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Captain VB

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Kornes and Crowley are excellent taggers (just ask Douglas), VB is an average tagger...nowhere near the best or worst. Certainly didn't achieve much at the end of the Showdown.

Like Reilly, I'm struggling to think of a good position for him?
 
Sanders said:
Not sure anyone has said that ;)



To be fair the tackle thing is something you came up with.

But seeing as you did, he only had 9 tackles for the season to the end of round 10.

How do you feel about that?
Click to expand...

I have never said he didn't have some horrible games. But you are not suggesting we replace a Captain based on a form slump?

Round 3 he played part of a game, then missed a couple of games so total tackles will be down anyway. Then there was his unsettled role which the club admitted was poor management. On top of that I think his early season performance is part of the evidence that the preseason was ineffective.

Yes I did choose tackles and cp. You do need to look at stats which correspond to the role of the player. You wouldn't use rebound 50s to look at a full forward or goals kicked for a full back. Am I not looking at the right stats for a tagging midfielder?

The fact is people are claiming VB is not best 22 or even not in the top 15. These are clearly incorrect.

An argument that Dangerfield/Sloane would be a better captain is a debate worth having. Saying he's on the verge of being dropped is at best hyperbole at worst is just made up shit to suit an argument.
 
Mattrox said:
I have never said he didn't have some horrible games. But you are not suggesting we replace a Captain based on a form slump?

Round 3 he played part of a game, then missed a couple of games so total tackles will be down anyway. Then there was his unsettled role which the club admitted was poor management. On top of that I think his early season performance is part of the evidence that the preseason was ineffective.

Yes I did choose tackles and cp. You do need to look at stats which correspond to the role of the player. You wouldn't use rebound 50s to look at a full forward or goals kicked for a full back. Am I not looking at the right stats for a tagging midfielder?

The fact is people are claiming VB is not best 22 or even not in the top 15. These are clearly incorrect.

An argument that Dangerfield/Sloane would be a better captain is a debate worth having. Saying he's on the verge of being dropped is at best hyperbole at worst is just made up shit to suit an argument.
Click to expand...

I think what most are suggesting is that if he wasnt captain, would he still be in the team based on this form slump?

But then the way the selectors have been blindly carrying several players through massive form slumps, I guess the answer would be yes....:rolleyes:
 
Mattrox said:
I have never said he didn't have some horrible games. But you are not suggesting we replace a Captain based on a form slump?

Round 3 he played part of a game, then missed a couple of games so total tackles will be down anyway. Then there was his unsettled role which the club admitted was poor management. On top of that I think his early season performance is part of the evidence that the preseason was ineffective.

Yes I did choose tackles and cp. You do need to look at stats which correspond to the role of the player. You wouldn't use rebound 50s to look at a full forward or goals kicked for a full back. Am I not looking at the right stats for a tagging midfielder?

The fact is people are claiming VB is not best 22 or even not in the top 15. These are clearly incorrect.

An argument that Dangerfield/Sloane would be a better captain is a debate worth having. Saying he's on the verge of being dropped is at best hyperbole at worst is just made up shit to suit an argument.
Click to expand...
The issue for me is that hes just not good enough to be a captain.

If you want an expample of what you want from your captain go back and have a look at Travis Boak's last 10 minutes on Sunday.
 

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VB is 12th for average possessions. So he's clearly in the Best 22 for touches.

:thumbsu::p
 
Mattrox said:
I have never said he didn't have some horrible games. But you are not suggesting we replace a Captain based on a form slump?
Click to expand...

No I have not suggested that, nor has anyone else. But now you mention it, yes I think a player whose basic quality is low, probably shouldn't be captain if a slump pushes his worth to the fringe of selection


Round 3 he played part of a game, then missed a couple of games so total tackles will be down anyway. Then there was his unsettled role which the club admitted was poor management. On top of that I think his early season performance is part of the evidence that the preseason was ineffective.
Click to expand...

So its everyone else's fault? That doesn't seem reasonable


Yes I did choose tackles and cp. You do need to look at stats which correspond to the role of the player. You wouldn't use rebound 50s to look at a full forward or goals kicked for a full back. Am I not looking at the right stats for a tagging midfielder?
Click to expand...

