Expansion Canberra

[Canberra Pear]

The a league would be nuts to expand though wouldn't they? Already struggling.

If there's an A-League expansion, Canberra would be a front runner. We have the only women's team without a men's counterpart.

There have been talks for A-League expansion, but I think they've been a bit disrupted after the recent Sydney grand final and pitch invasion debacles.

But I honestly wouldn't be worried about an A-League team in Canberra. It pretty much runs in the opposite season, so not really competing for fans or media. Tbh, it'd be good to have another thing to do in the summer (the women's team is just too far in Tuggeranong).

 

[MelbourneGWS]

If there's an A-League expansion, Canberra would be a front runner. We have the only women's team without a men's counterpart.

But I honestly wouldn't be worried about an A-League team in Canberra. It pretty much runs in the opposite season, so not really competing for fans or media. Tbh, it'd be good to have another thing to do in the summer (the women's team is just too far in Tuggeranong).

Thanks - good point and agree about something additional to do during summer. There will however, be another team to compete with on government funding, and another reason for them to prioritise a Bruce stadium upgrade over Manuka?

 

[Canberra Pear]

Thanks - good point and agree about something additional to do during summer. There will however, be another team to compete with on government funding, and another reason for them to prioritise a Bruce stadium upgrade over Manuka?

Personally, I don't see it creating much of an issue.

The government funding for GWS won't stop if the A-League team comes in; the ACT government recognises a return on investment.

If a Canberra AFL team comes, you'd assume similar funding would transfer from GWS to the new team. As far as I can tell, there's no government area that gives grants to an AFL team playing at their primary ground (until Tasmania joins), so any government funding is just gravy.

The stadium continues to be the issue, but I don't think an A-League team really makes a difference. We already have two pro teams using Bruce, it's already a priority.

What's your view on Bruce v Civic? It looks to me like Bruce is being favoured right now.

I wonder if Bruce is to be redeveloped instead of Civic, how much money that will free up in the infrastructure budget. The higher end estimates of Civic were around $700m. Bruce would have to be $100-200m cheaper.

Manuka could be redeveloped pretty cheaply (the masterplan says ~$56m). Given the AFL will contribute $15m to Tasmania, and contributed similar amounts to Giants and Metricon Stadium, there'd only need to be ~$40m of government funding.

Also, if Bruce is redeveloped, the Raiders/Brumbies/A-League team will need somewhere else in Canberra that could host 20k while construction goes on. Manuka might need to be upgraded first to give them somewhere to play in the interim.

 

[MelbourneGWS]

The stadium continues to be the issue, but I don't think an A-League team really makes a difference. We already have two pro teams using Bruce, it's already a priority.

What's your view on Bruce v Civic? It looks to me like Bruce is being favoured right now.

I wonder if Bruce is to be redeveloped instead of Civic, how much money that will free up in the infrastructure budget. The higher end estimates of Civic were around $700m. Bruce would have to be $100-200m cheaper.

Manuka could be redeveloped pretty cheaply (the masterplan says ~$56m). Given the AFL will contribute $15m to Tasmania, and contributed similar amounts to Giants and Metricon Stadium, there'd only need to be ~$40m of government funding.

Also, if Bruce is redeveloped, the Raiders/Brumbies/A-League team will need somewhere else in Canberra that could host 20k while construction goes on. Manuka might need to be upgraded first to give them somewhere to play in the interim.

Yes, I think Barr favours a Bruce redevelopment but there seems to be private sector support for Civic. I hope it’s Bruce, as that means more money for a Manuka upgrade!

 

[Tasmanian saint]

Personally, I don't see it creating much of an issue.

The government funding for GWS won't stop if the A-League team comes in; the ACT government recognises a return on investment.

If a Canberra AFL team comes, you'd assume similar funding would transfer from GWS to the new team. As far as I can tell, there's no government area that gives grants to an AFL team playing at their primary ground (until Tasmania joins), so any government funding is just gravy.

The stadium continues to be the issue, but I don't think an A-League team really makes a difference. We already have two pro teams using Bruce, it's already a priority.

