Capital Punishment

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Relativity

Relativity

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May have been done but here goes...
Could you look me in the eye and tell me that you would not consider the ultimate retribution for the murderer of your child?
 
for sure I would, but on the other hand torturing a person mentally rather than physically could be just as satisfying. Leaving a person in cell by themselves with only their thoughts and perhaps images of the devastation they caused might be enough to truly **** them up. Making someone live for a long time with what they have done is almost more just than letting them die. I would hate the thought that my taxes were keeping the murderer of my child alive. Hopefully I'm never in that situation where this hypothetical situation ever comes true. If it did then I'd fear I'd lose the plot and end up en jail myself.
 
I don't know why Australia must be so black and white on the issue:

No death penalty, never, no way, under no circumstances. Period.

Personally, I believe that there are rare cases in this country in which the death penalty is warranted.

I am not necessarily speaking about the bridge incident yesterday, as not enough is known about the case at the moment.
 

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Relativity said:
May have been done but here goes...
Could you look me in the eye and tell me that you would not consider the ultimate retribution for the murderer of your child?
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Brian Deegan board.

In answer to your question, I certainly could.

In fact, I have been the victim of a crime in which the perpetrator admitted to intending to kill me and my parents (through good luck, I was the only one actually attacked). I don't wish death upon the person who committed the attack. That said, I won't be unhappy when he eventually passes away. That's far from wanting the machinery of the state to commit murder.
 
the death penalty and the resultant loss of life really only gives a brief sense of relief to the victims. As much as I say that I think someone should die for their crime I know that is only an emotional wish and in reality killing someone is not going to help the healing process. Is there any point in making more people suffer for the actions of another, you kill someone then that persons family has to go through the grief you are. I think a lifetime in jail (and i mean life not a 10 or 20 year hiatus) is suffice as long as they are given no luxuries. I get really annoyed when I see murderers and rapists on the news living it up in jail. so for me capital punishment probably doesn't help anyone in the long term.
 
I get sick of people saying they're 100% against the death penalty, yet scream for exceptions when certain sickening cases come up. I'm against it 100%, no matter what.
 
P.A.F.C said:
I get sick of people saying they're 100% against the death penalty, yet scream for exceptions when certain sickening cases come up. ......
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Those people clearly don't understand the meaning of 100%. I blame all of these sports people and sports commentators who talk about "giving 110%".
 
MannumPower said:
for sure I would, but on the other hand torturing a person mentally rather than physically could be just as satisfying.
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I have to agree with that, mind you the frequent beating (only to inflict pain) from a fellow prisoner wouldn't go astray.

No tv, no rights, no nothing but food and shelter.
 
^They do get tv (most likely in a limited capacity) in jail, I'm almost certain.

Also, whilst knowing very little about the prison culture, don't beatings usually occur to people depending on what crime theyre in there for, as well as how they get on with the prisoner population?

Whilst jail would be a very mentally exhausting setting to be forced to live in for the average citizen, it seems to me as though it might not even bother the hardest of criminals.
 
missionpossible said:
No tv, no rights, no nothing but food and shelter.
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what I was refering to here was what he should get, not what a prisoner currently gets.

Prisoners actually have a lot of home comforts, I just think someone who has done something bad enough that some people think they should get a death penalty for then they should get no luxuries or freedom. Thus no need for them to get tv, gym, excercise yard, etc.
 
I believe in capital punishment (where no doubt exists) for murder. And I go further and advocate combine it with compulsory organ harvesting of the murderer. Trade one scum life for saving several innocents. That's a win-win.

Or even if people don't believe in killing murderers reduce them to a prison sentence that's effectively one step up from torture then give them the option at any time to commit suicide. Again with organ donation from them. Then it's not state sanctioned murder for the squeamish, but with all the benefits of getting rid of them.
 

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^Agree with the first paragraph (in terms of no doubt existing, but also if the case's individual context is sufficiently brutal), although something tells me that the organ donation notion may somehow violate basic human rights. The organ idea in itself is good though in my opinion.
 
violate basic human rights

should they be entitled to basic human rights after they have done the ultimate violation of someone elses basic human rights. Obvious to me that the person in question does not beleive in basic human rights.
 
Andre said:
I believe in capital punishment (where no doubt exists) for murder.
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and there in lies the problem...

Where "no doubt exists". I would hope that if someone is convicted of murder and sent to jail, there would be no doubt - regardless of the severity or gruesomeness of the crime.

Capital punishment uses flawed logic, solves nothing and is merely an emotional response. State sanctioned murder won't bring the victims back, it won't allow anyone to learn from the perpetrator to prevent similar crimes. There really is no justification.

A society shouldn't be judged by the way it treats its brightest and best but by the way it treats its worst.
 
morell said:
and there in lies the problem...

