List Mgmt. Carlile announces retirement

Remove this Banner Ad

ash_78 said:
Contract terminated, yes. Bobby not paid for the final year, yes. Included in salary cap? Pretty sure, yes.

Otherwise everyone would sign up superstars on heavily back-ended 9 year deals and retire them after 5.
Click to expand...
The Michael Voss situation. Was on a heavily backended contract until end of 2007, but his body gave up and he retired at the end of 2006, but he had to stay on the list for 2007 and receive his monies in 2007 otherwise the Lions would have blown their 2006 cap sky high.
 
Chrizzt said:
Who knows. If both parties agree, the contract can be terminated. It's possible given his team first attitude that he will break the contract, with the promise from Port that they will employ him at the club for the multicultural program - possibly at an elevated wage to cover the earnings difference. This way Bobby gets his money (or close to it) and we save room under both the salary cap and footy dept. spend cap.
Click to expand...

Good call. His parting speech was very positive, so i think you are on to something and that he will still play some role within the club going forward.
 

Log in to remove this ad.

Chrizzt said:
Who knows. If both parties agree, the contract can be terminated. It's possible given his team first attitude that he will break the contract, with the promise from Port that they will employ him at the club for the multicultural program - possibly at an elevated wage to cover the earnings difference. This way Bobby gets his money (or close to it) and we save room under both the salary cap and footy dept. spend cap.
Click to expand...
My query is not whether we'll pay his contract out, but whether his salary on paper for 2017 will count under our cap.

I can't find the AFL salary cap rules anywhere for a clear answer. REH and Tribey mention the Voss precedent and my gut feel is this would be the same sitcho.
 
There was a time when I genuinely thought Bobby would have played in a premiership. He was our go to big back and was a tad on the slow side, but he did his job most weeks. His retirement is a sober reminder of how far we've slipped.
 
Adz2332 said:
so what stops a player from signing a 5 year contract and retiring the next day? have to keep his contract in the salary cap for 5 years?
Click to expand...
The Voss situation might be different because it was so heavily backended and had massive salary cap implications, ie his true worth in 2007 was say $200k but he was being paid $900k as it allowed Brisbane to max out their cap in previous years, and it was basically for services already rendered.

I suspect that if Bobby is on pretty standard terms over his 4 year deal ( or was it 5) and the 4th year he probably is getting paid less than the previous years, then he wont get paid and it wont have cap implications. Under the CBA there are rights and obligations and one of those obligations is that a player must make himself available to train an play to get the right to be paid. If a player says I'm not training then the contract can be terminated. If there is no back ending ie payment for services already rendered being deffered then I suspect there are no cap implications

In the CBA their are injury payment clauses and some injury payments are outside the cap. I have never been able to work out which ones are inside the cap and which ones outside after reading 3 separate CBA's and multiple times for each of the 3. Unless the club announces what the real situation is, we are all guessing a fair bit.
 
I wish Bobby had done more of this. i craved him doing this sort of stuff every game but it rarely happened. Thanks for all the efforts over the years Bobby. Paying Fullback is as tough as it comes in footy and you had some big tough jobs over the years. Some you did brilliantly some the big gorilla's got you. But that's footy.

 
tribey said:
I'm not sure exactly how it works, but Michael Voss retired a year early and his salary counted against Brisbane's cap.

The other thing is the long-term Buddy deal.

All the talk given its extraordinary length taking him to 36-37, and then especially in light of his mental illness battles, was that Sydney's cap could be on the hook for his contract years after he retires.
Click to expand...

I can't recall any details for the Voss incident, but I did think of the Buddy contract. I know at the time that the AFL said if Sydney were to go through with the offer that there was no way they were getting out of it early - which makes me think there must be provisions/escape clauses such as retirements.

Age article
When Franklin was recruited to the Swans on a mega deal the AFL decreed that even if Franklin were to retire and not be paid his full contract amount for the duration of his long contract the money would still need to be accounted for in the Swans salary cap.
Click to expand...

The way that is worded makes it seem as though it was a special provision of the AFL to make sure Franklin's contract was included in the salary cap for the entire duration of the contract - whereas this might not be the case for usual player contracts.
 