What's your view on Bruce v Civic? It looks to me like Bruce is being favoured right now.

I wonder if Bruce is to be redeveloped instead of Civic, how much money that will free up in the infrastructure budget. The higher end estimates of Civic were around $700m. Bruce would have to be $100-200m cheaper.

Manuka could be redeveloped pretty cheaply (the masterplan says ~$56m). Given the AFL will contribute $15m to Tasmania, and contributed similar amounts to Giants and Metricon Stadium, there'd only need to be ~$40m of government funding.

Also, if Bruce is redeveloped, the Raiders/Brumbies/A-League team will need somewhere else in Canberra that could host 20k while construction goes on. Manuka might need to be upgraded first to give them somewhere to play in the interim.

Doesn’t Manuka only have a 12k capacity in the current climate I don’t think 56 million would go very far even budget stadiums like Metricon would be in the 300-400 million mark if built today

 

[Walshawk]

Doesn’t Manuka only have a 12k capacity in the current climate I don’t think 56 million would go very far even budget stadiums like Metricon would be in the 300-400 million mark if built today

13,500 seats plus around 2k standing/hill. $80m would be needed today to complete the current master plan - 19,800 capacity.

And there is plenty of land at Bruce, so if they build a new stadium there, they could keep using the current one and build next door. They wouldn’t need Manuka.

 

[Canberra Pear]

Doesn’t Manuka only have a 12k capacity in the current climate I don’t think 56 million would go very far even budget stadiums like Metricon would be in the 300-400 million mark if built today

Our highest crowd was 14,974, but anything over 14k is usually considered a sell-out.

It wouldn't cost as much as Metricon because upgrades on Manuka began, they just stalled.

The masterplan was done in 2009, and the estimated budget totalled $89m. Metricon started planning at a similar time and cost $144.2m.

The first phases were done in the early 2010s, equalling ~$43.5m. The undone phases of Manuka Oval had a predicted cost of $45.5m, which in 2023 equals about $66.2m.

It would probably blow out a bit, but it shows it could be made AFL-standard relatively cheaply.

 

[MelbourneGWS]

Behind a paywall but it seems that with 2 Canberra soccer clubs (Croatia and Gunghalin) expressing interest, there will almost certainly a Canberra team in the soccer national second division when it starts in 2024. With Canberra United in the Aleague female league, there will be increased pressure on our ACT government to provide funding to the Canberra team in the national second division.

Canberra clubs in mix for national second division

Canberra's edging closer to an A-League Men's team, but it could have a club in the national second...

www.canberratimes.com.au

 

[Aussie in exile]

Behind a paywall but it seems that with 2 Canberra soccer clubs (Croatia and Gunghalin) expressing interest, there will almost certainly a Canberra team in the soccer national second division when it starts in 2024. With Canberra United in the Aleague female league, there will be increased pressure on our ACT government to provide funding to the Canberra team in the national second division.

Canberra clubs in mix for national second division

Canberra's edging closer to an A-League Men's team, but it could have a club in the national second...

www.canberratimes.com.au

Non surprise to me

 

[Walshawk]

Behind a paywall but it seems that with 2 Canberra soccer clubs (Croatia and Gunghalin) expressing interest, there will almost certainly a Canberra team in the soccer national second division when it starts in 2024. With Canberra United in the Aleague female league, there will be increased pressure on our ACT government to provide funding to the Canberra team in the national second division.

Canberra clubs in mix for national second division

Canberra's edging closer to an A-League Men's team, but it could have a club in the national second...

www.canberratimes.com.au

Domestic soccer won’t make a blip in the Canberra market. A div 2 team would be lucky to draw crowds of 2k @ GIO. Who would be doing the pressuring?

 

[Rob]

Behind a paywall but it seems that with 2 Canberra soccer clubs (Croatia and Gunghalin) expressing interest, there will almost certainly a Canberra team in the soccer national second division when it starts in 2024. With Canberra United in the Aleague female league, there will be increased pressure on our ACT government to provide funding to the Canberra team in the national second division.

