread and carry defense.

We have far better spread of talent and more competition for spots all over the ground so good times ahead.

 

[plugger66]

Hamling & Roberts are KPD's

Wood the third tall, interceptor

How is this any different to Carlisle, Brown & Dempster/O'Shea?

Because you aren't counting 194cm Roberton. And Wood is a star. O'Shea just got delisted. And we also have Goddard that we drafted at about pick 20.

 

[plugger66]

Very dangerous precedent to go with the approach of copying the dogs. Their finals series was undoubtedly amazing and their flag very deserved but their body of work over the season was not the benchmark of the comp.

Werent they about one win off top 4 with easily the most injuries from any of the top 8 sides. I reckon they are a great side to copy.

 

[King_Steele]

Because you aren't counting 194cm Roberton. And Wood is a star. O'Shea just got delisted. And we also have Goddard that we drafted at about pick 20.

Robbo can play midfield.

Brown is 28, clearly a stop gap while Goddard recovers from the Achilles injury IMO

Either way we'll be going into round 1 with that exact setup - Brown, Carlisle with Dempster as the third tall just like Hamling, Roberts & Wood

Just my 2c

 

[plugger66]

Robbo can play midfield.

Brown is 28, clearly a stop gap while Goddard recovers from the Achilles injury IMO

Either way we'll be going into round 1 with that exact setup - Brown, Carlisle with Dempster as the third tall just like Hamling, Roberts & Wood

Just my 2c

I see them as nothing similar but that's my 2 cents worth. Anyway I thought we were talking O'Shea.

 

[Barrels]

Haven't we all learnt yet...?

 

[King_Steele]

I see them as nothing similar but that's my 2 cents worth. Anyway I thought we were talking O'Shea.

I hope we get him.

Great replacement for Dempster

 

[plugger66]

Haven't we all learnt yet...?

Obviously you haven't.

 

[plugger66]

I hope we get him.

Great replacement for Dempster

Agreed if you want to think Mediocre.

 

[King_Steele]

Agreed if you want to think Mediocre.

Oh

I rated O'Shea's 2013 & 2014 seasons

 

[plugger66]

Oh

I rated O'Shea's 2013 & 2014 seasons

I rated Sam Fisher 2009 and 10 seasons and really rated Pluggers 1991 and 92 seasons.

 

[King_Steele]

I rated Sam Fisher 2009 and 10 seasons and really rated Pluggers 1991 and 92 seasons.

13 & 14 have more relevance

 

[RoundCubic]

But how did the WB win a flag with bugger all talls and how did the Swans get there with not a great deal of talls. Id rather ball winning runners. And id rather Gilbert over O'Shea if we do need a tall down back.

Buddy was playing on 1 leg and 1 arm not exactly a winning strategy "get lucky"

 

[Diehard Saint]

Very dangerous precedent to go with the approach of copying the dogs. Their finals series was undoubtedly amazing and their flag very deserved but their body of work over the season was not the benchmark of the comp.

Exactly.
Each team must have their own game plan developed around the players they have. I don't believe copying another team is the answer at all.

 

[Diehard Saint]

Werent they about one win off top 4 with easily the most injuries from any of the top 8 sides. I reckon they are a great side to copy.

Copying someone means you are always behind. We need to develop our own style, brand, game plan whatever, which I believe we are.

 

[plugger66]

Copying someone means you are always behind. We need to develop our own style, brand, game plan whatever, which I believe we are.

Obviously we wont copy them. Richo has his own style but I still think the game is less and less about tall key marking forwards so it means its less and less about tall key backs.

 

[Macgruber]

O'Shea is seriously ordinary. It's not due to lack of opportunity he is being moved on.


Ricky Henderson/Xavier Richards would be better options

 

[Keg on legs]

Copying someone means you are always behind. We need to develop our own style, brand, game plan whatever, which I believe we are.

Which is why I never bag out RTB

Sure, he ****ed us over and left us with a shell of a list, but in 2009 we were innovators with the manic fwd press.

Pre that, in all my time following the saints, I don't recall us being league leaders and always thought we kinda tried to play catch up with others.

Problem is, by the time you actually perfect what the premiers are doing, you're 3 years behind

 

[Diehard Saint]

Obviously we wont copy them. Richo has his own style but I still think the game is less and less about tall key marking forwards so it means its less and less about tall key backs.

Well considering a tall marking forward was extremely handy for the Dogs this year I don't thnk they are out of vogue...and I certainly hope not, especially considering we've got young Paddy coming through. I would imagine that's why we got Carlisle too...Buddy, Kennedy, Patton etc are still out there.
Of course it's important to have those mobile, running backs as well though, but how many teams over the years have won flags without a dominant forward? Game styles vary but I doubt the game will change that much.

 

[plugger66]

Well considering a tall marking forward was extremely handy for the Dogs this year I don't thnk they are out of vogue...and I certainly hope not, especially considering we've got young Paddy coming through. I would imagine that's why we got Carlisle too...Buddy, Kennedy, Patton etc are still out there.
Of course it's important to have those mobile, running backs as well though, but how many teams over the years have won flags without a dominant forward? Game styles vary but I doubt the game will change that much.

I never said tall marking forwards were completely out of vogue but there is obviously less and less stay as home forwards. And nearly every side wins the GF with a key marking forward because nearly every side has a key marking forward but not many have 2 these days. I wouldn't call Franklin a key marking forward. Even Boyd, who was great on GF day played in the ruck for probably half the game.

 

[Geary Is GOAT]

Because you aren't counting 194cm Roberton. And Wood is a star. O'Shea just got delisted. And we also have Goddard that we drafted at about pick 20.

But 194cm Roberton isn't an intercept marker. He uses his height to spoil but he isn't taking intercept marks in our defensive 50. Cam O'Shea can, he hasn't in the past two years because he's being played out of position, but in 2013 when he played that Dempster role he played it really well for a kid. But in the same way Fisher was moved Cam was moved out of necessity.