List Mgmt. Carlton Draft 2021

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DangerousD

Norm Smith Medallist
Aug 16, 2015
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I’d really like for us to target a ready made ruck in the trade period, freeing up TDK to be the extra key forward that we require, a ruck like Ladhams, who can swap with TDK with forward duties, an Acquisition like this, makes us better straight away, without having to wait years for another tall to develop, it would also allow us to focus on other needs at the draft.

I hope we target Hewitt as a FA, who will slot straight in, being able to play multiple roles and offer plenty of experience.

If we were to get those two, we would then be able to focus on a narrower set of needs at the draft.

Does Akuie only being 193cm, make him unsatisfactory for a KPD? If he progresses this year, it would further narrow our focus at the draft, to quality mids or smaller tough tackling forwards.
 

La Dispute

La Dispute
Jul 14, 2005
15,299
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unlikely to be a national championship again this year, Vic kids missing key development because of yoyoing in and out of lockdown, 2 of the top 3 are father son selections.. not a good year to have a top pick..

Our lack of father son's has really hurt us. Not sure why but our greats just dont produce decent offspring (jSOS excluded) look a the le up a team like the bulldogs have based on father son Wallis, Hunter, Libratore, West, Cordy and will add Sam Darcy to this pool at seasons end.. The pies have a leg up to rebound quickly off father sons, Moore, Daicos x 2, Brown x 2 & Kelly..
Pros and cons really.

We said the same about Essendon last year, but these guys are scouted from a pretty young age and don't lose their natural talent. You don't get a perfect picture, it's close enough though. Maybe Cox and/or Perkins would have gone higher with another year behind them.

Also the Brown boys are spuds.
 

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bmaurizio

Norm Smith Medallist
Aug 11, 2004
5,473
7,041
Singapore
AFL Club
Carlton
I’d really like for us to target a ready made ruck in the trade period, freeing up TDK to be the extra key forward that we require, a ruck like Ladhams, who can swap with TDK with forward duties, an Acquisition like this, makes us better straight away, without having to wait years for another tall to develop, it would also allow us to focus on other needs at the draft.

I hope we target Hewitt as a FA, who will slot straight in, being able to play multiple roles and offer plenty of experience.

If we were to get those two, we would then be able to focus on a narrower set of needs at the draft.

Does Akuie only being 193cm, make him unsatisfactory for a KPD? If he progresses this year, it would further narrow our focus at the draft, to quality mids or smaller tough tackling forwards.
Agree with you, a quality ruck is an urgent need, Ladhams or Max Lunch, both young and talented. Trade MaGovern, Fisher or SPS we must find the currency to deal to rectify the center square the rest will fall into place.
 

FitzroyBlueBagger

FitzroyBlueBagger
Sep 30, 2018
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That’d be about right.

Looks like there might actually be a few inside/outside mids around that range.

Be nice to grab a well performed junior mid who can slot in and be a decent contributor straight away but still has a decent amount of growth. Our version of Ollie Wines or Jarrod Berry.
It’s the lack of consistent exposure for a second year in a row for a lot of these kids that aren’t necessary the obvious standouts, these are the late bloomers and smokies in a year they start to show significant promise unfortunately thwarted again by COVID...

Also from a recruiting angle it would be extremely difficult with a shorter list of exposed form too work off than usual, some states have had a bettter run (WA & SA) over the rest of the country recruiting pool, mainly a large percentage of the draft is made up by VIC kids which has been struck the hardest...

The U18’s championships are a massive factor for when these kids from all over the country go up against one another, the best kids in the country showcasing their talents for me is one of the best highlights of the footy season, it doesn’t completely define a players worth but plays a very important part in club recruiting for a number of reasons...
 

WFGodot

Club Legend
Nov 3, 2017
1,291
2,268
AFL Club
Carlton
I don't think it's been that bad to be honest. Weiters, Charlie, Harry, Walsh, Stocker all looking good.

