List Mgmt. Carlton Draft 2021

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The Return of the Paf

Team Captain
Aug 22, 2020
545
561
AFL Club
Carlton
I am not a fan of Austin's. There are numerous reasons why. However, he turned nothing into something which is a solid move.

Ultimately, I'd rather have Honey and Kennedy than any player we overlooked at 55. Additionally, there's no other player that I'd rather delist over drafting a speculative kid unless there's some damning medical file to show that players they've backed in aren't ever going to make it back (e.g. Marchy).

I think you're over valuing the opportunity cost and underrating the value of the players currently on the list.

Not disappointed in this outcome at all. In fact, had you told me we'd end up with an additional few points next year and we still exited the draft having executed the exact strategy we entered the draft with I'd have been delighted. I don't think we panicked at all.

In my opinion, the only questions that I have are would we have drafted MacDonald or someone who went earlier in the second if we moved up and what did that opportunity cost look like. Even that was answered during the telecast as they stated clubs had been approached prior to our selection and they demanded a mint.
Serious question; what is it that you don't like about Austin when you seem to be going out of your way to defend him here? Personally, he seems like a pretty amiable bloke but I'm not a fan of what he has done in the admittedly short time he has been in charge. On the plus side, we seem to have nailed our trade targets but I'd question whether the first two were the right ones. However, to use an analogy, my problem with Austin is that his style so far has been like a T20 batsman who only ever plays with a straight bat. He blocks too much, and on the very rare occasion that he attempts a cheeky sweep, he looks out of his depth.
 
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AndyLucimitis

Norm Smith Medallist
Nov 14, 2002
6,967
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Ahh, my handwriting looks like chicken scratch.

Easy mistake to make.

Welcome, Justin Motlop.

Reminds of a party I was at once where this guy bored me for an hour or so about how he'd went to school with Dustin Fletcher and how they were such great mates.

...problem was he called him 'Justin Fletcher' the whole time !!
 

Jeremias

Moderator
Sep 26, 2004
40,719
47,701
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Serious question; what is it that you don't like about Austin when you seem to be going out of your way to defend what appears to be some of his weaknesses? Personally, he seems like a pretty amiable bloke but I'm not a fan of what he has done in the admittedly short time he has been in charge. On the plus side, we seem to have nailed our trade targets but I'd question whether the first two were the right ones. However, to use an analogy, my problem with Austin is that his style so far has been like a T20 batsman who only ever plays with a straight bat. He blocks too much, and on the very rare occasion that he attempts a cheeky sweep, he looks out of his depth.
Geez, for someone who is usually so positive about our recruiting, this is a massive surpr........ah, forget it.

Most surprised you haven't yet criticised Motlop - 3...2...1....
 

Arr0w

Hall of Famer
Nov 13, 2015
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Listed at 194 on the cfc website. He is Key Position size.
Akuei is 194 according to CFC website.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com
Well I did mention when it was stated he was 192, that he would have to grow at least 2 inches, so he is half way there. Then of course its whether he can transition from being extremely raw to being able to play at the level.

If you think he could step in if Weitering or Young go down next year, it won't happen
 

goreds

Premiership Player
Oct 10, 2008
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Well I did mention when it was stated he was 192, that he would have to grow at least 2 inches, so he is half way there. Then of course its whether he can transition from being extremely raw to being able to play at the level.

If you think he could step in if Weitering or Young go down next year, it won't happen
Alir Alir 196cm… Launches the same and marks with hands slightly in front…

I remember watching AA when he was a junior, this kid plays just like him. Have the Sudanese kids all read from the same book??
 

Pablito

Club Legend
Oct 23, 2017
2,620
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Well I did mention when it was stated he was 192, that he would have to grow at least 2 inches, so he is half way there. Then of course its whether he can transition from being extremely raw to being able to play at the level.

If you think he could step in if Weitering or Young go down next year, it won't happen
Agreed, he needs to put on 10kg of muscle and cut his teeth in the VFL for 12 months.

But when he's ready he can play on the big boys.
 

Mondyboy

Norm Smith Medallist
Oct 16, 2016
5,616
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Well I did mention when it was stated he was 192, that he would have to grow at least 2 inches, so he is half way there. Then of course its whether he can transition from being extremely raw to being able to play at the level.

