Expansion Canberra

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Canberra doesn't really get cold (the minuses anyway) until the early hours of the morning.

Light Rail won't be going through Manuka, at least it's included not in the current plan.

If Canberra gets an AFL Team I'd be pretty certain that Manuka would get an upgrade, including improving the access to and from the ground, or a new stadium would be constructed in an area that could provide better access.
 
DEVO said:
Canberra doesn't really get cold (the minuses anyway) until the early hours of the morning.

Light Rail won't be going through Manuka, at least it's included not in the current plan.

If Canberra gets an AFL Team I'd be pretty certain that Manuka would get an upgrade, including improving the access to and from the ground, or a new stadium would be constructed in an area that could provide better access.
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It SNOWED at a game last year lol. But yeah point taken about it dropping over night, still 5 degrees or less at night ain’t great for watching live sport - See Brumbies’ games

I mean the buses are ok to and from the ground but not sure if they could ran that set up every second weekend.
 

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We won't be expanding anytime soon due to the covid hit, but Canberra makes sense if/when we do, trouble will be who the * want's to live in Canberra though, same goes for Tassie, it's no coincidence Geelong seem to be the team most high profile players want to play for with the beaches and easy going life style.
 
Well if tassie is the 19th side then I agree Canberra has to be the 20th team. The ACT/Canberra side wouldnt have too many travelling kms when it comes to away games as they are near sydney and Melbourne. Perth would be the only massive city they would have to travel to Along with the Northern territory.
 
DEVO said:
Another thing that perhaps needs to be taken into consideration when talking about Canberra, is the neighbouring towns and cities within 60/90 minutes of Canberra
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Very true. Googong, Murrumbateman and Bungendore are all have developments slated to pretty much double the towns' populations over the next decade and are all within 50 mins.

almuz said:
A Canberra team could work, two issues are -1) it's too cold for night games in winter and 2) logistics of getting 12K people to the stadium are pretty annoying too. Will be better once/if the light rail goes through Manuka.
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I think both of these would be solved by ensuring footy is catered for in the new stadium plans. The current plan is for a 20-30k undercover stadium at Civic, or possibly Epic. Earlier articles implied it would cater for oval sports, but renderings over the past few years suggest only rectangular sports will be able to play there. Getting this stadium to an oval configuration would negate the cold and transport issues, and also allow for larger crowds when they grow.

The AFL needs to get on board while it's still in the planning stages. It should team up with Cricket Australia who should dangle a BBL franchise as a sweetener. Otherwise it will be another 30-40 years before another stadium is built and footy can be a central part of the city's infrastructure. Manuka has its limits. The Giants submitted a plan to upgrade it to 19,000 (I believe with just private funding), but locals shut it down.
 
Lip Gallagher said:
We won't be expanding anytime soon due to the covid hit, but Canberra makes sense if/when we do, trouble will be who the fu** want's to live in Canberra though, same goes for Tassie, it's no coincidence Geelong seem to be the team most high profile players want to play for with the beaches and easy going life style.
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I've lived in Adelaide and Toronto (about 6 million people) and I think Canberra is still my favourite place to have lived. It's small, but because of its importance nationally, and the higher incomes, it has the amenities of a bigger city, but it's still just 15 minutes to get anywhere. It gets a bad wrap, but the majority of people I know who have moved here for work have loved it (there's just a couple of Sydneysiders that can't love anything that's not Sydney).

We also have a decent amount of talent coming out of the region, which will come to grow with a new team. There are currently have 20-25 players from Canberra and the Riverina on current lists. That talent currently gets funnelled to GWS, but I'm sure a lot of those kids in the small Riverina towns would love to be playing three hours closer to home.
 
Canberra Pear said:
I think both of these would be solved by ensuring footy is catered for in the new stadium plans. The current plan is for a 20-30k undercover stadium at Civic, or possibly Epic. Earlier articles implied it would cater for oval sports, but renderings over the past few years suggest only rectangular sports will be able to play there. Getting this stadium to an oval configuration would negate the cold and transport issues, and also allow for larger crowds when they grow.

