List Mgmt. Carlton's 2019 Draft Thread

Manhattanite

Senior List
Sep 2, 2017
221
526
AFL Club
Carlton
Not sure I would be targeting players like Papley, given the cost, when there are so many FA/OOC who could do play similar roles
Papley is in All Australian form and is only going to get better. Plus he is tough and uncompromising and great for our culture. We don’t need similar roles - we need a gun small forward who complements our talls and doesn’t give a defense a chance. Sure any decent crumber could do well around our talls but with Papley we get a whole new threat and can dominate.

We have three first round picks and probably enough salary cap space for another 3 free agents the next 3 off seasons so we need to spend wisely on All Australian caliber and not fringe players.


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

Arr0w

Brownlow Medallist
Nov 13, 2015
15,423
35,042
In Transit
AFL Club
Carlton
Is there any truth to the adage that poor outing from Vic metro means shallow draft?
Nothing to do with just metro, when you get the quality we had last year( many of which featured as 17 year olds), it does effect the quality the year after.

I would say that the top 12 from last year would feature heavily this year, if available

This year is very similar to 2016, with a slight downgrade
 

Arr0w

Brownlow Medallist
Nov 13, 2015
15,423
35,042
In Transit
AFL Club
Carlton
What quality small forwards are FA/OOC? FA aren't necessarily going to choose us and OOC still have to be traded for.

Cameron went for about pick 12 and is a better trade comparison than Mitchell who at the time I thought went for unders.
I never made any comparisons to the likes of Cameron or Mitchell. But given you have highlighted a player like Cameron, clubs outside of Victoria, namely regions such as QLD, would generally have to pay overs to attract players, as did GC for Weller. The other consideration is the quality of draft this year and while I agree with many that Papley is worth a latish 1st, the price tag could be higher, given the lack of quality in this draft

All I said is that I believe there is better bang for your buck players, namely FA and OOC

Who though and how does more mean better?

If Papley did come at that say #14, aren't we better off than fishing around for bargains that may not work...or worse...players we don't need.
So we go to the draft. Then what? Do we just take the best player regardless of the 'type' or do we look for a specific 'type' that may have well been sitting there much later in the draft?

I think it would make for a terrible idea to go to the draft and pick-up let's say another midfielder and then only to have to try and manufacture another role for him, because we're already running quite deep in this department and we didn't get that ready-to-go 24-26 year old premium mid.

Again, I feel it was clear that when we took Stocker, that Adelaides pick was already earmarked for a player. Let's see how that pans out.
Riley Knight, Lewis Taylor, Sam Gray, Jack Newnes, Jamie Elliott, Ed Langdon, Nakia Cockatoo, Jack Martin, Alex Neal-Bullen, Anthony McDonald-Tipungwuti, Liam Baker, Shai Bolton. You may not like or want most of them, but there are a couple that would make our side considerably better, for far less in cost

As for the draft, nothing wrong with targeting the best player and if that is a mid, then the likes of a Fisher could be that small forward that everyone has been yearning. Perhaps that best draftee, is a Gresham, Higgins etc that were also taken late first

Papley is in All Australian form and is only going to get better. Plus he is tough and uncompromising and great for our culture. We don’t need similar roles - we need a gun small forward who complements our talls and doesn’t give a defense a chance. Sure any decent crumber could do well around our talls but with Papley we get a whole new threat and can dominate.

We have three first round picks and probably enough salary cap space for another 3 free agents the next 3 off seasons so we need to spend wisely on All Australian caliber and not fringe players.


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app
Not disputing that Papley would be a great pick up, but this perception that we need elite/A graders is a fallacy. If we can beat the likes of the Lions and then the Dockers when we had Cripps, Doc, Harry, Cuners and Charlie all out, surely that would highlight the game has always been about your bottom 6 players.

How many elite players were part of the last 3 flags?

Bont in 2016?
Rance, Martin Riewoldt and Cotchin 2017?
Kennedy, Shuey, McGovern 2018?

Cripps, Charlie, McKay, Weitering? Then a host of others that are knocking on the door.

