Camp Findings from Sam McClure

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hey shorty

TheBrownDog
Jun 15, 2005
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If this is true, then the AFC's refusal to address the scuttlebutt and rumours and allow it to become so destructive towards the Club, is incomprehensible.

And that is why I don't believe it was as tame as is now being suggested.
That's exactly why I think it's as tame as it's being reported now. We have done so many things wrong, why wouldn't our media strategy be another one of those things.
 

Geoffa32

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Our club handled the messaging poorly.

Plus CM holding them to the legalities of not making public their methods.


Which in itself is dumb and has left them open to all the innuendo.


End of the day, the camp cost our club dearly. Regardless of McClure being right or it being far tamer. Does it really matter exactly what happened?

The damage was done. Team chemistry shattered and us supporters can see that on the field.

Let's not forget that Roo and Burton got sucked into the Firepower pyramid scheme. As they did CM.....

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hey shorty

TheBrownDog
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Our club handled the messaging poorly.

Plus CM holding them to the legalities of not making public their methods.


Which in itself is dumb and has left them open to all the innuendo.


End of the day, the camp cost our club dearly. Regardless of McClure being right or it being far tamer. Does it really matter exactly what happened?

The damage was done. Team chemistry shattered and us supporters can see that on the field.

Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk
That's it right there.

I wonder if half of this stuff did actually happen whether we would've fought it. We've not shown much inclination to fight anything
 

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John Who

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Exactly right

If it all turns out that there was nothing untoward then that's actually worse.

It means our custodians are happy to sit idly by while our club is universally trashed (unfairly) and our brand is destroyed.
That's actually not a fair summation if there really was nothing untoward. If anything, it points towards McClure being the biggest ass ever to grace a media headline against the Crows. Not sure why you would be more angered at the club when it's some random journo spreading hogwash against your club? Add to this, we did actually come out and tried to squash any Camp rumours with the "Burton and Pyke" show, mid-season 2018..
I do tend to agree Burton didn't present himself very well on that occasion, but at least we can't say the club sat idly diddly.

Adding to this, if McNure/Wilson backtracks on some of their claims, then I hope the club would sue them as well for the anger it has caused both the players, club and the fans. One could even think of it as them bringing the game into disrepute. It's shameful journalism without any hint of ethics, if CM wins their case against them 2.
 

BrissyCrow

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Hmmm, my recollection was not many on here heavily critiqued the club for letting the players let go.

Jenkins, Betts, CEY, Keith, Thor etc.

Only contentious part was what we got in return for Keith and Thor.

Pretty much everyone was onbaord for a well overdue cleanout, I reckon more people were upset it didnt go further rather than lamenting those out the door.
I didnt like that we moved Keith and Greenwood on. I was a little apprehensive about CEY but I had felt he was not reliable. Jenkins, Jacob's were fine and so was Betts but I was sad to see him go. Keeping Betts to me would only have been an emotional decision. I also felt that many others on here questioned letting Greenwood and Keith go.
 

BrissyCrow

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That's it right there.

I wonder if half of this stuff did actually happen whether we would've fought it. We've not shown much inclination to fight anything
Maybe I am naive but how our club challenges issues is surely tempered but the AFL controlling our destiny .....at least until 2028 or somewhere about that time. We are weak because we getting muffled. Having said that I definitely agree that the club handled the media/press releases very poorly. Until this day I am still not happy with what has come out of the AFC about the camp. I also understand that now legal proceedings are in play that getting comments from the AFC wont happy any time soon.
 
May 24, 2006
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That's actually not a fair summation if there really was nothing untoward. If anything, it points towards McClure being the biggest ass ever to grace a media headline against the Crows. Not sure why you would be more angered at the club when it's some random journo spreading hogwash against your club? Add to this, we did actually come out and tried to squash any Camp rumours with the "Burton and Pyke" show, mid-season 2018..
I do tend to agree Burton didn't present himself very well on that occasion, but at least we can't say the club sat idly diddly.

Adding to this, if McNure/Wilson backtracks on some of their claims, then I hope the club would sue them as well for the anger it has caused both the players, club and the fans. One could even think of it as them bringing the game into disrepute. It's shameful journalism without any hint of ethics, if CM wins their case against them 2.
If some lowly nuffy journalist can put us to the sword with a few made up rumours that reflects exceptionally poorly on us.

I doubt Eddie or Jeff would have sat idly by, copping punches.

Sure McClure is a grub. So are many journos. We have to deal with the environment we're in.
 

1970crow

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I mean the whole point of preseason camp is to get fit and get all the players on the same page. Even if we didn't tie any players to trees naked, the camp still failed miserably.

Sholl wasnt showing signs of tiring out so calling for him to be managed makes just as little sense.