The AFL needs to get on board while it's still in the planning stages. It should team up with Cricket Australia who should dangle a BBL franchise as a sweetener. Otherwise it will be another 30-40 years before another stadium is built and footy can be a central part of the city's infrastructure. Manuka has its limits. The Giants submitted a plan to upgrade it to 19,000 (I believe with just private funding), but locals shut it down.
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A stadium in the city would be a game changer, kind of like the refurb to Adelaide Oval. There are talks of a rectangular stadium being put in where the pool in Civic but imagine how good a footy oval would be there within a bees dick of town. Being realistic, the size of a 30K seater footy oval in that small space would be an issue though.

Epic wouldn't be too shabby but feel it has the same probably as Bruce - not central enough. Either getting creative and expanding Manuka or finding a space close to Civic would be the best options and look awesome for any AFL team proposal.
 
almuz said:
A stadium in the city would be a game changer, kind of like the refurb to Adelaide Oval. There are talks of a rectangular stadium being put in where the pool in Civic but imagine how good a footy oval would be there within a bees dick of town. Being realistic, the size of a 30K seater footy oval in that small space would be an issue though.

Epic wouldn't be too shabby but feel it has the same probably as Bruce - not central enough. Either getting creative and expanding Manuka or finding a space close to Civic would be the best options and look awesome for any AFL team proposal.
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That would be incredible if it could happen! There were loose plans about three or four years ago to actually lower Parkes Way and turn it into a tunnel. The idea was that everybody could walk straight from the city to the lakeshore without a big freeway in the middle. May not be on the cards in a post-Covid world, but that would probably be necessary to give Civic enough room for an oval.

Epic would be better for space, and could probably get more bang for the buck, but I agree it's a bit remote. It's on the tram line, so still more accessible than Manuka or Bruce, but that still really only benefits northsiders until that's extended.

Manuka is still relatively central, so it's still workable if that becomes the only option, but you're right, there'd definitely have to be some creative thinking regarding transport and capacity.
 
Walshawk said:
Canberra RAMS
Riverina
Albury
Murrumbidgee
Southern NSW
Could play a few games in Albury.
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As much as I love acronyms, I think it has to be a gender-neutral name with the assumption they'd have an AFLW team, too (maybe even first).

I like the name the Canberra Griffins (I know already used in the amateur divs by ANU). Everything in Canberra is named after Walter Burley Griffin anyway, so everything will already advertise them (I walked past the Griffin Centre an hour ago).

And a half-eagle half-lion is just badass.

Burley Griffin also designed two Riverina towns (Griffith and Leeton) so the connection extends there, too.

Love the idea of Albury getting games. I'd be keen for them and Wagga to both get a permanent game each. The Raiders have starting playing an annual game in Wagga, too.
 
Gigantor said:
I would suggest that the odds of Canberra having a team are even longer than Tassie having a team.
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I disagree if anything it's the opposite. I see Canberra being the 19th side and Tassie the 20th team.

Again, ACT/ Canberra was an Aussie rules state until the 1980s and 1990s when both rugby union and. Rugby league got a team there.

I can Canberra being financially viable. Manuka needs seats. Canberra can also draw some more NSW fans too
 
Gigantor said:
I would suggest that the odds of Canberra having a team are even longer than Tassie having a team.
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I agree that a Tasmanian side will be get in before Canberra. The romance of it and public opinion will get it across the line first.

Can you imagine the outrage if another team got in before Tassie?

But I still think Canberra makes more sense:
  • Canberra has double the population of Hobart
  • The Riverina as secondary area (one game each in Albury-Wodonga and Wagga) has a larger population than Launceston
  • Canberrans have greater incomes, and more free time on weekends
  • Increases dots on the map north of the Murray
  • Strength of the local league - AFL Canberra had 5 teams in the NEAFL competing against AFL reserve teams
  • Canberra/Riverina has a similar number of players in the AFL to Tasmania
I fully expect Tasmania to get a team first. But if the league has to remain an even number of teams, that's something Canberra can leverage, too.
 

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Canberra Pear said:
I agree that a Tasmanian side will be get in before Canberra. The romance of it and public opinion will get it across the line first.

Can you imagine the outrage if another team got in before Tassie?

But I still think Canberra makes more sense:
  • Canberra has double the population of Hobart
  • The Riverina as secondary area (one game each in Albury-Wodonga and Wagga) has a larger population than Launceston
  • Canberrans have greater incomes, and more free time on weekends
  • Increases dots on the map north of the Murray
  • Strength of the local league - AFL Canberra had 5 teams in the NEAFL competing against AFL reserve teams
  • Canberra/Riverina has a similar number of players in the AFL to Tasmania
I fully expect Tasmania to get a team first. But if the league has to remain an even number of teams, that's something Canberra can leverage, too.
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Also It makes sense because Manuka Oval will be used every 2 weeks. Its barley used unless its cricket season.

