Hot Topic CARLTON SUPPORTERS ONLY - Carlton fires Captain Carlton

[Gethelred]

Carlton caught up in fresh storm over club mascot

A statement has been issued and the person at the centre of the incident has been sacked.

7news.com.au

This thread is for the discussion of the sacking of a club mascot after refusing to participate in a bar mitzvah which was allegedly sending money back to the IDF.

By taking this position and labelling the act racist, the club has taken a position on the Israel-Palestine conflict.

This thread concerns a discussion of the following:

• whether it is acceptable for the club to fire someone for taking a political stance.
• whether it is a good idea for the club to have taken a public position on this issue.

This thread is not a thread in which you should partake in expressing your political beliefs concerning the conflict, nor is it somewhere in which forum rules do not apply.

Should you seek to participate in conversation related to the war, you can do so here:

Mid East - Israel declare war after Hamas attack IV - Probable Case of Genocide

Continued from Part III https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/israel-declare-war-after-hamas-attack-iii.1381570/ Original Post, October 7, 2023: Israel declares state of war In response to the attacks, which appear to have caught the Israel Defence Forces (IDF) by surprise, Israel has...

www.bigfooty.com

There's also a thread on the SRP for a more robust discussion than can be permitted here:

Moved Thread - Blues mascot 'Captain Carlton' sacked after walking out of Bar Mitzvah and comments about Zionists.

Blues off to a flyer for the off season :D But surely one can criticise the actions of the IDF without being 'anti semitic' ‘Not doing this for f---ing Zios’: Captain Carlton mascot storms out of Bar Mitzvah celebration A man working as a mascot for the Carlton Football Club has stunned...

www.bigfooty.com

If you wish to participate in this thread, do so knowing that this will not be allowed to escalate beyond a point.

Thanks all!

 

[Coona Blues]

Not sure where the lines are at.

My opinion.

Assuming he was there as a paid employee of the Blues, he needs to act professionally. However, he is entitled to his personal beliefs, which in this case clearly are strong. Not sure how much prior knowledge he has had of the gig.

Walking out for mine should not bring censure if he was unaware of details going in. Unfortunately, if he made the comment that has been attributed, he did cross a line. I can understand his disdain over the inadvertent support he was giving assuming it conflicted with a strong belief.

Again, I fully support his right to withdraw labour without censure, but in this day and age which is fraught with so much pressure to conform, he should have kept his mouth shut, particularly with throwaway terminology that is clearly racist in nature.

If the event was a pseudo fundraiser for a foreign military rather than simply a young supporter’s coming of age, that begs so very many more questions of ethics and legality.

 

[bluemahogany]

Disgusting from the club, who are just allergic to making the right decisions time and time again.

 

[Sydney Kicker]

This is a very difficult position for Carlton to take regardless of the stated comment made. Noting the International Court of Justice position and many countries expressed outrage against Israels actions, and here we have an event raising money for the Israel Defence Forces (or at least their soldiers).

Depending on the mascots terms and conditions of employment (and what he actually said - ffs why didn't he just walk out quietly!) he may have good cause to argue unfair dismissal in the courts. And hard to see Carlton doing well in the court of public opinion.

Very sad to see politics intruding on sport. While we often like to take the "you know what" out of opposition clubs I hope this gets resolved without too much fallout.

 

[Pixelshooter]

Absolutely no issue with him not wanting to participate. I'd have done the same. But responding with "Not doing this for ******* Zios" is crossing the line.

 

[slashin_velvet]

Employees a dickhead for swearing and making a scene at a kids event.

Club will likely have to give him a payout to avoid unfair dismissal claims.

If the club knew what the event was raising money for, then shame on them - it's not antisemetic to be opposed to raising money for a foreign military.

 

[El Topo]

Gee, wonder why a children's entertainer might have a problem with raising funds for the IDF... utterly disgraceful as usual by the CFC

 

[SkyhorseTamer]

Club hasn't chosen a side at all. Man was employed to do a job. Handled walking out poorly and made a scene. End of.