If you think he could step in if Weitering or Young go down next year, it won't happen
Nope. Done think that. Agree he’s raw.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com
 

katmanblue

Premium Platinum
Nov 27, 2016
12,368
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Well I did mention when it was stated he was 192, that he would have to grow at least 2 inches, so he is half way there. Then of course its whether he can transition from being extremely raw to being able to play at the level.

If you think he could step in if Weitering or Young go down next year, it won't happen
2024-5 after three or four years in the system, could be a weapon.
 

slashin_velvet

Norm Smith Medallist
Sep 5, 2011
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Akuei is 70 odd KG, he won't play seniors next year, but let's see how he develops
He's probably got to put on 15-20kgs so thats going to take at least a couple years one would think.

At 76kgs, hes closer than Mac Andrew who's reportedly only 70kg but over 200cm tall - hope he likes the gym.
 

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Wickzki

Not Sam McClure
Oct 1, 2010
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Serious question; what is it that you don't like about Austin when you seem to be going out of your way to defend what appears to be some of his weaknesses? Personally, he seems like a pretty amiable bloke but I'm not a fan of what he has done in the admittedly short time he has been in charge. On the plus side, we seem to have nailed our trade targets but I'd question whether the first two were the right ones. However, to use an analogy, my problem with Austin is that his style so far has been like a T20 batsman who only ever plays with a straight bat. He blocks too much, and on the very rare occasion that he attempts a cheeky sweep, he looks out of his depth.
What I don't like about Austin's list management is that he (and the team around him) cut too deeply at KP last year and followed it up by only acquiring McDonald almost as an after thought.

The current list still very much lacks quality KP depth and we don't have anyone under the age of 22 in development for the future. If you view TDK as a ruck first and foremost who can pinch hit as a KP then the youngest genuine KP's we have on the list are Harry McKay and Lewis Young who turn 24 and 23 respectively in December.

While strong arguments can be made for delisting those that we did they should have been replaced with more than just Young that's got a chance of being there in 5+ years.

I'm glad we're giving Akuel some time to develop as a Cat B.
 

BigFrizz36

Premiership Player
Mar 20, 2017
4,845
15,391
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Serious question; what is it that you don't like about Austin when you seem to be going out of your way to defend what appears to be some of his weaknesses? Personally, he seems like a pretty amiable bloke but I'm not a fan of what he has done in the admittedly short time he has been in charge. On the plus side, we seem to have nailed our trade targets but I'd question whether the first two were the right ones. However, to use an analogy, my problem with Austin is that his style so far has been like a T20 batsman who only ever plays with a straight bat. He blocks too much, and on the very rare occasion that he attempts a cheeky sweep, he looks out of his depth.
Would be very very close to being the worst analogy that I have ever heard. Probably is.
 

TENACIOUS

Club Legend
Aug 16, 2008
1,324
5,812
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Carlton
What I don't like about Austin's list management is that he (and the team around him) cut too deeply at KP last year and followed it up by only acquiring McDonald almost as an after thought.

The current list still very much lacks quality KP depth and we don't have anyone under the age of 22 in development for the future. If you view TDK as a ruck first and foremost who can pinch hit as a KP then the youngest genuine KP's we have on the list are Harry McKay and Lewis Young who turn 24 and 23 respectively in December.

While strong arguments can be made for delisting those that we did they should have been replaced with more than just Young that's got a chance of being there in 5+ years.

I'm glad we're giving Akuel some time to develop as a Cat B.
Who would you have taken Wick?

2020
Only KP player of note I can see taken after Durdin's pick 37, was Josh Treacy Pick 7 Rookie Draft

2021
Bazzo was available at Pick 27 apart from that would prefer Motlop

I'm an Austin fan though, personally think he has done well both drafts with what we had
 

Coona Blues

Director of Coaching
Nov 3, 2011
3,582
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Bundaberg, Qld
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Josh Cripps you'd think would be an SPP or SSP whatever it is, keen to see him come over and try to impress for that last spot.
Agree 100%. I am not certain the kid has what it takes, but his performances are certainly in the ball park when his Western Australian peers are considered. He has shown the determination to overcome adversity to put himself in the mix. Granted he does not exude pace in his highlights, but gets around and too contests. Also appeared to gain separation on the lead. It is possible to look slow when in fact you are not. Sean Darcy arguably the best young ruck in the competition looks very similar “athletically”, yet gets to contest after contest.