Also Canberra does not have to travel much when it comes to Away games unless its WA. Canberra to Sydney or Melbourne or Brisbane or Adelaide isnt that daunting or long to be honest.
 
Freomaniac said:
Also It makes sense because Manuka Oval will be used every 2 weeks. Its barley used unless its cricket season.

Also Canberra does not have to travel much when it comes to Away games unless its WA. Canberra to Sydney or Melbourne or Brisbane or Adelaide isnt that daunting or long to be honest.
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Good points. I think the Raiders even used to bus it for Sydney games.

And Canberra's location was central enough for their teams to regularly travel to Brisbane, Darwin and the Gold Coast in the NEAFL.
 
If there is serious consideration for Canberra, then the bid will need to be done in parallel with the Tassie bid so that 19 and 20 enter the comp within a year or so of each other, as was the case with Gold Coast/GWS.

I would prefer Canberra for #20, but there is currently nothing really in the works atm in regards to expanding into ACT other than it being a secondary market for the Giants who look to stick around for some time, whereas Hawthorn and North are set to leave Tassie after next year.

The AFL aren't going to be content with a 19 side comp for too long - they want the 10th weekly game, expanded finals, more rights $.

If Canberra aren't ready when Tassie are... then the quick and dirty option would be for West Perth to become WA3, trading as Joondalup.
 
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FootyJunkie said:
If there is serious consideration for Canberra, then the bid will need to be done in parallel with the Tassie bid so that 19 and 20 enter the comp within a year or so of each other, as was the case with Gold Coast/GWS.

I would prefer Canberra for #20, but there is currently nothing really in the works atm in regards to expanding into ACT other than it being a secondary market for the Giants who look to stick around for some time, whereas Hawthorn and North are set to leave Tassie after next year.

The AFL aren't going to be content with a 19 side comp for too long - they want the 10th weekly game, expanded finals, more rights $.

If Canberra aren't ready when Tassie are... then the quick and dirty option would be for West Perth to become WA3, trading as Joondalup.
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Agreed. We’d need a bid ready to go when the AFL is ready for Tasmania.

I think the best pathway would be teams in the revamped to-be-named VFL and VFLW. We’d treat it as a trial run for the real thing.

We need a new team from scratch. One for the whole AFL Canberra community (not just a rebranded Eastlake side). Go out to the public for name and uniform contributions. Get them really involved before there’s even a bounce. Then when the time comes, that team can just be promoted and there’s already a swell of support behind it.
 
Canberra Pear said:
Agreed. We’d need a bid ready to go when the AFL is ready for Tasmania.

I think the best pathway would be teams in the revamped to-be-named VFL and VFLW. We’d treat it as a trial run for the real thing.

We need a new team from scratch. One for the whole AFL Canberra community (not just a rebranded Eastlake side). Go out to the public for name and uniform contributions. Get them really involved before there’s even a bounce. Then when the time comes, that team can just be promoted and there’s already a swell of support behind it.
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My only Biggest concern about Canberra is Developing Local talent. I dont know if Canberra has a Strong local league. Again, at least they got a good ground at Manuka oval.

Yes Tassie has got some Advantages. They got 2 grounds that are AFL standard. They also have a half dcent state league to recruit local talent.
 
Freomaniac said:
My only Biggest concern about Canberra is Developing Local talent. I dont know if Canberra has a Strong local league. Again, at least they got a good ground at Manuka oval.

Yes Tassie has got some Advantages. They got 2 grounds that are AFL standard. They also have a half dcent state league to recruit local talent.
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If you include the Riverina in Canberra's recruitment zone, Canberra would have a pretty decent list. Only five of those are from Canberra though. Considering they're currently competing against two pro rugby teams, you'd have to think a permanent team would help increase local players down the track.

If you include Canberra, and anything in NSW west of Canberra, I count 27 current (at least according to this website) players. Some impressive talent too. Tom Hawkins up front, Phil Davis down back. You'd assume they'd have a better chance of retaining Riverina talent than GWS as Canberra team would be three hours closer to their home towns.