He's not excelling in those categories though, he's being better by a first year player whose only played 10 games (couple as sub).

The right measure would be his opponent wouldn't it?

Destroyed by pendlebury, watching boak in the critical stages.

The fact is people are claiming VB is not best 22 or even not in the top 15. These are clearly incorrect.
Click to expand...

Its not clear from any argument you've put forward though? I don't think its true either

An argument that Dangerfield/Sloane would be a better captain is a debate worth having. Saying he's on the verge of being dropped is at best hyperbole at worst is just made up shit to suit an argument.
Click to expand...

That's a different argument altogether.
 
TheLeftFist8 said:
Like Reilly, I'm struggling to think of a good position for him?
Click to expand...


It was interesting listening to Mick Malthouse tonight. He said that Carlton are looking down the barrel of a total overhaul, and that their ladder position of 9th in both the league and reserves was a good indicator of this. He seemed to imply that if they continued on their way without making some tough calls on players at the end of this year, 8th/9th is around where they will stay.

He then talked about his time at Collingwood - specifically 04 and 05 when he undertook a rebuild, cut some players who were "good blokes" but not going to take them any further forward, and load up at the draft with early picks. He said this was an extremely tough sell to the club and the board. They were upset that he wanted to get rid of "good blokes" and "good team men" who had given their all to the club, and whilst Malthouse acknowledged it was unfortunate, he was unmoved. He knew he and the club would be ultimately judged if they failed. He used that word failure very intensely. He knew he had to build for a premiership, the premiership he would eventually get in 2010.

Mick's words are incredibly haunting for any AFC supporter.

We are a club who signed Brent Reilly for another two years - before this year was even half finished. We couldn't sign him quick enough.
 
Slippery Pete said:
It was interesting listening to Mick Malthouse tonight. He said that Carlton are looking down the barrel of a total overhaul, and that their ladder position of 9th in both the league and reserves was a good indicator of this. He seemed to imply that if they continued on their way without making some tough calls on players at the end of this year, 8th/9th is around where they will stay.

He then talked about his time at Collingwood - specifically 04 and 05 when he undertook a rebuild, cut some players who were "good blokes" but not going to take them any further forward, and load up at the draft with early picks. He said this was an extremely tough sell to the club and the board. They were upset that he wanted to get rid of "good blokes" and "good team men" who had given their all to the club, and whilst Malthouse acknowledged it was unfortunate, he was unmoved. He knew he and the club would be ultimately judged if they failed. He used that word failure very intensely. He knew he had to build for a premiership, the premiership he would eventually get in 2010.

Mick's words are incredibly haunting for any AFC supporter.

We are a club who signed Brent Reilly for another two years - before this year was even half finished. We couldn't sign him quick enough.
Click to expand...

Not really the same though

No one gets ultimately judged for failure here
 
TheLeftFist8 said:
Kornes and Crowley are excellent taggers (just ask Douglas), VB is an average tagger...nowhere near the best or worst. Certainly didn't achieve much at the end of the Showdown.

Like Reilly, I'm struggling to think of a good position for him?
Click to expand...

WAFL.
 

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The more I think about it the more I like it.

VB out, Sloane and Danger double act from next year

Both natural leaders (already in leadership group), 2 of our elite players for match day, both inspirational / fearless players setting on field example, shares the responsibility for relatively young men and DE-RISKS either lad leaving over coming years. With these 2 as co-captain I imagine, from the outside, it would help create a fantastic culture and environment for other players and "stem the flow" of players leaving which has been near or at league worst in recent years

The time has come
 
The Crows Truth said:
The more I think about it the more I like it.

VB out, Sloane and Danger double act from next year

Both natural leaders (already in leadership group), 2 of our elite players for match day, both inspirational / fearless players setting on field example, shares the responsibility for relatively young men and DE-RISKS either lad leaving over coming years. With these 2 as co-captain I imagine, from the outside, it would help create a fantastic culture and environment for other players and "stem the flow" of players leaving which has been near or at league worst in recent years

The time has come
Click to expand...

Great idea. It worked well for Melbourne,,,,,errrr Mulva,,,,,errr Neil?
 
The Crows Truth said:
The more I think about it the more I like it.

