List Mgmt. Carlton's 2018 Draft Thread (cont. in Part 2)

[DangerousD]

You’ve kinda said it but their number one priority is always appetite. Toughness can’t be taught is a fairly strong theme at the swans. They expect it. 100% all the time. They’ve built very good teams off the back of players who make absolutely everything of their talent.

Dam straight, meat and potatoes players, stocky runts, role players, hard nuts but guys that work hard and are obviously coached and developed well. I would love to know there PSD and rookie drafting criteria, what/how they look for. Surely they are operating to a different criteria to others.

 

[katmanblue]

Dam straight, meat and potatoes players, stocky runts, role players, hard nuts but guys that work hard and are obviously coached and developed well. I would love to know there PSD and rookie drafting criteria, what/how they look for. Surely they are operating to a different criteria to others.

Agresta would know. And he works for us now.

On [device_name] using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Pafloyul]

Not an issue anymore. If we do not have pick #1, we can just pick the best midfielder or Rankine.

There is always the possibility of one of the Daniel Day-Lewis twins that you've conveniently forgotten about.

I hear you too SmokingGun
The pieces have to be massaged into place and I find myself in a strange position basically arguing against my normal self.

This may just make for an unusual situation this year as if we listen to the CFC and take into account what we may see to be the plan, the draft may not be as importnant or pronounced as it has been in the past three years. Maybe we've already set the platform for the 66 game rebuild and and the plans are well afoot. What of we don;t go into this draft with a first pick.....That would really throw the proverbial cat amongst the pigeons

Don't set me off, Harks... don't set me off.....!

 

[LordLucifer]

That was just some amazing...Chayce Jones

Why wont he..... Chayce Jones

He just loves to.... Chayce Jones

So many possibilities!

"you can't Chayce Jones"

 

[Arr0w]

Everything I read about him talks about his agility and skill. I would like to know what his work ethic and defensive pressure is like though...is he just a flashy kid getting by on talent? Or is he a hard worker and good teammate.

I wouldn't read too much into that comment.

 

[DangerousD]

Oh easily. If Lukosius fell our way, his type would easily fall into our forward set-up having three very mobile tall forwards.

All big ifs but IF Mckay manufactures the strength to compete 1:2, who wouldn't mind the likes of 2 Riewoldts running around, in CCurnow and Lukosius.
Don't worry about the height so much, as it's all the other traits that come along with those guys that would give opposition clubs plenty to worry about.

I'm just a little disappointed that Weitering hasn't gone to plan.....yet, anyway.
He'd make for the perfect CHF for us and if things had gone to plan, we may not be talking about Lukosius quite as much....maybe.

How do you think Harry rucked yesterday? He would have to to do a lot of rucking i would think in that forward structure. Is it possible that having 3 strong key forwards could be bad for structure and strategy/gameplan?

If we did go down that path, it would surely spell the end for BSOS, JSOS, Kerr and any other medium forward.

 

[9874123]

And was at pre season camp with us.

I wonder if this was requested by either him or us? Or is it random

Well O'brien was with us the year before...

 

[HARKER]

How do you think Harry rucked yesterday? He would have to to do a lot of rucking i would think in that forward structure. Is it possible that having 3 strong key forwards could be bad for structure and strategy/gameplan?

If we did go down that path, it would surely spell the end for BSOS, JSOS, Kerr and any other medium forward.

No offence to any individual, but I just want what's best for the club and if that precludes a Silvagni from being best 22 picked, so be it.

Harry @ 204cm will learn how to ruck. Don't think he really has a say in it and in Thy's words: He's going to ruck and he's going to like it.

 

[HARKER]

Just on drafts and looking back at the 2014 draft.
We clearly made mistakes with our chosen players, but there were many that were talked up highly that just haven't produced and even at this stage, look somewhat unlikely to:
Corey Ellis, Durdin, Langford, Laverde, Goddard, Menadue, Mckenzie, Tom Lamb, Wigg.

Quite a few guys here that looked like making good and at least just at this stage....look a long way off.

 

[Arr0w]

Just on drafts and looking back at the 2014 draft.
We clearly made mistakes with our chosen players, but there were many that were talked up highly that just haven't produced and even at this stage, look somewhat unlikely to:
Corey Ellis, Durdin, Langford, Laverde, Goddard, Menadue, Mckenzie, Tom Lamb, Wigg.

Quite a few guys here that looked like making good and at least just at this stage....look a long way off.

Ellis will make it
Durdin will make it
Menadue will make it
Goddard has had a terrible run with injury
Lamb believed his own hype, but could play

The rest no

 

[HARKER]

Ellis will make it
Durdin will make it
Menadue will make it
Goddard has had a terrible run with injury
Lamb believed his own hype, but could play

The rest no

Ellis is soft....very soft.
Menadue is light and few tricks unfolding to show him up as a player. The fourth Western Jet boy is though starting to play well; Liam Duggan.
Goddards injuries haven't served him well at all.

