List Mgmt. Carlton's 2018 Draft Thread II

[Stamos]

I read a hypothetical in an article where a Giants player gets a bid at 16, they can match with 25 and 52 and spend 19.

I swear the AFL were trying to curb this a little a year or two back. Making it up on the fly again.

The hypothetical is that a club can trade out their next pick after a bid (ie in your example GWS would trade #19 for future pick/s, then match with their remaining next picks). Don't have a lot of time to do it, though.

 

[Macca43]

Nah, he is the main reason. We would still have a pick in range of 25 to 30 for sure and possibly more, if we did not decide to get him instead.
In time it will prove a smart choice that I could not see the wisdom in or not. I hope it works out like our Menzel trade I never saw coming. I love those type of surprises.

If you say so, of course it ignores all the trades we did last year and the trade for Setterfield but whatever floats your boat.

 

[footyfan1978]

The hypothetical is that a club can trade out their next pick after a bid (ie in your example GWS would trade #19 for future pick/s, then match with their remaining next picks). Don't have a lot of time to do it, though.

It is not a major issue as a second party has to agree to a trade anyway and see the worth in doing for them.

 

[HARKER]

No, I want more mids. I did not feel the need for another tall.

Let's be real about it then.

We let go of the two second rounders which ended up at about a 25 & 30.

Which midfielders around that mark would you want and why and now the tricky question; How will those mids work along-side the ones we have....Walsh included.

 

[footyfan1978]

whatever floats your boat.

buoyancy...

 

[Arr0w]

How do you think that'll translate to AFL where the game is much more contested and takes away the room he currently has to kick into?
That's my main worry about him because I'm really not sure.

It is more contested around the stoppage, has been for a while, so the area he is kicking into is still very open, especially when switching the play.

I have no concerns regarding his kicking at the next level

 

[footyfan1978]

Let's be real about it then.

I am, I'd rather have traded such picks for a mid or keep them and be using them in the draft instead of another tall. The real part is that did not happen.
Go McGovern and show me how you can perform.

 

[Arr0w]

Not too dissimilar to Joel Selwood who is not an elite kick.
To be honest neither was Chris Judd.

Walsh's foot skills will not be a liability in my opinion, but he is not elite in that department.

His kicking is nothing like Selwood or Judd, both have more punch, despite the occasional floater from Judd. Not is his kicking the closest thing to Cotchin, his whole game characteristics are almost identical

http://www.richmondfc.com.au/video/2017-11-14/draft-highlights-cotchin-2007

 

[Arr0w]

Just to keep the ND into perspective, from 2007 - 2014, only 2 players remain on our list from those combined drafts, Kreuzer and Cripps

 

[HARKER]

I am, I'd rather have traded such picks for a mid or keep them and be using them in the draft instead of another tall. The real part is that did not happen.
Go McGovern and show me how you can perform.

We may miss on the best mid of draft at around that 25 - 30 mark. Who knows for sure but let's look at it this way.

We now have #3 Dow, #5 Setterfield, #6 Petrevski-Seton, #1 Walsh (soon) #13 Kennedy, #16 Lang, #27 Fisher and that other #13 Cripps.
There's a lot of talent there you'd be asking for a new #25-#30 mid to usurp.

We don't need any more 18 year old mids. We have to get the right ones next year via trade or FA.

 

[Masqualero]

His kicking is nothing like Selwood or Judd, both have more punch, despite the occasional floater from Judd. Not is his kicking the closest thing to Cotchin, his whole game characteristics are almost identical

http://www.richmondfc.com.au/video/2017-11-14/draft-highlights-cotchin-2007

People forget how good the Cotch was in 2012, his lego like head makes people disregard him IMO.

Does he have the "hardness" of Twents game?

 

[Robertio]

I think what all of us tend to do is attribute more value to a pick (i.e potential) than for the player you've traded that pick for.

We effectively gave up #13 for McGovern. Which player from 13 - 20 from last year would you have sooner than him, right now?

I feel that puts things into a little better perspective.

Spot on Harks, i'll take McGovern every day of the week.

 

[footyfan1978]

let's look at it this way.
We now have #3 Dow, #5 Setterfield, #6 Petrevski-Seton, #1 Walsh (soon) #13 Kennedy, #16 Lang, #27 Fisher and that other #13 Cripps.
There's a lot of talent there you'd be asking for a new #25-#30 mid to usurp.

I am not looking at it that way. I am looking at us with a very young midfield, but not enough just yet, but plenty of young talls. Much more depth in talls than smalls. I would have preferred we back in our other talls than load up on another one. Weitering, Marchbank, Jones, Plowman, Macreadie, Jack Silvagni, Kerr, Charlie Curnow, De Konning, Kerr, Harry McKay and a Ben Silvagni was plenty of tall resources to work with and develop. I am pretty confident we will find enough really good ones out of them but might struggle to all service them as only so many roles for talls in a team at once. What we lacked was smalls and mids, Not talls. I'd rather have a surplus of smalls to work with than talls.