TheFVK said:
Such a legend. Hope he stays around and chips in with the community programs, he's a huge asset there.
Click to expand...

Legitimate way around footy department spending soft cap there you'd hope. He has real contributions to make in the community programs. Might not help with "counting" of TPP though. Would be a shame for a decently and appropriately front ended contract to fall foul of TPP courtesy the cynical Buddy deal.

His payout it seems is negotiable, this is the literal meaning of retirement rather than "delisting with one year to go", if we have unilaterally wanted to let him go he'd have been entitled to base + match payments, effectively the whole amount per CBA (if I read it right there is provision for some clawback from a player if he 'retires' then goes somewhere else and gets paid more than he would otherwise have earned if he had stayed, seems almost a Chad/Brogan clause lol). What counts for TPP though is not necessarily the same thing as what we actually spend paying him out though, which, again, I'm guessing, is the number that is relevant for the footy department spending soft cap. In response to the Buddy contract the AFL may require clubs to include remaining contract amounts in following years' TPP to avoid richer clubs "retiring" prematurely ageing players out into non-TPP non-capped "community" roles. Where do you draw the line? Bobby's is a legitimate early retirement not a cynical exercise and the guy is a natural for such a role. The Voss deal mentioned was attacked for its back ended structure and in a sense is the template for more recent back ended deals leading up to the Buddy deal which forced an "enough is enough" reaction. It's legitimate for us to bargain with Bob for a smaller payout with a larger but still within reason salary in a community type role.
 
RussellEbertHandball said:
The Voss situation might be different because it was so heavily backended and had massive salary cap implications, ie his true worth in 2007 was say $200k but he was being paid $900k as it allowed Brisbane to max out their cap in previous years, and it was basically for services already rendered.

I suspect that if Bobby is on pretty standard terms over his 4 year deal ( or was it 5) and the 4th year he probably is getting paid less than the previous years, then he wont get paid and it wont have cap implications. Under the CBA there are rights and obligations and one of those obligations is that a player must make himself available to train an play to get the right to be paid. If a player says I'm not training then the contract can be terminated. If there is no back ending ie payment for services already rendered being deffered then I suspect there are no cap implications

In the CBA their are injury payment clauses and some injury payments are outside the cap. I have never been able to work out which ones are inside the cap and which ones outside after reading 3 separate CBA's and multiple times for each of the 3. Unless the club announces what the real situation is, we are all guessing a fair bit.
Click to expand...

This is correct, under the CBA clubs are not required to pay retiring players a 'termination payment', which means he won't be paid for next year and therefore his contracted salary would not be included in the TPPs. However, it's the AFL so who knows what new interpretation of the rules they'll come up with on the run!
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

Coobk001 said:
A player that frustrated the hell out of me, but at his best he was a top notch rebounder with some attacking flair. Always enjoyed his runs off HB, and gotta wish him well. Hopefully his body is in reasonable nick for his post footy career.
Click to expand...
My wife who is an RN and has nursed many ex-footballers says....mmmm.
Saw him at Woodville Oval this year and the next game at Alberton and it was obvious Bobbie was playing hurt.
Great guy, touching letter as well and a lovely family. Thanks for everything.
 
phill1795 said:
Sorry to intrude but just wanted to give credit where it is due. To be able to play 157 games is by no means an easy achievement. I will remember Carlile at his peak in the showdowns and used to shut down our key forwards pretty well.

Sent from my SM-T700 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
was actually 167...
 
RussellEbertHandball said:
I wish Bobby had done more of this. i craved him doing this sort of stuff every game but it rarely happened. Thanks for all the efforts over the years Bobby. Paying Fullback is as tough as it comes in footy and you had some big tough jobs over the years. Some you did brilliantly some the big gorilla's got you. But that's footy.

Click to expand...


Jeeze Byron would've been proud of that one!
 
Macca19 said:
That was 3 CBA's ago.
Click to expand...
2 CBA's ago, and there has been a change. The 2003-08 then renegotiated to end of 2006, and 2007-11 was pretty strict on contract variations. But the 2012-16 does allow for variation of contracts.

