Can Hawthorn succeed while ignoring the elite end of the draft?

[Pessimistic]

Didn’t Burton finish 4th in the BnF and win the most promising player award in 2017!?

So if Hardwick has a quiet year in 2019, Hawk fans will be happy to see him traded out?

Dunno, who've you got on offer?

My take is Hawk fans weren't particularly happy, Just going along with 'club knows best'

 

[Vintage]

No idea if your Freo news is true, and I am delighted for you if it is true

But...
- Note: This was an opinion - "I think". I know we were happy in the first few weeks. As he has been doing more at training than I would have thought he would have at this stage, I believe that we would still happy with how Scully has been progressing, but I still wanted to qualify my sentence with "I think"
This is a factual statement. Notice the lack of the words "I think" in this sentence. They both have settled in really well at the club and had great experiences on Kokoda.
Again this is my opinion, there might be some regular posters in the thread who aren't delighted, but deep down they will probably be secretly excited about it

I didn’t use the words “I think” in my freo statement - therefore it must be a fact.

 

[MightyHawks]

I didn’t use the words “I think” in my freo statement - therefore it must be a fact.

I'm not sure your facts are as reliable as my facts but happy to roll with it

 

[Holy Rioli]

This is comforting, as Blake Hardwick wouldn't make our side.

he'd make it easily. Kid is a star. In fact if it came down to one small/medium defender, Jetta would be in the fight of his life to keep his spot.

 

[Benny78]

Geelong haven't had a pick from the elite end of the draft for 3 decades plus. Of course Hawthorn can succeed without them.

Basically when a club turns to s**t it's over. Until they merge with another club and become a cheat team. Top 5 picks going to s**t clubs destroys the players career rather than bringing that club a premiership.

 

[HairyO]

Geelong haven't had a pick from the elite end of the draft for 3 decades plus. Of course Hawthorn can succeed without them.

Basically when a club turns to s**t it's over. Until they merge with another club and become a cheat team. Top 5 picks going to s**t clubs destroys the players career rather than bringing that club a premiership.

They had a fair few cheap Father Son picks which were for definite elite kids.

Not so easy anymore with the new rules and when competing against academies.

 

[Trav 20]

he'd make it easily. Kid is a star. In fact if it came down to one small/medium defender, Jetta would be in the fight of his life to keep his spot.

Negative.

Jetta, May, Lever, Hibberd, Salem, and the final "tall" McDonald. There's no room for the 'meat & potatoes' Hardwick.

 

[juss]

If Burton was our most promising youngster we don’t trade him.

It’s that simple, juss.

Oh how it changes now. Read how Hawks fans used to talk about him. If he wasn't your most promising youngster who is? Either way he was one of them, in the top few.

And my post was in response to another over the top bias Hawk fan, who seemed to imply every single thing Hawthorn did all the time was perfect and the envy of all others.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Oh how it changes now. Read how Hawks fans used to talk about him. If he wasn't your most promising youngster who is? Either way he was one of them, in the top few.

And my post was in response to another over the top bias Hawk fan, who seemed to imply every single thing Hawthorn did all the time was perfect and the envy of all others.

Of course it changes now, we chose to trade Burton when approached. That’s a pretty clear indicator that the club didn’t view him as the most promising youngster on the list or else we tell Port where to go.

The guy who finished 2nd in the B&F and the one who finished 10th and who would’ve most likely been AA if not for missing 5 games, would be the most promising I’d have thought.

 

[juss]

Of course it changes now, we chose to trade Burton when approached. That’s a pretty clear indicator that the club didn’t view him as the most promising youngster on the list or else we tell Port where to go.

The guy who finished 2nd in the B&F and the one who finished 10th and who would’ve most likely been AA if not for missing 5 games, would be the most promising I’d have thought.

Sicily is 24 in a month so naturally more established. Thats not really young in footballing terms, most guns are established by that age. So basically you traded your second most promising youngster.

But I still laugh at all the Hawks fans, 3 months ago he was set for a career of great heights but suddenly now hes seen as no great loss. It's honestly hilarious to see how hes spoken about because hes now no longer at the club. Go back and read posts on him, the change is laughable.

 

[Bombfire]

Sicily is 24 in a month so naturally more established. Thats not really young in footballing terms, most guns are established by that age. So basically you traded your second most promising youngster.