Canberra clubs in mix for national second division

Canberra's edging closer to an A-League Men's team, but it could have a club in the national second...

www.canberratimes.com.au

I just found out that they put out an EOI about this....which was an interesting read but at no point does it provide any indication of costs involved, I.e expected payroll, who is paying for admin and travel and annual costs of simply playing in the comp.

Many years ago I lived not far from one of the 30 clubs that expressed an initial interest and 1 of 2 from Perth. Their ground was literally a flat reserve with a small ancient grandstand seating a few hundred and a cyclone fence around it. It is impossible to see how such a club could ever run a professional team in a national competition. There are probably some clubs amongst the 30 that have access to a bit more money, but what are these teams drawing a game? A few hundred or maybe a thousand? Given broadcast rights are worth zero, where's the money coming from?

I just can't see this actually getting off the ground, and if it does how's it going to last more than a couple of seasons?

 

[Coolangatta]

I just can't see this actually getting off the ground, and if it does how's it going to last more than a couple of seasons?

And the thing about failed expansion attempts I'm guessing is that they're unlikely to ever try again if it doesn't work out the first time, so there might come a day when Canberra could actually have a viable professional soccer club but they won't give it a look because they don't want to **** up again.

 

[Rob]

And the thing about failed expansion attempts I'm guessing is that they're unlikely to ever try again if it doesn't work out the first time, so there might come a day when Canberra could actually have a viable professional soccer club but they won't give it a look because they don't want to * up again.

A-League expansion is a pretty simple process.

1) Can you stump up the cash for a licence?
2) Will anyone stump up more?

They'd have a team in Mt Isa if there was someone willing to pay $20 million for a licence.

 

[Canberra Pear]

Updated population projections have just come out for the ACT in 2060.

The mid-range has the ACT reaching 784k. Which is a 70% increase from the 2021 census.

Nearby towns and NSW suburbs are also expected to grow quickly, so within an hour, Canberra will have about 900k. The Capital Region will have ~1.1m.

This means a Canberra AFL team will have plenty of room to grow alongside the city.

But if we don't get Team 20, there isn't an obvious Team 22, so it's realistic a 21st team mightn't come before 2060. Which means we could have a region of 1 million people unrepresented by a team of its own.

 

[Bjo187]

Updated population projections have just come out for the ACT in 2060.

The mid-range has the ACT reaching 784k. Which is a 70% increase from the 2021 census.

Nearby towns and NSW suburbs are also expected to grow quickly, so within an hour, Canberra will have about 900k. The Capital Region will have ~1.1m.

This means a Canberra AFL team will have plenty of room to grow alongside the city.

But if we don't get Team 20, there isn't an obvious Team 22, so it's realistic a 21st team mightn't come before 2060. Which means we could have a region of 1 million people unrepresented by a team of its own.

As you know I'm an advocate for a Canberra team, but is that actually impressive, that's 40 years away, I would have thought Canberra would be a city of 1 million people by then.

 

[Canberra Pear]

As you know I'm an advocate for a Canberra team, but is that actually impressive, that's 40 years away, I would have thought Canberra would be a city of 1 million people by then.

It's nothing spectacular, but it's growth of 70%. In that same time, Australia's population is expected to grow about 50%. So it shows we're growing about 40% faster than the rest of Australia.

Population predictions are consistently underestimated for Canberra, so I wouldn't be surprised to see that prediction revised upwards.

 

[Aussie in exile]

The a league would be nuts to expand though wouldn't they? Already struggling.

Dots on the map perhaps is there thinking perhaps

 

[Aussie in exile]

The ACT Government can't afford one new stadium, let alone two (a condition of entry would be a new, probably roofed, stadium).

Why a roofed stadium?

 

[CURVE]

Why a roofed stadium?

Because once every twenty years we get snow.

 

[Coolangatta]

If a new stadium is contingent on Canberra getting a team then say hello to a new Perth team. It shouldn’t be, but critics are going to be angry that Tasmania had to build a new one and Canberra didn’t to enter. Could actually set the foundation of an interesting sorta southern rivalry.

Then in 30+ years bring on the top end rivalry between the NT Crocs and NQLD Sharks. A man can dream.