24.1 Standard Playing Contract
(a) All contracts for the playing of Australian Football entered into between a Player, an AFL Club and the AFL shall be in the form of the Standard Playing Contract.
(b) All Standard Playing Contracts, variations and Additional Service Agreements lodged with the AFL shall be supported by statutory declarations made by each of the following persons:
(i) the Player;
(ii) an officer of the AFL Club who had the care and conduct of negotiating with the Player; and
(iii) an Accredited Agent, parent or legal guardian, as the case may be, who has been authorised by the Player to act on his behalf in negotiating with the AFL Club.
(c) The terms of the statutory declaration shall be in a form determined from time to time by the AFL in consultation with the AFLPA.

(d) The parties to a Standard Playing Contract, which contract has not been terminated, may vary the terms of the contract or renew the contract for a further term/s, by written agreement of the parties.

(e) All Standard Playing Contracts shall expire on 31 October in the final year of the Player’s contract unless the contract has been varied or renewed, in which case the contract shall expire on 31 October in the final year of the varied or renewed contract.

(f) The AFL and the AFLPA recognise that Standard Playing Contracts between AFL Clubs and Players create legally binding obligations and that the parties to such contracts have legitimate expectations that the terms of such contracts will be honoured.

(g) An AFL Club and a Player shall not include provision in a Standard Playing Contract which would entitle either party to unilaterally exercise an option to extend the term of a Player’s contract.
 
All the best Bobby and thanks for your commitment to the PAFC
 
This will be one of my fondest memory of Bobby. I wrote this after the GWS game in 2013 - the J-Mac game, first one we played at home after his passing. What I didn't write was that I spoke for about 5 minutes on Fijian Rugby, mainly Sevens not XV's with Bobby. Its why I got such a kick out of watching them win Rugby Sevens Gold in Rio a few weeks ago.

https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/r2-vs-gws-review.997304/page-5#post-27672297
Went back to Alberton and spoke to Matthew Nicks as he rang me in the membership drive, he rang the Club 1870 members to say thanks, we had a good chat then and I said I'd come up and say g'day after the first game. Caught him as he was leaving, spoke to him for about 10 minutes, almost half about music, talked about the Melbourne game as I sat in line with the centre and second level of the AFL members, so I got a great view of our defensive structure and forward press and said to him how well it was set up compared to the last 5 years. He said they had spent a lot of time on it over the summer. Then told him about Bobby's effort and how long I'd been waiting for him to do that and he said they all got very excited about it in the box. Nicks said that Ken and him had been encouraging him to do that all thru the preseaon.

I then said I've been waiting for him to do a David Dench type searing runs out of defence. I said that they should show him tapes of how Dench attacked as he ran out of defence with multiple bounces because he changed the game in 1975 and if Bobby isn't attacking the footy like that he is playing pre 1975 footy. Nicks in his best coaches voice said go and tell that, tell him what he did was great and to do it all the time. So I did!

Talked to Bobby, told him I had waited 5 years to see him do that, and he had a big smile on his face. Said he had to do it every week and told living in Sydney I had watched plenty of Fijian rugby and said he had to ran at and around blokes like Serevi ( the best ever Rugby 7's player) or like a Fijian front rower. He just smiled and said he'll try.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

RossFC
News 2024 Leadership Group Announced
2 3 4
Replies
80
Views
4K
JakeNeadeFan
JakeNeadeFan
RossFC
AFLW Erin Phillips Retires
2
Replies
28
Views
2K
Marmozet
Marmozet
gbear
News 2023 Leadership Group Announced
2 3 4 5 6
Replies
144
Views
5K
Shaucob_Burjan
Shaucob_Burjan
Jojay
Toast Tom Jonas Retires
2 3 4 5
Replies
110
Views
5K
DaTBird187
DaTBird187
Holden Hillbilly
Bombshell announcement leaves $2.6b Commonwealth Games in tatters
Replies
6
Views
906
Holden Hillbilly
Holden Hillbilly

Remove this Banner Ad

Back
Top