Can Pies beat Dees?

[Snowplough]

The one other forward line that is similar to ours in terms of size, strength and mobility is Fremantle's, and look how many goals you conceded to them.

Again, you make it sound like you're "goal scoring machines" with a virtually unbeatable forward line.

You have done very well in the last three games, against quality opposition. But you've kicked 11 goals or fewer in six of the other games played so far this season. That's not a forward line with a wonderful record of "size, strength and mobility". Melbourne's only kicked 11 goals or less once (and it was a game we won).

While the respective backlines show there's only 16 points total difference in points against this season, there a whopping 219 points difference in points for in favour of Melbourne. Melbourne's kicked 15 goals or more on eight occasions, as opposed to Collingwood's four.

I know whose forward line I'd much rather be on.

 

[oooze]

Yeah well said! Collingwood is inevitably on a downward spiral for many years to come with not much exciting talent come through. Carlton and Collingwood will be towards the bottom of the ladder atleast for another 2 or 3 years. Very very bad future ahead. Collingwood reminds me of Carlton after they won the wiz fiz grand final and they thought that they had arrived again as a powerhouse football club. How so wrong they were!

 

[RoccaByeBaby]

Melbourne have won more games. Simple as that.



..we are higher on the ladder irrespective of whether we win lose or draw this game.

BFD Coooooze you are higher on the ladder, where were the EAGLES & GEEL much higher than the PIES. Bring on Her Majesty's birthday cake and we will have a feast.

 

[rick James]

If Whelan takes Cara, Dids steps up, its just like the Dees fans argument about Yze and Robbo.

Well yeah, except, like, Yze and Robbo actually kick a lot of goals and are good players.

 

[hotpie]

Yeah well said! Collingwood is inevitably on a downward spiral for many years to come with not much exciting talent come through.

Thats because we didnt chuck games after playing finals the year before and pick up Sylvia nd McLean.

 

[hotpie]

The fact is, Tarrant kicks a lot more goals than Miller, and moves a hell of a lot more than Neitz, while being just about twice as mobile either of them.

Three goals from Tarrant > Six goals from Neitz because of the way he creates opportunites for other forwards to score. Taz is not a selfish "kick it to me" kind of player. Big fat logs like Neitz Gehrig and Lloyd are a thing of the past. They'll occassionally nail a bag and keep their spot in the eight, but most times they'll be a waste of space.

 

[Vinnie Vegas]

You have done very well in the last three games, against quality opposition. But you've kicked 11 goals or fewer in six of the other games played so far this season. That's not a forward line with a wonderful record of "size, strength and mobility". Melbourne's only kicked 11 goals or less once (and it was a game we won).

The last three gamesa re the only relevant ones, because guys like Rusling and Cloke weren't playing before that, Didak and Fraser were out injured, and midfielders like Brodie Holland, Tarkyn Lockyer and Shane O'Bree were horribly out of form.

All of these things have turned around in recent weeks, and we've started winning. The reason we ignore the earlier games is that there were a lot of things going on with the team that are now no longer a factor.

 

[Lockyer24]

Again, you make it sound like you're "goal scoring machines" with a virtually unbeatable forward line.

You have done very well in the last three games, against quality opposition. But you've kicked 11 goals or fewer in six of the other games played so far this season. That's not a forward line with a wonderful record of "size, strength and mobility". Melbourne's only kicked 11 goals or less once (and it was a game we won).

While the respective backlines show there's only 16 points total difference in points against this season, there a whopping 219 points difference in points for in favour of Melbourne. Melbourne's kicked 15 goals or more on eight occasions, as opposed to Collingwood's four.

I know whose forward line I'd much rather be on.

Correct we scored 10 goals every week for the first 7 odd rounds of the year but that was before Travis Cloke started to fill the void left by Rocca and Didak returned. Since then we have got an extra 4 goals a game out of these two guys (Egan and Rusling chipped in with a few too) and we have found the right balance finally to kick a winning score.

We know full well if we slip back into a defensive minded gameplan you will outscore us. Our excitement is based purely on our last month or so of football.

There is no doubt over the season you have gotten more output from your forwards for a number of reasons, most notably your midfield giving you more opportunity and the fact you have always had an attacking mindset.

Many people say our backline is rubbish simply by looking at the unflattering points against column. If you compare this to how competitive weve been (2 kicks away from having a 6-5 record) despite being pummelled in the midfield most weeks and the amount of times the ball has entered our defensive 50 you would come to appreciate the efforts of Clement Presti Wakelin and co as we have who watch them each week.