 

[Bjo187]

'That's how we view it': Is this the dawn of the GWS-Canberra Giants?

"The closer we can have both cities see themselves as our home, the better off we're going to...

www.canberratimes.com.au

Dunno if anybody can post this.

 

[Coolangatta]

'That's how we view it': Is this the dawn of the GWS-Canberra Giants?

"The closer we can have both cities see themselves as our home, the better off we're going to...

www.canberratimes.com.au

Dunno if anybody can post this.

Behind a paywall but wouldn't be surprised if the Giants extend their Canberra contract beyond 2032.

 

[Canberra Pear]

'That's how we view it': Is this the dawn of the GWS-Canberra Giants?

"The closer we can have both cities see themselves as our home, the better off we're going to...

www.canberratimes.com.au

Dunno if anybody can post this.

It's just fluff. Fluff from an off-the-cuff comment. The Giants are in town for a camp, and they want Canberrans to think "wow, they're truly Canberran". No actual news.


Adam Kingsley suggests this could be the dawn of the GWS-Canberra Giants

There's the Cronulla-Sutherland Sharks and the Canterbury-Bankstown Bulldogs in the NRL, but could the AFL soon have the GWS-Canberra Giants?

There isn't an official team name change on the horizon - yet - however new Giants head coach Adam Kingsley said there might as well be a hyphen there.

That's how bought in he and the entire club are in adopting Canberra as their "second home" as the $28.5 million partnership with the ACT government extends another 10 years.

"Branding is not my area, but that's how we view it anyway," Kingsley said. "We view it as if there's a hyphen.

"Everyone loves coming down here, we've just got to win here too - it's as simple as that.

"We haven't been successful over the last couple of years so our challenge now is to try and re-establish Canberra as our fortress so the opposition fear coming to our second home.

"The closer we can have both cities see themselves as our home, the better off we're going to be.

"That's what we're trying to build and we've got another 10 years down here to do it, which we're excited about."

Orange-clad AFL supporters came through the gates at Alan Ray Oval in Ainslie on a sunny Saturday to watch the Giants in their intra-club match.

It officially kicked off the start of the new Canberra deal which will bring at least three AFL games and one pre-season hit-out to the ACT every year, as well as up to two AFLW games, multiple clinics, school visits, and other community engagement activities.

 

[MelbourneGWS]

It's just fluff. Fluff from an off-the-cuff comment. The Giants are in town for a camp, and they want Canberrans to think "wow, they're truly Canberran". No actual news.


Adam Kingsley suggests this could be the dawn of the GWS-Canberra Giants

There's the Cronulla-Sutherland Sharks and the Canterbury-Bankstown Bulldogs in the NRL, but could the AFL soon have the GWS-Canberra Giants?

There isn't an official team name change on the horizon - yet - however new Giants head coach Adam Kingsley said there might as well be a hyphen there.

That's how bought in he and the entire club are in adopting Canberra as their "second home" as the $28.5 million partnership with the ACT government extends another 10 years.

"Branding is not my area, but that's how we view it anyway," Kingsley said. "We view it as if there's a hyphen.

"Everyone loves coming down here, we've just got to win here too - it's as simple as that.

"We haven't been successful over the last couple of years so our challenge now is to try and re-establish Canberra as our fortress so the opposition fear coming to our second home.

"The closer we can have both cities see themselves as our home, the better off we're going to be.

"That's what we're trying to build and we've got another 10 years down here to do it, which we're excited about."

Orange-clad AFL supporters came through the gates at Alan Ray Oval in Ainslie on a sunny Saturday to watch the Giants in their intra-club match.

It officially kicked off the start of the new Canberra deal which will bring at least three AFL games and one pre-season hit-out to the ACT every year, as well as up to two AFLW games, multiple clinics, school visits, and other community engagement activities.

Yes, I don’t think there’s going to be a formal name change to GWS-Canberra Giants anytime soon. But good to see the coach and the playing group have the same personal commitment to Canberra that the club has. GWS has a new 10 year deal with us, and will be here till at least 2032.

 

[Rob]

May as well just move them to Canberra if they're going to do that.