Canberra's league is pretty strong. It's no WAFL or SANFL, but they managed to hold their own with five NEAFL teams playing against AFL reserve teams. Not sure how Tasmania's local league is for comparison.

Manuka is actually my biggest concern. It's too small at the moment, and not a lot of scope for much expansion. It's also not overly convenient to get to.
 
Canberra Pear said:
If you include the Riverina in Canberra's recruitment zone, Canberra would have a pretty decent list. Only five of those are from Canberra though. Considering they're currently competing against two pro rugby teams, you'd have to think a permanent team would help increase local players down the track.

If you include Canberra, and anything in NSW west of Canberra, I count 27 current (at least according to this website) players. Some impressive talent too. Tom Hawkins up front, Phil Davis down back. You'd assume they'd have a better chance of retaining Riverina talent than GWS as Canberra team would be three hours closer to their home towns.

Canberra's league is pretty strong. It's no WAFL or SANFL, but they managed to hold their own with five NEAFL teams playing against AFL reserve teams. Not sure how Tasmania's local league is for comparison.

Manuka is actually my biggest concern. It's too small at the moment, and not a lot of scope for much expansion. It's also not overly convenient to get to.
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on tv Manuka oval looks nice. I assumed there no trains or teams that go to that ground? Only buses?
 
Freomaniac said:
on tv Manuka oval looks nice. I assumed there no trains or teams that go to that ground? Only buses?
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Don't get me wrong, it's definitely a nice ground. It's only got a capacity of 14k though so it would require a decent upgrade to be a permanent home ground.

There's no trains in Canberra. There's the one tram line that opened last year that goes to the northern suburbs. I think there's a plan to go out near Manuka eventually, and possibly get within 1km of the ground, but there are four or five routes that will be built first, so I wouldn't expect it before 2040.

I drive to most games and parking isn't terrible, but it's a bit of a walk, which would be more of an issue with greater capacity. I've never taken one, but the buses seem plentiful.

These issues can probably be solved with some creative thinking, but I think the best shot would be to be included in plans for a stadium in the city (currently planned with just a rectangular configuration). Easy to get to, larger capacity, and possibly undercover.
 
I'd prefer a Northern Territory team first. Doubt it'll happen though.
 
Lip Gallagher said:
We won't be expanding anytime soon due to the covid hit, but Canberra makes sense if/when we do, trouble will be who the fu** want's to live in Canberra though, same goes for Tassie, it's no coincidence Geelong seem to be the team most high profile players want to play for with the beaches and easy going life style.
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Canberra seems to be able to recruit pretty for there Nrl and super rugby teams they don’t seem to have trouble also it’s a reasonable close commute to Sydney and the ski. Fields not like it’s in the middle of nowhere Tassie also has plenty of good surf beaches and the weather ain’t that different to Geelong remember not everyone wants to live in big cities
 
Genghis Tron said:
I'd prefer a Northern Territory team first. Doubt it'll happen though.
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The NT would be far too small unfortunately. Darwin's only got a third of the population of Canberra.

I think the best bet would be combining with North Queensland for a Northern Rovers/Wanderers/Crocs (name not important).

3 games in Cairns
3 in Townsville
3 in Darwin
2 in Alice. Or maybe 1 and a floating game
And Alice gets the early or late season games to help avoid the wet season.

You'd combine a few areas that would have no chance on their own.
 
Canberra Pear said:
The NT would be far too small unfortunately. Darwin's only got a third of the population of Canberra.

I think the best bet would be combining with North Queensland for a Northern Rovers/Wanderers/Crocs (name not important).

3 games in Cairns
3 in Townsville
3 in Darwin
2 in Alice. Or maybe 1 and a floating game
And Alice gets the early or late season games to help avoid the wet season.

You'd combine a few areas that would have no chance on their own.
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I'm not against it at all, anything that gets us closer to a team in all states and territories is OK in my book. My only issue would be in that scenario where is the teams home? In any club that shares states.

It's a shame the market is so small up in NT because in my time living in Darwin and living in townsville, Darwin is far more footy mad. NT is more footy mad than Queensland (by miles) but there's just not enough money in it.

No disrespect to Canberra either. I know they love their footy. It's just that the love NT has for the game (not to mention the talent pool up there) has me feeling like they deserve a team.

Having a team across the Northern states called the wanderers could be interesting though. I just don't know if it would work having a team across borders.
 
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