The only drafts that are questionable really at this point are 2016 and 2017 but look at the other options in those years, not many taken around our pick are exactly world beaters either.
Drafting talent is one thing, developing it is another thing entirely!
The only one on your list that has all but trouble free has been Walsh, fingers crossed with this star! Not even we could break him... phew!
Weiters has had his challenges, now a regular performer. We did our best to break his spirit!
Harry looked all at sea for a couple of years. Injuries, setbacks etc. Only now in his SIXTH year are we seeing a return.
Charlie has huge upside but we all know his history of injury and Stocker has only now been given a run at it after 2 years of, well, I'm not sure what.
Coinsidering we've had just about THE BEST draft hand in the past 5-6 years and traded out multiple players in order to improve the draft position AND who have gone on to be bettter than they ever were at Carlton: Kennedy, Tuohy, Betts, Henderson, Robinson... we are miles behind we we should be. We've got the Midas touch backwards.
We have more 1st rounders than just about any side in the competition and we've screwed it in the most appalling way.
Lets take trip down memory lane:

First round:
2015 - A great year: Weitering, McKay, Curnow and Cunners
2016 - SPS
2017 - Dow, LOB
2018 - Walsh - Stocker
2019 - Kemp, Philp.
2020 - nothing.

We've drafted 11 1st round players in 6 years. 11 still remain.
But wait there's more:

We have traded in at least 6 1st rounders: Docherty, Kennedy, Marchbank, Martin, Plowman, Setterfield -

and finally we have Murphy.

I'm not going to do it but can someone tell me if there is another team in the competition that has 18 1st rounders on their primary list of what is it 36 players?
I'm stunned writing this... HALF our team were 1st round picks when drafted. We should be the Carlton all-stars!

Sadly, courtesy of an inability to nurture this talent we have languished at the bottom or near the bottom for years.

I'm sorry and absolutely nothing personal but I'm in a dark place with this club. Year after year of rationalization and faith crushed by ineptitude of those in charge of the football department. Sigh...
 

FitzroyBlueBagger

FitzroyBlueBagger
Sep 30, 2018
4,560
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Fitzroy
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That’d be about right.

Looks like there might actually be a few inside/outside mids around that range.

Be nice to grab a well performed junior mid who can slot in and be a decent contributor straight away but still has a decent amount of growth. Our version of Ollie Wines or Jarrod Berry.
Sorry last post to you was actually meant to be a stand alone post...
There seems to be atm a good bunch of different types of midfielders, some good outside players and a few skilled forwards, wings and defenders, not much depth in the KPD KPF high end draft department...
 

Blue_Fusion

Norm Smith Medallist
Oct 4, 2015
9,393
14,872
AFL Club
Carlton
Drafting talent is one thing, developing it is another thing entirely!
The only one on your list that has all but trouble free has been Walsh, fingers crossed with this star! Not even we could break him... phew!
Weiters has had his challenges, now a regular performer. We did our best to break his spirit!
Harry looked all at sea for a couple of years. Injuries, setbacks etc. Only now in his SIXTH year are we seeing a return.
Charlie has huge upside but we all know his history of injury and Stocker has only now been given a run at it after 2 years of, well, I'm not sure what.
Coinsidering we've had just about THE BEST draft hand in the past 5-6 years and traded out multiple players in order to improve the draft position AND who have gone on to be bettter than they ever were at Carlton: Kennedy, Tuohy, Betts, Henderson, Robinson... we are miles behind we we should be. We've got the Midas touch backwards.
We have more 1st rounders than just about any side in the competition and we've screwed it in the most appalling way.
Lets take trip down memory lane:

First round:
2015 - A great year: Weitering, McKay, Curnow and Cunners
2016 - SPS
2017 - Dow, LOB
2018 - Walsh - Stocker
2019 - Kemp, Philp.
2020 - nothing.

We've drafted 11 1st round players in 6 years. 11 still remain.
But wait there's more:

We have traded in at least 6 1st rounders: Docherty, Kennedy, Marchbank, Martin, Plowman, Setterfield -

and finally we have Murphy.

I'm not going to do it but can someone tell me if there is another team in the competition that has 18 1st rounders on their primary list of what is it 36 players?
I'm stunned writing this... HALF our team were 1st round picks when drafted. We should be the Carlton all-stars!

Sadly, courtesy of an inability to nurture this talent we have languished at the bottom or near the bottom for years.

I'm sorry and absolutely nothing personal but I'm in a dark place with this club. Year after year of rationalization and faith crushed by ineptitude of those in charge of the football department. Sigh...
I agree development has been poor.