But I still laugh at all the Hawks fans, 3 months ago he was set for a career of great heights but suddenly now hes seen as no great loss. It's honestly hilarious to see how hes spoken about because hes now no longer at the club. Go back and read posts on him, the change is laughable.

It’s hilarious how much the valuation of Burton has deteriorated in a few short weeks.
Those jokers at Glenferrie have been Winged.
Sold the farm for a reluctant footballer who is absolutely heartbroken to have been moved out of Alberton and sold at a heavily inflated price to the suckers in brown and gold.
Once Hinkley gets moved on, would not surprise to see Wingerz return to Alberton and play with Burt’s.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Sicily is 24 in a month so naturally more established. Thats not really young in footballing terms, most guns are established by that age. So basically you traded your second most promising youngster.

I reckon it’s pretty clear to see that the club didn’t rate him in the top 3 youngsters on the list, as we chose to trade him.

But I still laugh at all the Hawks fans, 3 months ago he was set for a career of great heights but suddenly now hes seen as no great loss. It's honestly hilarious to see how hes spoken about because hes now no longer at the club. Go back and read posts on him, the change is laughable.

Is it really that laughable that some fans thought he was set for big things but now they don’t after realizing the club didn’t rate him as highly? I would’ve thought that was a pretty logical conclusion to draw.

Throughout 2018 Hawthorn fans drew conclusions for his average year. We thought that on the occasions that he double grabbed the ball, coughed it under pressure and/or got beaten to the ball on the back of his ankle niggle or dealing with the fallout of the headknock to Higgins, that he would return to his 2017 form in time.

The club obviously think he’s not going to be the gamechanging key position or midfielder that we hoped and traded him.

Laughable? No.
Logical? Yes.

 

[Bombfire]

So many to choose from!

View attachment 593907

Did they really let go of Hodgey’s replacement?
Clarko has lost it.

 

[Hawk_francais]

Negative.

Jetta, May, Lever, Hibberd, Salem, and the final "tall" McDonald. There's no room for the 'meat & potatoes' Hardwick.

Hardwick's career has so far been exactly like Stratton's early years. He's desperate, courageous, spoils well against bigger opponents, tackles ferociously, can do a shut down job but is also very clean with ball in hand, rarely makes a mistake and is one of our better kicks. At the moment I think he's a young player who is capitalising on his talent and thriving in the Hawks system, but it'll take a few years to start getting credit from oppo fans.

Fwiw I think Hawks have enough talent to win the flag next year, but talent is about one third of the law.

 

[juss]

I reckon it’s pretty clear to see that the club didn’t rate him in the top 3 youngsters on the list, as we chose to trade him.



Is it really that laughable that some fans thought he was set for big things but now they don’t after realizing the club didn’t rate him as highly? I would’ve thought that was a pretty logical conclusion to draw.

Throughout 2018 Hawthorn fans drew conclusions for his average year. We thought that on the occasions that he double grabbed the ball, coughed it under pressure and/or got beaten to the ball on the back of his ankle niggle or dealing with the fallout of the headknock to Higgins, that he would return to his 2017 form in time.

The club obviously think he’s not going to be the gamechanging key position or midfielder that we hoped and traded him.

Laughable? No.
Logical? Yes.

Sure if you look at your club with a blind gullible they can do no wrong view, then yeah your post makes sense. Basically you had an opinion but uh oh better backtrack because we couldn’t possibly ever consider the club might have done something that isn’t a Clarko-genius-inspired-everyone-else-is-an-idiot-move

It’s funny how calling out Burtons flaws is in fashion now. He didn’t have them a few months ago, that’s the hilarious part. It’s weak and lacks conviction.

 

[jackenny]

Burton will be a star half-back flanker. That's why he was used to trade in Wingard (who already is a star forward, and developing into a star midfielder). It's not like the Hawks could hope to use Timmy O'Brien as currency. Wingard also fills a need for the Hawks better than Burton. That is to say, Burton can play a forward role, too - but he's always looked most at home as a half-back at AFL level, and Wingard has always looked more at home as a forward.

 

[Trav 20]

I reckon it’s pretty clear to see that the club didn’t rate him in the top 3 youngsters on the list, as we chose to trade him.



Is it really that laughable that some fans thought he was set for big things but now they don’t after realizing the club didn’t rate him as highly? I would’ve thought that was a pretty logical conclusion to draw.