The Dees side that was going around between 88-90 I rate higher than the current team and we all know that group never won a flag. Takes a great team to win it all, ease up on the arrogance Dees fans cos youve been also-rans before and Id hate to see you never reach your potential by getting big heads

 

[FIGJAM]

Well yeah, except, like, Yze and Robbo actually kick a lot of goals and are good players.

No trolling here Rick James, or I'm going to hav to give you a Charlie Murphy spin kick to the chest!!

 

[rick James]

Logically, Melbourne should win by 100+.

Melbourne's Defensive 50 is, according to the stats published today, the second best at repelling entries into the 50 without conceding a goal.

Collingwood's is 4th last.

Melbourne' tall backmen aren't the best going around, but our defenseive set up is good, without being great. Our small backmen in Whelan and Brown are the best in the comp and combine very well.

Mid sized backmen we do quite well also, Wheatley is underrated like buggery, Bizzel is very good as a running backmen and at helping nicho and co out for spoils.

Rivers is the cream of our backline, but is still developing. all in all, we aren't the most talented bunch, but as a unit they are quite effective. People who don't know anything about us underrate our backline because it looks weak on paper.

p.s. there is no way your midfield will have a chance if you try to dirty up our midfield. Sydney tried, and lost. Adelaide tried, and lost. Kangaroos tried it, and lost. Richmond tried, and lost.

you simply don't have the midfield cattle to go hard at it against McLean, Moloney, McDonald, Sylvia, Bell, Brown and Green all day. With The cream brigade of Yze, Johnstone, Bruce and co. running riot through the centre.

McLean and McDonald combined for 25 tackles against Sydney. Almost unheard of numbers, trust me, you don't want it to get scrappy with us.

The only way to beat us is to stack your forwardline with talent, and go out all guns and blazing and try and outscore us. That's how Freo and Hawthorn won against us.

 

[rick James]

No trolling here Rick James, or I'm going to hav to give you a Charlie Murphy spin kick to the chest!!

He's doing karate with the little kids... He smacked me? I'm rick james, he's charlie murphy.

 

[eddiesmith]

and Rick, that is how we have won the last 3 games, going for the shootout

 

[Jimi]

The last three gamesa re the only relevant ones, because guys like Rusling and Cloke weren't playing before that, Didak and Fraser were out injured, and midfielders like Brodie Holland, Tarkyn Lockyer and Shane O'Bree were horribly out of form.

All of these things have turned around in recent weeks, and we've started winning. The reason we ignore the earlier games is that there were a lot of things going on with the team that are now no longer a factor.

All our losses this season have been irrelevent because we have been missing Bruce, Miller, Neitz, Whelan, Read and Nicho(among others on different days). While Bizzel, Brown, Davey, Rivers and White have all been out of form. Thank god we can ignore those losses and only look at our wins...looks like we are 8-0. WHOOPDEE ********IN DOO!!!

 

[Snowplough]

The Dees side that was going around between 88-90 I rate higher than the current team and we all know that group never won a flag. Takes a great team to win it all, ease up on the arrogance Dees fans cos youve been also-rans before and Id hate to see you never reach your potential by getting big heads

Personally I rate this Melbourne team higher than the 1988 one (it's also a bigger step forward over the 2000 one). Much more even, with more options and they play harder. But I agree, the last thing you want to be is cocky (go to West Coast boards at the moment to see that).

I've been following the Demons since the mid-50s, and have seen the highs and the lows. If you've made as many finals as Melbourne has in the last couple of decades without success, and lost two Grand Finals by 60+ points, you're bound to be always thinking the worst. The main thing is to believe they can do it and then get the winning run, much like the Pies of 1990.

Of course, no team is going to be undefeated from here in. It's all about percentages, and if the Pies beat Melbourne it's not the end of our road. It might be the end of the Pies road if the result is the obverse though.

 

[FIGJAM]

It might be the end of the Pies road if the result is the obverse though.

Is an obverse some kind of parallel dimension??

 

[rick James]

and Rick, that is how we have won the last 3 games, going for the shootout

and that's exactly why you're a chance to win. If you guys back yourselves, I think you're in with a chance.

I just think it's a misconception that melbourne, with our potent forward line, are the kings of shoot out style games. Most of our big wins have come when teams try to slow us down and we get like a 15 minute run and blow them out of the water.

good luck, should be a cracker.

 

[FIGJAM]

Gunna be damp and windy. Should have a bearing.

None of us are underestimating Melboure Rick James you ***** mother******!!

 

[Vinnie Vegas]

It's all about percentages, and if the Pies beat Melbourne it's not the end of our road. It might be the end of the Pies road if the result is the obverse though.