Having overcome an ACL reco and battling shin splints through his abbreviated season after little preparation, the lad has earned a chance for mine. There is little doubt a significantly better season can be expected in 2022. He put up some quality performances during the season, if they are improved upon as expected he is well worth the investment. Being an SSP placement, having big brother on hand for support during a “trial season” would be a excellent scenario.

There is little doubt in my mind a forward/ruck is a greater need for balance than nabbing an underdone KPD prospect.
We have Kemp, Parks and Akuei to add to defensive talls like Lewis Young and Oscar McDonald who has recovered from an LTI as hopefully will have elite interceptor Marchbank very early in the season. With McGovern and potentially JSOS options as defensive talls, we are not bereft down back.

While a swingman, Young clearly has displayed better form in defence. With Harry, Charlie and TDK all likely to be in the top team for the foreseeable future that leaves only McDonald as genuine key forward depth. Again with Harry, Charlie and TDK all having expectation for the best part of eight years tenure in the top team, it is not essential to hunt the next gun key forward yet. A competitive player capable of developing as an option as both forward and ruck makes great sense to me. It provides our developing players with a balanced structure in the twos to “mimic” the senior game plan.
 

Michael Jezz

Club Legend
Jan 30, 2007
2,381
5,210
collingwood
AFL Club
Carlton
What I don't like about Austin's list management is that he (and the team around him) cut too deeply at KP last year and followed it up by only acquiring McDonald almost as an after thought.

The current list still very much lacks quality KP depth and we don't have anyone under the age of 22 in development for the future. If you view TDK as a ruck first and foremost who can pinch hit as a KP then the youngest genuine KP's we have on the list are Harry McKay and Lewis Young who turn 24 and 23 respectively in December.

While strong arguments can be made for delisting those that we did they should have been replaced with more than just Young that's got a chance of being there in 5+ years.

I'm glad we're giving Akuel some time to develop as a Cat B.
Liddle ditched Ben Silvagni. Macreadie was given opportunities
 

Blue__Balls

Brownlow Medallist
Aug 22, 2014
11,749
40,560
AFL Club
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Serious question; what is it that you don't like about Austin when you seem to be going out of your way to defend what appears to be some of his weaknesses? Personally, he seems like a pretty amiable bloke but I'm not a fan of what he has done in the admittedly short time he has been in charge. On the plus side, we seem to have nailed our trade targets but I'd question whether the first two were the right ones. However, to use an analogy, my problem with Austin is that his style so far has been like a T20 batsman who only ever plays with a straight bat. He blocks too much, and on the very rare occasion that he attempts a cheeky sweep, he looks out of his depth.
This sounds like a Test batsman...

And if you were to compare the philosophies of AFL list management to any form of cricket, it'd be Test cricket. You're playing a game that takes years to pay off.

More than happy to have a list manager who plays a straight bat more often than not, only pulls out the big shots when the right ball presents, and doesn't try pulling off a reverse sweep in the first over.
 

Canyouhearthedrums

Premiership Player
Aug 28, 2008
4,505
7,497
Melbourne
AFL Club
Carlton
What I don't like about Austin's list management is that he (and the team around him) cut too deeply at KP last year and followed it up by only acquiring McDonald almost as an after thought.

The current list still very much lacks quality KP depth and we don't have anyone under the age of 22 in development for the future. If you view TDK as a ruck first and foremost who can pinch hit as a KP then the youngest genuine KP's we have on the list are Harry McKay and Lewis Young who turn 24 and 23 respectively in December.

While strong arguments can be made for delisting those that we did they should have been replaced with more than just Young that's got a chance of being there in 5+ years.

I'm glad we're giving Akuel some time to develop as a Cat B.
I don’t disagree that we’re thin at KP. But it’s been exacerbated by Charlies injury, McDonalds injury (who looked ok before it) and Jones not believing in science. Not sure I’m going to blame Austin for that.
 

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