Just on some of those players that are looking good. Weiters and Harry are KPPs they generally always take a bit longer to develop. Setbacks I'm ok with, they are an opportunity for players to grow and learn from. Not everyone will come from the draft ready to go and dominate (unless they're Sam Walsh). The main thing is, those players from the 2015 and 2018 draft look like keepers, no doubt.

The 2016 and 2017 drafts were just subpar. There's nothing else I can tell you, those drafts, you have a deep look at them and you'll struggle to find a lot of players that have come from there and had a consistent presence at AFL level. Dow is starting to show something at least

Kemp, Philp, Carroll and Durdin it's too early to make the call on them. But Kemp is looking good too if you've seen some of his VFL form, I've got no doubts about him.

I think a lot of supporters are filthy with the club. The decisions they have made have really come to haunt us over the last couple decades.

But, perhaps you can take some comfort in the fact that despite how dreadful our game plan, selection, positions, development and execution has been along with the massive injury list, we've still been in most games this year. We've still given ourselves a chance to win against most teams we've played. Which should tell us that the list isn't so bad. Just small improvements in each of those areas could see us go a long way...
 

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bmaurizio

Norm Smith Medallist
Aug 11, 2004
5,473
7,041
Singapore
AFL Club
Carlton
A KPF/Ruck to replace Casboult. We got Boyd to fill the lockdown small defender.
Yes yr right , it’s an urgent need, we lack competency in the ruck, we need to conjure a trade for Port’s Ladhams or Pie’s Max Lynch, both young and talented, with midfielders, Cerra , Lipinski, & Hewett for experience too if he’s a FA.
Reinvigorates our engine room enormously , whole team actually with more drive & attack power.
Will relive pressure on defense too , without costing the earth.
 
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skadoosh

Club Legend
May 26, 2011
2,645
10,398
AFL Club
Carlton
My kingdom for a couple of hard-running two-way mids who can use the ball decently. Are there any of these we can trade for who won't cost $500k+?
You can talk talent, and potential all you want....but can we get any players who can dig in and apply on game day? We're so bereft of players with a hard attitude.
 

Stamos

Brownlow Medallist
Mar 30, 2010
16,148
29,148
AFL Club
Carlton
My kingdom for a couple of hard-running two-way mids who can use the ball decently. Are there any of these we can trade for who won't cost $500k+?
You can talk talent, and potential all you want....but can we get any players who can dig in and apply on game day? We're so bereft of players with a hard attitude.
The best way to get this isn't to draft/trade in a couple of players, but to change the culture from the top, get a sustainable workable game plan, with enforced standards.
 

Dramoth

Premium Platinum
Jul 19, 2005
28,426
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Bunbury, WA
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Please, no injury prone players
Define injury prone. Remember, we are taking kids in the draft when they are 18. Any form of consistant injuries will not have appeared as yet. It's not until they grow into their bodies will they show a weakness in certain areas that suggests that they might have an issue.

If you are talking about McGovern as being injury prone... his last injury came about after he cased an opposition player at full pace and then tried to make a desperate lunge to tackle him. That overextension is what caused his hamstring to rupture. It wasn't any weakness in the area. If Gov, after recovering from this hamstring goes on and plays the rest of his career and never suffers another injury, is he still injury prone?
 

DangerousD

Norm Smith Medallist
Aug 16, 2015
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Define injury prone. Remember, we are taking kids in the draft when they are 18. Any form of consistant injuries will not have appeared as yet. It's not until they grow into their bodies will they show a weakness in certain areas that suggests that they might have an issue.

If you are talking about McGovern as being injury prone... his last injury came about after he cased an opposition player at full pace and then tried to make a desperate lunge to tackle him. That overextension is what caused his hamstring to rupture. It wasn't any weakness in the area. If Gov, after recovering from this hamstring goes on and plays the rest of his career and never suffers another injury, is he still injury prone?
Simply put, steer clear from players who have had serious injuries and who have been injured regularly, I’m not so fussed about rookie selections, but definitely want to stay away from risky prospects in the first and second round.

Mcgovern is the definition of injury prone, in 6 seasons, he has played more than 16 games, once, but I’m talking about the draft and avoiding players with significant injury histories.
 

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