Throughout 2018 Hawthorn fans drew conclusions for his average year. We thought that on the occasions that he double grabbed the ball, coughed it under pressure and/or got beaten to the ball on the back of his ankle niggle or dealing with the fallout of the headknock to Higgins, that he would return to his 2017 form in time.

The club obviously think he’s not going to be the gamechanging key position or midfielder that we hoped and traded him.

Laughable? No.
Logical? Yes.

So I've established where we differ.

I judge players using my eyes. You judge them based on club trading decisions.

We're both happy, I guess.

 

[Geelong_Sicko]

Can Hawthorn succeed while ignoring the elite end of the draft? Speaking as a Geelong supporter let's hope not!! I see they've got Nissan as a new major sponsor, and have been after this sweet deal (plus possible naming rights) for a good long while now.

https://www.carcomplaints.com/Nissan/Rogue/

I for one embrace the new Hawthorn Rogues!

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Sure if you look at your club with a blind gullible they can do no wrong view, then yeah your post makes sense. Basically you had an opinion but uh oh better backtrack because we couldn’t possibly ever consider the club might have done something that isn’t a Clarko-genius-inspired-everyone-else-is-an-idiot-move

It’s funny how calling out Burtons flaws is in fashion now. He didn’t have them a few months ago, that’s the hilarious part. It’s weak and lacks conviction.

You seem a bit agitated by basic logic.

If Burton was Hawthorns most promising youngster, he doesn’t get traded.
It’s really that simple.

Just because Hawthorn posters didn’t come to the main board to share their concerns on Burtons season does not mean they did not have them - plenty did admit his 2018 was not as good as his 2017. He certainly did have flaws throughout the season and plenty of posters on the Hawk board questioned his output there and the reasons for it.

He’ll probably go on to be a pretty good player for Port but it’s pretty clear to see Hawthorn did not think he was going to be an absolute topliner or else they simply do not trade him. That’s pretty basic rationale.

 

[Gralin]

So I've established where we differ.

I judge players using my eyes. You judge them based on club trading decisions.

We're both happy, I guess.

funnily enough Abasi was one of those concerned about Burto way before trade period based on using his eyes.

I'm a little more one eyed than him, was backing him to turn it around until we traded him, bit hard to become a Hawthorn champion now

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

funnily enough Abasi was one of those concerned about Burto way before trade period based on using his eyes.

I'm a little more one eyed than him, was backing him to turn it around until we traded him, bit hard to become a Hawthorn champion now

Yep, I wouldn’t say I advocated trading him, but I certainly wasn’t opposed to it, as you know.

 

[Bunk Moreland]

Geelong haven't had a pick from the elite end of the draft for 3 decades plus. Of course Hawthorn can succeed without them.

Basically when a club turns to s**t it's over. Until they merge with another club and become a cheat team. Top 5 picks going to s**t clubs destroys the players career rather than bringing that club a premiership.

I’m not sure if you’ve read the thread but it’s about Hawthorn almost completely opting out of the Top 40 of the draft for quite a number of years. Read the OP.

Yeah, Geelong haven’t had any of those in the last 3 decades. Well, apart from Tim Kelly, Brandan Parfitt, Tom Stewart, Nakia Cockatoo, Darcy Lang, Jackson Thurlow, Cam Guthrie, Daniel Menzel, Mitch Duncan, Allan Christensen, Steven Motlop, Harry Taylor, Joel Selwood, Tom Hawkins, Trav Varcoe, Trent West, Brent Prismall, Andrew Mackie, Tom Lonergan, Jimmy Bartel, James Kelly, Steve Johnson, Gary Ablett, Joel Corey, Paul Chapman, Cameron Ling and a stack of others.

Barely used it as a form of recruiting at all. Perfect example of how you can succeed without them.

 

[Furn2]

Haven't the Hawks brought in 6 top 10 picks in the last 3 years?

 

[Leeda]

sentiment over logic... this is a level of thinking fraught with danger.

every player is charged with an over evaluation of their value. as is every club with choosing a player.

dumbells will ring with noxious weed er need about players who should or shouldn't be selected.

 

[Luv_our_club]

It’s hilarious how much the valuation of Burton has deteriorated in a few short weeks.

You really mean the influx of compliments that have been paid to Burton by Essendon supporters since he left the Hawks.