 

[Blue__Balls]

I am, I'd rather have traded such picks for a mid or keep them and be using them in the draft instead of another tall. The real part is that did not happen.
Go McGovern and show me how you can perform.

Which midfielder would you like us to have traded them for?

Please offer some kind of proof as to that player's willingness to come to Carlton, and that the second round picks in question would have been enough to satisfy their club.

Because you can prefer all you like, but we didn't have a heap of players lining up to join us.

As far as using them in the draft, as pointed out by many, two second rounders MIGHT secure ONE reasonable AFL-level player. Everyone gets over-excited by the prospect of sliders and under-rated future jets, but it's a very mixed bag around that point of the draft and the chances are much higher that we end up with a Lewis Taylor than a Zach Merrett.

 

[Matty411]

So with Walsh and BSOS all but locked in, what do we want to see with the other late pick?

A Gibbons type mature mid who could play right away and improve our depth?
Another young small forward with potential?
A specific player (name them)?

 

[Robertio]

We do not have a pick between 1 and 69. That is directly related to the McGovern trade. The perspective is just fine. He will either prove it was worth doing or not. I look forward to seeing the wisdom of the trade reveal itself in time. At the moment with draft on, I feeling the missing picks in round 2 and 3 more.

6 goals against the Tigers in Rnd 1 next year and you will come around ff.

 

[footyfan1978]

So with Walsh and BSOS all but locked in, what do we want to see with the other late pick?

A Gibbons type mature mid who could play right away and improve our depth?
Another young small forward with potential?
A specific player (name them)?

Without knowing whom available way back then, best bet is another mid. If any mature aged types, would be pretty handy if we think some real chance of playing straight away and taking some load off Crippa. Next best would be another small forward. Not against a pacy small back either.

 

[Blue__Balls]

So with Walsh and BSOS all but locked in, what do we want to see with the other late pick?

A Gibbons type mature mid who could play right away and improve our depth?
Another young small forward with potential?
A specific player (name them)?

An absolute campaigner of a small forward who likes starting fights.

I had high hopes for Gallucci, but alas, it wasn't to be.

 

[footyfan1978]

6 goals against the Tigers in Rnd 1 next year and you will come around ff.

That is what I want to see. Or somehow becomes a gun down back instead. As long as he performs I will be very happy. Good pedigree going by his bro. Have a lot of time for Jeremy McGovern. If Mitch can be 80% as good I will be very happy.

 

[ferrisb]

Just to keep the ND into perspective, from 2007 - 2014, only 2 players remain on our list from those combined drafts, Kreuzer and Cripps

That is an amazing stat.

Now, let us never speak of it again!

 

[bigdog43]

Walsh has not played a bad game this year, in fact the game he was a little quiet he still had 27 touches (I think). Brilliant leader, keeps his feet, finds it for fun and seems a ripping kid. Vic Metro had him ranked as the best player in the draft, Rankine the only other player in the conversation. Wait until this kid gets some size, could be anything.

 

[Arr0w]

People forget how good the Cotch was in 2012, his lego like head makes people disregard him IMO.

Does he have the "hardness" of Twents game?

Again, I see it the same. Neither shirk a contest, but nor do the have a natural hardness of a Viney

 

[dlb99]

His kicking is nothing like Selwood or Judd, both have more punch, despite the occasional floater from Judd. Not is his kicking the closest thing to Cotchin, his whole game characteristics are almost identical

http://www.richmondfc.com.au/video/2017-11-14/draft-highlights-cotchin-2007

Disagree, Cotchin's kicking is quite similar to Selwood, and Walsh will be similar to both.

Selwood does not have much punch to his kick. Bryce Gibbs is a far superior kick than Selwood; yet Selwood has been the better player. Hence, why I don't worry about Walsh and his so-called kicking weakness. He'll be more than fine in the same way Cotchin and Selwood have been fine.

 

[Arr0w]

We may miss on the best mid of draft at around that 25 - 30 mark. Who knows for sure but let's look at it this way.

We now have #3 Dow, #5 Setterfield, #6 Petrevski-Seton, #1 Walsh (soon) #13 Kennedy, #16 Lang, #27 Fisher and that other #13 Cripps.
There's a lot of talent there you'd be asking for a new #25-#30 mid to usurp.

We don't need any more 18 year old mids. We have to get the right ones next year via trade or FA.

I completely disagree with this sentence. It would also suggest we take no other kids in this draft, which stagger me

 

[footyfan1978]

Walsh has not played a bad game this year, in fact the game he was a little quiet he still had 27 touches (I think). Brilliant leader, keeps his feet, finds it for fun and seems a ripping kid. Vic Metro had him ranked as the best player in the draft, Rankine the only other player in the conversation. Wait until this kid gets some size, could be anything.

That's the part that so undersold by those just skimming highlights and profiles of all draftees. All these qualities in one player is so bloody rare. Amazing to have bad games be so much higher than other kids bad games.