We probably have to go 7-4, or more realistically, 8-3 to make the finals, so while this would be a blow, it wouldn't mean we'd give up. If we lose one out of every 4 matches from here, we'll make the finals.

 

[Art Corvelay]

LOL at all of the Melbourne supporters who said they should 'win' because they are on top of us

You were on top of the ladder last year, i don't recall seeing a Premiership Cup down at the MFC?


On a serious note, I think we match up well on Melbourne. Yes you guys are a classy side and have been playing well, and you deserve to be favourites, but I wouldn't underestimate us.

However, people saying we are playing 'above' ourselfs is crap. According to most we played 'above' ourselves in 2002 and 2003.

I'm looking forward to it, should be a great game!

 

[morgues]

Most of what has been said by both Melbourne and Collingwood supporters echos my thoughts about this game. I am not confident that we will win, I am hoping that we play with the same vigour as the last few weeks. Its so heartening to see the boys play how they have been; made me a bit of money too. I put $10 on the Pies vs Eagles at the local pub, and walked away with $65.

Anyway, it SHOULD be a cracker of a game, and although I did tip us this weekend, as long as we are competitive, regardless of the result, I look forward to it.

Go pies!

 

[Jabso]

FFS you snowbunnies noone is saying your backline is crap just that your tall backmen will be troubled when matching up against our tall forwards due to their mobility.
Tarrant plays a game actually quite similar to Hird when in the forward line (except he leads more), he has a licence to roam wherever he wants.
Tarrant may not be a goalkicking god but never has been, it wasn't that long ago (around 2000-2003) that many people believed the role of the full forward was dying and that we will never have a big bag kicking forward. Now the role is back every player in the forward line is expected to kick bags or else its not a good game.
The facts are so much of what Tarrant does directly results in goals:
Tarrants long leads creates options that werent there and space for other people to float into which creates goals
Tarrant keeps the ball in with pressure unlike many forwards which creates goals
Tarrant hardly ever goes to ground and collects the ball cleanly and keeps the ball in the forward line which in turn creates goals.

IMO there are 2 types of key forwards. The input ones and the output ones. The input ones have key hands in creating goals and the output ones kick the goals mostly generated from the teams hard work. Tarrant and Miller are input forwards and others that get a fair share of possesions, while the likes of Neitz, Fevola, Williams are output forwards, they will get 10 possesions and could kick 6 goals. Input forwards have more influence on the game but output forwards are important as well. In top form obviously forwards do both, but when they are just travelling or out of form you can tell what kind of forward the are.

 

[Tazza takn ahanga]

Lol...
I reckon oooze, has mistakenly overated his melbourne side as being anything but a pretender..
I can guarantee with a full list our midfielders can more then handle and beat there midfield!
I mean I wonder if our guys can hold down such greats like godfrey,motlop and read!
Just worry bout Bux, Burns, Lica...etc
By the way If I ever had a queens b'day wish it would be to play "Nicho" on Tazza, like he has in the past I beleive tazza kicked 7 on both those occasions..and nicho's shoulders were quite good for taz to sit on if my recollections are correct..

Pies 4 in a row!

 

[MarkT]

Melbourne are yet to prove they have any mental strength after being mentally soft for some time. They have some talent but they are very gettable. Whether we are good enough to do the getting remains to be seen. If Collingwood win it has to be back to the drawing board for Melbourne though. If Melbourne win it conforms Collingwood need to turn over 12 or so players and find a midfield.

I am really looking forward to seeing how Travis handles some real attention which I presume he will get. We might learn a bit about our future on Monday.

 

[hotpie]

Never mind Tarrant or Didak - who's going to match up on Buckley???

 

[rick James]

Lol...
I reckon oooze, has mistakenly overated his melbourne side as being anything but a pretender..
I can guarantee with a full list our midfielders can more then handle and beat there midfield!
I mean I wonder if our guys can hold down such greats like godfrey,motlop and read!
Just worry bout Bux, Burns, Lica...etc
By the way If I ever had a queens b'day wish it would be to play "Nicho" on Tazza, like he has in the past I beleive tazza kicked 7 on both those occasions..and nicho's shoulders were quite good for taz to sit on if my recollections are correct..

Pies 4 in a row!

Godfrey motlop and Read aren't in our best 22.

Any game we have lost this year has been precisely because we've been playing people like Godfrey and Motlop.

Johnstone, Bruce, Green, Moloney, McDonald, McLean, Sylvia > Buckley, Licuria, Burns..etc

Taz has never kicked 7 on nicho, he kickced 7 on broadbridge. The only time Taz has played nicho ne kicked 2 goals. If he kicks 2 on Monday you will lose.