Papley will cost more than a pick in the 12-14 range, so I would not spend that currency nor more when you can gain similar for less value
 
Last edited:

The Smoking Gun

Club Legend
Feb 1, 2015
1,442
5,228
Contract Negotiations.
AFL Club
Carlton
Ditto. Quite a few of the W.A. boys were impressive. Suma had them set-up and ready to play.

What do you think of Robertson?
Robertson is merely an accumulator, although a very good one, but with little hurt factor. What impresses me about Robertson is what he does without the ball.

Mid to latish 1st range in this draft

Edited: Luke Jackson is one that I rated highly from last year, continues to improve for a big guy
I'd like to see a bit more of him, but i sense something about him. Yes he is an accumulator and yes he has rather little hurt factor but i think he has the knack of getting the important possession or the important hand in or the important tackle or the important holdup. And yes he works without the ball too.

I dunno, i guess i'm kinda saying he is a leader style player week to week. Kinda thinkin Sloane style or Ward. Scrappyish but bloody good. Bosses the game. And with smarts and intent, not brawn yet.
I don't mind Robertson. Was very impressive last year in a substandard WA side and has improved since. Is one of the few mids who has a genuine crack in the air against much taller opponents. I do agree with Arr0w that there are other midfielders that'll be available around the same pick who'll extract greater damage with less disposals.

The one I really like out of the WA midfield is Trent Rivers. Has size, reasonable speed, good decision-making skills, has very solid disposal by hand or foot and not afraid to stick his head in places he shouldn't. Also has the versatility you can play him inside, outside, on a wing, HB or HF. One thing I do know is that this kid's footy is on a very sharp upwards curve and SOS loves his WA midfielders. He's one of the few kids outside the top dozen who'd be ready to play Round 1. He's someone I see many people saying in 3 years time, "HTF did he go at Pick 13-20!!!"

The other kid I really like is Sam Flanders, but I think he's just a little bit too good at this stage to slide outside the Top 10.
 

HARKER

Hall of Famer
Oct 15, 2008
49,989
67,601
Melbourne
AFL Club
Carlton
Riley Knight, Lewis Taylor, Sam Gray, Jack Newnes, Jamie Elliott, Ed Langdon, Nakia Cockatoo, Jack Martin, Alex Neal-Bullen, Anthony McDonald-Tipungwuti, Liam Baker, Shai Bolton. You may not like or want most of them, but there are a couple that would make our side considerably better, for far less in cost

As for the draft, nothing wrong with targeting the best player and if that is a mid, then the likes of a Fisher could be that small forward that everyone has been yearning. Perhaps that best draftee, is a Gresham, Higgins etc that we also taken late first
They look a bit yucky to me Arr0w and not the calibre of Papley for something we require.

We can take on half a dozen so-so players and then what? May get lucky with one....may get lucky with two, but at what expense?
Missing on who you really wanted? Maybe we don't think that much of Papley, then don't worry about him......not even for a second rounder, but I don't subscribe to the "If you can't be with the one you love, love the one you're with' scenario.

We have to target specifics and get the best possible, of those specifics. No point having three 2-star players at the expense of one 4-star player.


DRAFT: Lots wrong with targeting talent for talents sake. Mentioned this many times over as GWS had talent to burn....just not the right talent in the right places, along with having a poor culture (which shouldn't be hard to imagine)
 

Arr0w

Brownlow Medallist
Nov 13, 2015
15,423
35,042
In Transit
AFL Club
Carlton
I don't mind Robertson. Was very impressive last year in a substandard WA side and has improved since. Is one of the few mids who has a genuine crack in the air against much taller opponents. I do agree with Arr0w that there are other midfielders that'll be available around the same pick who'll extract greater damage with less disposals.

The one I really like out of the WA midfield is Trent Rivers. Has size, reasonable speed, good decision-making skills, has very solid disposal by hand or foot and not afraid to stick his head in places he shouldn't. Also has the versatility you can play him inside, outside, on a wing, HB or HF. One thing I do know is that this kid's footy is on a very sharp upwards curve and SOS loves his WA midfielders. He's one of the few kids outside the top dozen who'd be ready to play Round 1. He's someone I see many people saying in 3 years time, "HTF did he go at Pick 13-20!!!"