From all the players I named the one i think will make it is Durdin, but even he may have Ben Mckay ahead of him. Time will tell

 

[Arr0w]

Personally don't think Ellis is sogt, just vanilla

Menadue has some decent speed, think he will still make it

I likened Durdin to Westoff in his draft year, think he will be okay

 

[HARKER]

Personally don't think Ellis is sogt, just vanilla
Menadue has some decent speed, think he will still make it
I likened Durdin to Westoff in his draft year, think he will be okay

I know what you're saying.
Interesting looking back on that draft year as to how many 'well-rated' players may fall of the map altogether and outside the ones I brought up for one reason or another: McCartin, Brayshaw, Pickett, Ahern and even Wright and Darcy Moore, from the top ten.
Not justifying our bad process at the time, but maybe the net result won't be quite as bad as may have seen to have been.
i.e. May just be a case of everyone loses.

 

[Arr0w]

I know what you're saying.
Interesting looking back on that draft year as to how many 'well-rated' players may fall of the map altogether and outside the ones I brought up for one reason or another: McCartin, Brayshaw, Pickett, Ahern and even Wright and Darcy Moore, from the top ten.
Not justifying our bad process at the time, but maybe the net result won't be quite as bad as may have seen to have been.
i.e. May just be a case of everyone loses.

That could be true, but i nearly fell off the couch when they called out BB' s name

 

[HARKER]

That could be true, but i nearly fell off the couch when they called out BB' s name

I didn't because I knew exactly who we'd be taking.

Didn't mind the idea at the time for I thought we were putting the right pieces together.......until I saw them through the pre-season and inito the VFL.
Realisation came hard watching a flat-footed Jaksch walking around contests, DVR running with Wood and Jones ( a supposed mid running with the two least athletic players at our club...FMD) and Boekhorst more concerned about perception than reality.

Again, it wasn't all the players fault. The 'system' just wasn't right.

 

[El Topo]

Just on drafts and looking back at the 2014 draft.
We clearly made mistakes with our chosen players, but there were many that were talked up highly that just haven't produced and even at this stage, look somewhat unlikely to:
Corey Ellis, Durdin, Langford, Laverde, Goddard, Menadue, Mckenzie, Tom Lamb, Wigg.

Quite a few guys here that looked like making good and at least just at this stage....look a long way off.

Can't wait to pick up Lavere as a DFA

 

[HARKER]

Can't wait to pick up Lavere as a DFA

* him. he was so desperate to go to Essendon, he can live out his fate. See Kavanagh

 

[Just Kreuzing]

**** him. he was so desperate to go to Essendon, he can live out his fate. See Kavanagh

Agree, **** him.

 

[The Smoking Gun]

get chayce jones - what a name - I don't care if he doesn't come with a head - I want him at carlton - imagine on the wing? chayce jones! so good.....

Well that's exactly where he plays and not only is he tough, fast, tenacious and skilful, but he has a commodity few draft prospects possess and that is "presence".

 

[El Topo]

**** him. he was so desperate to go to Essendon, he can live out his fate. See Kavanagh

Sometimes we need to put aside strategic planning and personal grievances for the higher good of outstanding footy banter.

 

[ferrisb]

Well that's exactly where he plays and not only is he tough, fast, tenacious and skilful, but he has a commodity few draft prospects possess and that is "presence".

If we recruited Chayce, I'd like to see the opposition trying to keep up with him and Liam Jones...

 

[The Smoking Gun]

As an avid draft watcher, where do you rate Thomas? There seems to be quite varied opinions of him.

Another kid worth keeping an eye on is Luke Valente from SA. He's another whose game is rapidly expanding like Richards. He's far too good for the SANFL U18s and just trying to make the step up in grade to the SANFL reserves. His ability to put others into space by hand from the stoppages in the 2nd half of the academy game was outstanding. Will need to improve his disposal by foot though to be considered in the 1st Round of this draft. Definitely one to keep an eye on come the Nationals.

 

[Cripps17]

Juddy offering support to King. Vested interest perhaps.

 

[DangerousD]

Saw a a quick picture of Ben Ronke's champion data stats for his draft year on, on the couch, i think and i was surprised to see every stat they had, he was rated elite in 2 of them and above average on all others. So it begs the question, why was he overlooked by all clubs multiple times?

A lot of posters mention moneyball scenarios on this forum but it seems most clubs are missing gems for unconscious bias.

I saw an interview with Ronke after the game, if i had to make an assumption it would be that he could be a bit of a lad, likes to joke around, a bit pretty but if that was 100% true, surely that doesn't push someone down the draft order that much, does it?

It surprises me the same that Brayshaw shot up the draft rankings because of his perceived good character.

 

[CJMB]

Saw a a quick picture of Ben Ronke's champion data stats for his draft year on, on the couch, i think and i was surprised to see every stat they had, he was rated elite in 2 of them and above average on all others. So it begs the question, why was he overlooked by all clubs multiple times?

A lot of posters mention moneyball scenarios on this forum but it seems most clubs are missing gems for unconscious bias.

I saw an interview with Ronke after the game, if i had to make an assumption it would be that he could be a bit of a lad, likes to joke around, a bit pretty but if that was 100% true, surely that doesn't push someone down the draft order that much, does it?

It surprises me the same that Brayshaw shot up the draft rankings because of his perceived good character.

I think Brayshaw was also a safe pick. Good all-round skills, seriously driven, and one of the fitter kids due to his work ethic (and character). He was taken at #2 which came from GCS in exchange for Weller so Freo probably wanted to be sure they'd get a replacement midfielder out of it who would make the grade.