Affiliations and purpose are secondary to the above for an employer employee relationship

 

[BlackGoanna]

I can’t believe what I have just read. Surely there is compassion for both sides in this war. There is no room for extreme political or racial views in sport. While this wasn’t a sporting event he was representing our football club.

 

[DirtyLeeds]

Interesting timing here, Patty Kinnersly is the keynote speaker at the MENtal Brekky tomorrow morning! Any questions comrades?
I'll be sitting next to her for breakfast as her host, I can ask a "quiet" question

 

[The Great Ian]

I’m withholding my membership until Captain Carlton is reinstated.

 

[Chief]

If the event was a pseudo fundraiser for a foreign military rather than simply a young supporter’s coming of age, that begs so very many more questions of ethics and legality.

Sensible take I think.

But the club's in a hard place on it, and they want to go with the prevailing political (suck up to the people in control of the purse strings) winds and make a choice.

Shot choice they made, though. Just withdraw membership in protest.

 

[Chief]

I can’t believe what I have just read. Surely there is compassion for both sides in this war. There is no room for extreme political or racial views in sport. While this wasn’t a sporting event he was representing our football club.

They had him along to raise money for a genocide.

He made his choice - respect.

 

[Chief]

Club hasn't chosen a side at all. Man was employed to do a job. Handled walking out poorly and made a scene. End of.

Affiliations and purpose are secondary to the above for an employer employee relationship

Replace "detention guards at a Chinese concentration camp" for "IDF soldiers". Where is the line before it's fair to withdraw your labour?

 

[ferrisb]

Small clarification, it wasn't a fundraiser for a foreign military.

It was a kid's (big) birthday party, where the kid/family decided to donate money from presents to wounded Israeli soldiers.

Sure, maybe the same underlying thing at the end of the day. But there is a little nuance in the situation.

 

[ferrisb]

Replace "detention guards at a Chinese concentration camp" for "IDF soldiers". Where is the line before it's fair to withdraw your labour?

What if the funds were being donated to the Chinese Communist Party and Captain Carlton said 'f*****g commies' before walking out?

Same/different/better/worse?

 

[Magruder]

What if the funds were being donated to the Chinese Communist Party and Captain Carlton said 'f*****g commies' before walking out?

Same/different/better/worse?

Has the persecution of the Uyghur people been deemed a genocide by the ICC?

It seems to me that the employee has a defensible position given the primacy of Oz’s adherence to UN conventions

 

[Pixelshooter]

Right intentions. Wrong delivery.

 

[mickelboy182]

Terrible decision to sack the bloke based on the facts presented so far. Well within his rights to be completely uncomfortable with it.

 

[Chief]

What if the funds were being donated to the Chinese Communist Party and Captain Carlton said 'f*****g commies' before walking out?

Same/different/better/worse?

I wouldn't do some fund raiser for something like that.

Online gambling is where it's at.

 

[Revenant1995]

This is a complex situation, involving many aspects. I'd like to know if the person who was paid to perform as Captain Carlton knew he was going to an event associated with a Jewish religious festival? If so, there would have been certain expectations in terms of how one behaved and spoke. At the same time, I can get why he'd be upset when discovering the fund-raising activity. IMO, I think the club has dropped the ball in both speaking of expectations (no swearing at a kid's event), and ensuring an employee was not put in a situation that went against their conscience.

 

[Broadside]

The Herald Sun headline on the front page is shameful and adds nothing to a nuanced discussion.

 

[ferrisb]

Has the persecution of the Uyghur people been deemed a genocide by the ICC?

It seems to me that the employee has a defensible position given the primacy of Oz’s adherence to UN conventions

No, it hasn't.

Although it should be.

 

[ferrisb]

The Herald Sun headline on the front page is shameful and adds nothing to a nuanced discussion.

The Herald Sun went for inflammatory over nuance? Say it aint so...

 

[carlton_99]

Not sure how this can be described as anti-Semitism when the person was willing to perform at a Bar Mitzvah. Only withdrew after learning funds were going to support IDF soldiers.