The other kid I really like is Sam Flanders, but I think he's just a little bit too good at this stage to slide outside the Top 10.
Yeap, mentioned Rivers earlier, would be very pleased if we selected him
 

Arr0w

Brownlow Medallist
Nov 13, 2015
15,423
35,042
In Transit
AFL Club
Carlton
They look a bit yucky to me Arr0w and not the calibre of Papley for something we require.

We can take on half a dozen so-so players and then what? May get lucky with one....may get lucky with two, but at what expense?
Missing on who you really wanted? Maybe we don't think that much of Papley, then don't worry about him......not even for a second rounder, but I don't subscribe to the "If you can't be with the one you love, love the one you're with' scenario.

We have to target specifics and get the best possible, of those specifics. No point having three 2-star players at the expense of one 4-star player.
So not one of the players I mentioned would be of interest? Tippa perhaps?
 

HARKER

Hall of Famer
Oct 15, 2008
49,989
67,601
Melbourne
AFL Club
Carlton
So not one of the players I mentioned would be of interest? Tippa perhaps?
I stand corrected. Several names do make for possible good gets, Tippa being one, but maybe I've just haven't absorbed that possibility.
What I'm suggesting though is to not be afraid to part with currency to get what you really want as opposed to a couple, or several of 'make-do's'

Just take players that make immediate sense and make four team better from the get-go...no fringe players that will flip-flop between the main and the reserves teams or players we don't really require, but 'admire' their talent...and if we think we can turn this 5/10 player into a 8/10 player....then no....just no.
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

TerryWallet

Brownlow Medallist
Jan 27, 2008
10,607
23,049
Melbourne
AFL Club
Carlton
Ok, for the sake of something to do, and maybe discuss, i'll be first cab off the rank and have compiled my first rough list for the year. Not Carlton specific, just my power ranking.

1. Brodie Kemp
2. Dylan Williams
3. Matt Rowell
4. Deven Robertson
5. Noah Anderson
6. Lachie Young
7. Cam Taheny
8. Luke Jackson
9. Lachie Ashe
10. Fisher McAsey
11. Nick Bryan
12. Elijah Taylor
13. Harry Schoenberg
14. Will Gould
15. Sam Flanders
16. Mal Rosas
17. Charlie Comben
18. Ky Pickett
19. Liam Henry
20. Trent Rivers
21. Mitch O'Neill
22. Jeremy Sharp
23. Tom Green
24. Caleb Serong
25. Sam DeKonning

Fair to say i think this draft is similar to 2014 standard. Not a lot i am real confident about.
 

The Smoking Gun

Club Legend
Feb 1, 2015
1,442
5,228
Contract Negotiations.
AFL Club
Carlton
Here are some rough thoughts on the draft rankings.