I feel pretty good about where the club is at compared to this time last year. I just get frustrated when people try to cast the last 3 years as some kind of "playing the long game" master stroke when it was actually just rank incompetence. They were in denial in 2018 and 2019 and I would argue the club was still showing signs of denial under Nicks but the North game seems to have finally stamped this out completely. I maintain the rebuild truly started that day.
Any talk of heading into round 1 rebuilding is pure garbage. Our revisionist management have pegged it as far back as trade week. JJ was the only senior player forced out. Betts could have stayed but was told he was not certain best 22 and would likely play 2s. Sauce, Greenwood and Keath all had contracts in front of them that they could well have signed. Leaving us with JJ, Otto and Dougie as our only senior player outs. Hell of a rebuild they were planning.
 
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John Who

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If some lowly nuffy journalist can put us to the sword with a few made up rumours that reflects exceptionally poorly on us.

I doubt Eddie or Jeff would have sat idly by, copping punches.

Sure McClure is a grub. So are many journos. We have to deal with the environment we're in.
I partially agree with this. I actually said this sometime in the past, the club should really be suing McNure or make some legal threats, because he’s definitely done more damage to us than help us with his articles. Particularly when some of the initial allegations have been refuted categorically. I can see though it would take too much effort to focus on a legal action when our club itself has been in a mess with its poor results in the last 2 years, barring the last 3 games.

Regarding the last paragraph:
“Sure McClure is a grub. So are many journos. We have to deal with the environment we're in.”

If indeed McClure is falsifying the info regarding his “sources”, and the fact he’s been hounding at us for the past 3 years, then this would make him the biggest grub of all time! Not just an average kinda grub.
And “dealing with the environment we’re in”, isn’t just literally about within the club walls. It’s also the AFL, the media, the cyberspace, fans, trolls and anyone involving in AFL.
 

FR0GGY

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I partially agree with this. I actually said this sometime in the past, the club should really be suing McNure or make some legal threats, because he’s definitely done more damage to us than help us with his articles. Particularly when some of the initial allegations have been refuted categorically. I can see though it would take too much effort to focus on a legal action when our club itself has been in a mess with its poor results in the last 2 years, barring the last 3 games.

Regarding the last paragraph:
“Sure McClure is a grub. So are many journos. We have to deal with the environment we're in.”

If indeed McClure is falsifying the info regarding his “sources”, and the fact he’s been hounding at us for the past 3 years, then this would make him the biggest grub of all time! Not just an average kinda grub.
And “dealing with the environment we’re in”, isn’t just literally about within the club walls. It’s also the AFL, the media, the cyberspace, fans, trolls and anyone involving in AFL.
Even if McClure looses his house due to being sued, he still has the option of living rent free in your head.
 

jenny61_99

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Exactly right

If it all turns out that there was nothing untoward then that's actually worse.

It means our custodians are happy to sit idly by while our club is universally trashed (unfairly) and our brand is destroyed.
I think it more likely a (really) bad bit of PR advice on how to handle it (give it no air, it will go away) that got to the point of "if we respond now, they won't believe us anyway". Truly a damned if you do, damned if you don't moment.
 

Captain Morgan

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Yup. I wouldn't be suprised either if on the back of the camp we changed up our draft interviews to be more cutting and resilience based. Roo is especially brutal on some players and I think Greenwood is clearly on Roos sh*t list. Probably why he didn't even give Nicks a say on the trades.

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Would it be somewhat ironic that the camp actually delivered on its intended outcomes by weeding out the mentally weak, forcing greater resilience through adversity of a club bottoming - the benefit being realised after 3 seasons not 3 months in the off season as they had hoped back in 2018 ?

Or am I drunk again with rose coloured glasses.
 

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feenix67

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I don't think this is evidence of a massive coverup and they can't keep their stories straight, if that's what you mean?

We've gotten so many different accounts, none of them completely line up. That CM played it once at the camp and Shutts was there when it was played at PS training sounds reasonably plausible.
I have my notes from the conversation somewhere, but my recollection is that the words were something like "it was played at PS, not at the camp". Essentially, from what I recall, he was saying the media got it wrong, it wasn't played at the camp, it was played during preseason.

There were a few things said to me by the club during that time that have since been contradicted. I'm not going to cast aspersions on anyone, but my gut feel is the facts probably lay somewhere in the middle.
 
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I think it more likely a (really) bad bit of PR advice on how to handle it (give it no air, it will go away) that got to the point of "if we respond now, they won't believe us anyway". Truly a damned if you do, damned if you don't moment.
We had a practice run with the Tippett saga that dragged on forever and was never resolved

We should have known that wouldn't work
 

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If this is true, then the AFC's refusal to address the scuttlebutt and rumours and allow it to become so destructive towards the Club, is incomprehensible.

And that is why I don't believe it was as tame as is now being suggested.
And there were a few Poeple that mention this at the time, It was not the Camp that hurt the Crows it was there inabilty to deal with the Bull after,
What hurt the Crow in 2018 was Fitness issues, bad leadership,
All the Camp did was distract us from the true issues affecting the Club, which is why you Never trust a witch hunt.
 

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