VB out, Sloane and Danger double act from next year

Both natural leaders (already in leadership group), 2 of our elite players for match day, both inspirational / fearless players setting on field example, shares the responsibility for relatively young men and DE-RISKS either lad leaving over coming years. With these 2 as co-captain I imagine, from the outside, it would help create a fantastic culture and environment for other players and "stem the flow" of players leaving which has been near or at league worst in recent years

The time has come
Click to expand...

No to co-captains. One can be C and one can be VC.
 

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Slippery Pete said:
It was interesting listening to Mick Malthouse tonight. He said that Carlton are looking down the barrel of a total overhaul, and that their ladder position of 9th in both the league and reserves was a good indicator of this. He seemed to imply that if they continued on their way without making some tough calls on players at the end of this year, 8th/9th is around where they will stay.

He then talked about his time at Collingwood - specifically 04 and 05 when he undertook a rebuild, cut some players who were "good blokes" but not going to take them any further forward, and load up at the draft with early picks. He said this was an extremely tough sell to the club and the board. They were upset that he wanted to get rid of "good blokes" and "good team men" who had given their all to the club, and whilst Malthouse acknowledged it was unfortunate, he was unmoved. He knew he and the club would be ultimately judged if they failed. He used that word failure very intensely. He knew he had to build for a premiership, the premiership he would eventually get in 2010.

Mick's words are incredibly haunting for any AFC supporter.

We are a club who signed Brent Reilly for another two years - before this year was even half finished. We couldn't sign him quick enough.
Click to expand...

It's like Mick was holding up a verbal mirror.
 
Slippery Pete said:
It was interesting listening to Mick Malthouse tonight. He said that Carlton are looking down the barrel of a total overhaul, and that their ladder position of 9th in both the league and reserves was a good indicator of this. He seemed to imply that if they continued on their way without making some tough calls on players at the end of this year, 8th/9th is around where they will stay.

He then talked about his time at Collingwood - specifically 04 and 05 when he undertook a rebuild, cut some players who were "good blokes" but not going to take them any further forward, and load up at the draft with early picks. He said this was an extremely tough sell to the club and the board. They were upset that he wanted to get rid of "good blokes" and "good team men" who had given their all to the club, and whilst Malthouse acknowledged it was unfortunate, he was unmoved. He knew he and the club would be ultimately judged if they failed. He used that word failure very intensely. He knew he had to build for a premiership, the premiership he would eventually get in 2010.

Mick's words are incredibly haunting for any AFC supporter.

We are a club who signed Brent Reilly for another two years - before this year was even half finished. We couldn't sign him quick enough.
Click to expand...
Yep I heard that. Interesting isn't it, we all want success but some supporters can't get past their blind loyalty to average players such as Doughty, Reilly and VB. They then wonder why we haven't played in a GF in 15 years.

If the club had any sense of what it takes to win a flag Reilly would be traded for a pick in the 20s whilst someone would still be foolish enough to pay it. He'd be perfect for GWS and we don't need him.
Dougy has had a great year but he's struggled to break a tag. His trade value would never have been higher.
 
He tagged a 35 year old. Yay!!!!! Still didnt get any possesions
Shouldve played on their best player and game breaker Wells.
 
Team DJ said:
He tagged a 35 year old. Yay!!!!! Still didnt get any possesions
Shouldve played on their best player and game breaker Wells.
Click to expand...
If it was that easy, why has Boomer been getting 35+ touches for a month now?:rolleyes:

That comment is just severely ignorant of the impact Harvey still has for North.

Harvey was their game breaker last week, so I can see why Sando wanted our best tagger on him.
 
Team DJ said:
He tagged a 35 year old. Yay!!!!! Still didnt get any possesions
Shouldve played on their best player and game breaker Wells.
Click to expand...

Boomer carved the cats up last week.

Not bad for a 35 year old.

VB was very instrumental in getting the W today. Bag him when he s bad, but don't when he plays his role to help us win.

VB was in our top 5 today.
 
BACCS said:
If it was that easy, why has Boomer been getting 35+ touches for a month now?:rolleyes:

That comment is just severely ignorant of the impact Harvey still has for North.

Harvey was their game breaker last week, so I can see why Sando wanted our best tagger on him.
Click to expand...

Shouldve been on Wells.
Should win more Footy
Should make better decisions
Shouldnt be captain
 

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