1. Hayden Young - I am going to stick with this kid has my #1, just has marking, tackling, kicking and agility. Not 100% locked on him being pick 1, but he has a massive ceiling for me and if he moves into the midfield like Kemp has shown, he should be around the mark.
2. Brodie Kemp - Just another likely prospect that can play anywhere in my mind. I think he could move forward, back and certainly looks at home in the midfield. Lovely size, just screams AFL to me and once again like Young has plenty of upside at AFL level.
3. Lachlan Ash - Was my favourite player last year and still is close to my favourite player in this draft. He has speed, kicking and can play back and forward, another massive upside pick in my eyes.
4. Thomas Green - Okay, I am onboard with this player now, he is a contested beast and was close to a one man army for the Allies in the middle. I am less worried about those players with AFL developed bodies not having upside, this guy is a beast already.
5. Matt Rowell - This kid is about as close to a lock to play 200 games in this draft. You could certainly argue for pick 1 with this kid, I am just knocking him down due to size and scope for pure upside. Still, whoever gets this kid will not be upset in the slightest.
6. Sam Flanders - Jump on board this kids train, showed against SA that he can play midfield. He has shown he is very dangerous forward so a goal kicking midfielder is always wanted at AFL level. Once again is a man playing against kids, but that does not bother me as much these days, I know he can build an AFL bodie.
7. Noah Anderson - I wanted more from this kid and he was very solid, just did not hit the highs I would hope. Again another player that if you picked him with the first pick, I would not complain.
8. Will Gould - Once again another man child that does not worry me at AFL level, just wins the ball and attacks every contest.
9. Caleb Serong - Gets the ball, marks the ball and is a contested beast. I just question his kicking and decision making skills at times, that is where he drops down the list.
10. Trent Rivers - He will move into the midfield in the second half of the season and has shown he is very good in the backline. Reads the play before most players, has a great kick on him and hits his targets, hard at the ball and has a defensive side to his game.
11. Jeremy Sharp - Where do you rate this kid, could be anything and could be a flop. I am going for upside here and selecting him high. There is a massive * next to his name that would allow me to drop him down the rankings.
12. Trent Bianco - You want the ball in this kids hands, tough and makes good decisions.
13. Fisher Mcasey - If you need a key defender this is your man and is a lovely kick and makes great decisions.
14. Trey Ruscoe - Okay this is my bandwagon and I am sticking to it. I think he will move into the midfield long term but maybe spend the first 5 years as a defender. Such a tough player at the ball and strong overhead and kicks the ball nicely.
15. Finn Maginess - Inside contested ball winning midfielder that always has a place at AFL level.
16. Liam Henry
17. Dylan Stephens
18. Jay Rantell
19. Devon Robertson
20. Mich O'Neill
21. Elijah Taylor
22. Luke Jackson
23. Josh Worrell
24. Will Day - If he can show he has the ability to develop a larger frame, he may go higher.
25. Harry Schoenberg
26. Jackson Mead
27. Miles Bergman
28. Dylan Williams
29. Brock Smith
30. Harrison Jones - Maybe a little too high, but I like him.
31. Jake Pasini - If someone really wants a tall defender, he may go higher
32. Cameron Taheny
33. Dyson Hilder - If someone really wants a tall defender, he may go higher
34. Malcolm Rosas Jnr - Small forward could go higher if required
35. Cody Weightman - Small forward could go higher if required
36. Thomson Dow
37. Riley Garcia
38. Sam De Koning
39. Louis Butler
40. Kysaiah Pickett
I still think Cooper Stephens comfortably makes the Top 30, if not higher, of that list.
Brock Smith is an interesting one. I thought his game might have developed more based upon what I saw of him last year as an under-ager.
 

WalshistheGOAT

Senior List
Mar 25, 2019
152
312
AFL Club
Carlton
Ok, for the sake of something to do, and maybe discuss, i'll be first cab off the rank and have compiled my first rough list for the year. Not Carlton specific, just my power ranking.

1. Brodie Kemp
2. Dylan Williams
3. Matt Rowell
4. Deven Robertson
5. Noah Anderson
6. Lachie Young
7. Cam Taheny
8. Luke Jackson
9. Lachie Ashe
10. Fisher McAsey
11. Nick Bryan
12. Elijah Taylor
13. Harry Schoenberg
14. Will Gould
15. Sam Flanders
16. Mal Rosas
17. Charlie Comben
18. Ky Pickett
19. Liam Henry
20. Trent Rivers
21. Mitch O'Neill
22. Jeremy Sharp
23. Tom Green
24. Caleb Serong
25. Sam DeKonning

Fair to say i think this draft is similar to 2014 standard. Not a lot i am real confident about.
In a similar boat to you, not really sold on too many of them. Young for me the big stand out as he just looks like a Sicily clone with more pace and no temper, rocket launcher of a left foot. Rowell and Anderson don't blow me away at the moment, but they are relatively slight of frame still so with added size and fitness I can see why recruiters are so bullish on them, clearly very natural and smart footballers. There just seems to be a lot of James Worpel types who win the ball due to their size and don't look like they have much to improve on once they get to an AFL club. Walsh, Rozee, Stack etc are still so undersized and are performing like freaks right now which makes me excited about them. I just don't see many that I think wow this kids gonna dominate once he's had 4-5 pre seasons in this years crop. Havent seen much of him but I really wanna see Dylan Williams, talked about possibly the most talented of the lot, but he fades in and out and gets moved around a lot, hard to get a read as a casual follower of the under 18s
 