Where "no doubt exists". I would hope that if someone is convicted of murder and sent to jail, there would be no doubt - regardless of the severity or gruesomeness of the crime.

Capital punishment uses flawed logic, solves nothing and is merely an emotional response. State sanctioned murder won't bring the victims back, it won't allow anyone to learn from the perpetrator to prevent similar crimes. There really is no justification.

A society shouldn't be judged by the way it treats its brightest and best but by the way it treats its worst.
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If the logic is to remove a threat to society in an economical way then how is that "flawed" and "emotional"? To call capital punishment "state sanctioned murder" is the "emotional response". What do you hope to learn from an Osama Bin Laden? That he despises Western society? That he wasn't breast fed as a baby? Some people are predisposed and destined to evil ends. Justification is subjective as is innocence. Their only effective definition is by majority opinion. Something party politics is determined not to allow.
 
Relativity said:
If the logic is to remove a threat to society in an economical way then how is that "flawed" and "emotional"?
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Its flawed because it solves nothing. It doesn't help heal the victims families whilst it can potentially destroy another, it doesn't prevent further crimes, it doesn't punish the perp. The only argument for Capital punishment is financial.

Are we really that sort of society?
Relativity said:
To call capital punishment "state sanctioned murder" is the "emotional response".
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How so? That is exactly what it is. We would be killing another human being with the permission of the state.

Relativity said:
What do you hope to learn from an Osama Bin Laden? That he despises Western society? That he wasn't breast fed as a baby?
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Are you for real? What could we learn from Bin Laden?

How about possible current or future terrorist plots?
How about learning about the power structure of al Qaeda?
How about learning what twisted his mind so greatly? (other than the glib - "he hates our freedom!!" - bile that comes from the mouths of the American inbred)

Its amusing you chose Osama, probably the one criminal in the world we could learn the most from.

Knowledge is power, the more we know about these people, the more ability we have to prevent similar types from committing similar crimes.

Relativity said:
Some people are predisposed and destined to evil ends.
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Don't know about that. most research indicates that it is a mixture of genetics and environment. How about we keep these people alive so that we can study and learn more eh?

In case you're wondering. I don't for one second think life crims should be given an easy ride. By all mean ensure their incarceration is as strict as possible.

Relativity said:
Justification is subjective as is innocence. Their only effective definition is by majority opinion. Something party politics is determined not to allow.
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Agreed. hence the point about "where no doubt exists" is completely moot.
 
Relativity said:
If the logic is to remove a threat to society in an economical way then how is that "flawed" and "emotional"? ......
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Did you read that after you wrote it? You are saying that murder for economical reasons is valid :eek:

That is the huge flaw in your logic.

That smoking hole in your foot is a dead give away :p
 
morell said:
"Its flawed because it solves nothing."

It removes a threat from society.

"It doesn't help heal the victims families..."

Neither does imprisonment.

"...it doesn't prevent further crimes,"

It does prevent further crimes from the condemned.

"...it doesn't punish the perp."

You don't think?

"The only argument for Capital punishment is financial."

See my first point.


"How so? That is exactly what it is. We would be killing another human being with the permission of the state."

The Concise Macquarie Dictionary. Murder/ Law. the unlawful killing of another human being with malice aforethought.
If capital punishment were introduced it would not be unlawful.

"Are you for real? What could we learn from Bin Laden?

How about possible current or future terrorist plots?
How about learning about the power structure of al Qaeda?
How about learning what twisted his mind so greatly? (other than the glib - "he hates our freedom!!" - bile that comes from the mouths of in the American inbred)"

Yes I am for real. As unlikely as it is that Bin Laden would freely give this information, if he did he could then be executed.

"Knowledge is power, the more we know about these people, the more ability we have to prevent similar types from committing similar crimes."

Yes. You may have a point with psycho killers but even then you learn nothing if the murderer refuses to talk, ala Martin Bryant. In some cases the murderers motivation is already evident and is disected during the court case. It could be greed, revenge, sexual. This doesn't need intricate analysis.

"Don't know about that. most research indicates that it is a mixture of genetics and environment."

If it is genetics then does this not indicate a predisposition?

"How about we keep these people alive so that we can study and learn more eh?"

And then execute them.

"Agreed. hence the point about "where no doubt exists" is completely moot."
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I made this point in reference to your assertion that their is no justification for capital punishment.
 
How can there be capital punishment when we in Australia are now an appendage of the USA and all the filth that entails? That is to say, we are constantly being desensitized to violence in all it's forms including sexual violence, bigotry, poverty etc etc through the so called mainstream media.
Our society is being told that decadence is "cool" and as such, it would be hypocritical to impose capital punishment.
 
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