LemmingMaster

Brownlow Medallist
Mar 13, 2008
10,272
4,302
Perth, Australia
AFL Club
Carlton
2. Dylan Williams - He must have been playing some great footy outside of the champs, he has not really shown much this champs
7. Cam Taheny - I hope for your sake he is really really really injured
8. Luke Jackson - Rucks never go high, Bailey Williams, especially undersized versions
11. Nick Bryan - He will take 5 years before he is AFL ready, not really something you want to spend a top 15 pick on
24. Caleb Serong - Tough love here, he has a few tricks, even if his kicking is suspect
Rough thoughts
 

TerryWallet

Brownlow Medallist
Jan 27, 2008
10,607
23,049
Melbourne
AFL Club
Carlton
Rough thoughts
Williams: His finals series last year was better than anyone's Championships imo. He's learning other skills/positions this year as Jaidyn Stephenson did in his top year.
Taheny: He was injured. That was clear to see. He is a punt i'm prepared to take at this stage. 11 goals in 3 SANFL games before injury. Undoubtedly has some class.
Jackson: I am selecting him as a 200cm ruck. He is 198 now and still only 17. If he stalls at 198 it will be tough. But i'm adding a couple cm's in growth and another couple for leap. Beyond that, he is a ruck rover after the ruck contest.
Bryan: Agree on the timeframe. Fair to say with the selections of Bryan and Comben that i'm not over thrilled with the other choices. Rather wait 5 years for something good than spend 5 years playing something no good.
Serong: Yeah, not seeing over lots there. Might make a player. About Spargo and West class to me. They rightly went about 30 odd. Maybe i've caught him on bad days but not fussed on what i've seen and project.

Cheers
 

Wickzki

Brownlow Medallist
Oct 1, 2010
15,366
18,236
Brisbane
AFL Club
Carlton
Other Teams
PDX Blazers, Angels, Patriots, MCFC
Got to speak to my GCS recruitment friend this morning as I had an appointment where he also works.

I asked him his thoughts on the champs and the draft.

He said he was really underwhelmed. Last year he said you knew the first round or so was going to be special pretty early on. Its the exact opposite this year. He believes we picked the right year to swap our first round pick and that the only negativity will be because of an arbitrary number rather than the actual players selected. Thinks that had Stocker been in this draft he'd be getting a lot of hype and that we got a 250-gamer should injuries not cruel him. He isn't sure whether there's one of those "250-gamers" in this draft and that even the players that become consensus first rounders have visible AFL shortcomings.
"You'll be able to throw a blanket over them this year. The pick the Crows give you (he thinks 10-14) could easily end up better than the pick 3 or 4 you give them."
 

Coops93

Premiership Player
Aug 19, 2015
3,720
6,880
Gold Coast
AFL Club
Carlton
Other Teams
Arsenal, Denver Broncos
Call me a romantic, but I'd like to get Dows brother. I don't think we'll keep our first round pick and I expect to somehow end up with a second round pick. Use that on Dow and I'd be happy, depending on where the pick falls in the 2nd round.
 

The Bighouse

Premiership Player
Jun 28, 2009
4,167
3,981
Perth
AFL Club
Carlton
Call me a romantic, but I'd like to get Dows brother. I don't think we'll keep our first round pick and I expect to somehow end up with a second round pick. Use that on Dow and I'd be happy, depending on where the pick falls in the 2nd round.
Brothers in arms.
Dow x 2
De Koning x 2
Walsh x 2 (next year)
Silvagni x 3 (next year)
Curnow x 2
 

Coona Blues

Premium Platinum
Nov 3, 2011
2,288
5,438
Bundaberg, Qld
AFL Club
Carlton
Brothers in arms.
Dow x 2
De Koning x 2
Walsh x 2 (next year)
Silvagni x 3 (next year)
Curnow x 2
You overlooked a possible Cripps x 2. Joshua listed with South Fremantle, although yet to play.

Only problem with that list is three of the young brothers are rucks or possible monster KPP in the case of SDK. Will likely be in the market for at least one
project ruck next year though. Can't see Sam De Koning falling in our draft range, let alone the need for another skinny 200cm plus KPD/ruck.
 
Top Bottom