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List Mgmt. Carlton's 2020 Draft Thread

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DangerousD said:
Only having two rucks across a squad seems very risky, if you play one in the 1sts and one in the 2nds, you leave yourself wide open if one of them suffers any form of injury.

There is nothing wrong with playing two rucks in the 2nds, it gives the two ruckman an actual chance to develop their forward craft also.

I personally see TDK as our number 1 ruck, he’s very raw and will need time, on the flip side, I can also see him playing forward in the absence of Curnow which would mean Pitto rucks more, if anything like this happens, the development of our seconds side suffers as the mids feed off a ruck who is not competent.
Click to expand...

I could see why people would think two rucks aren't enough after having an injury plagued Kreuzer on our list the past decade. The reality is Pittonet is very durable as a backup. Literally never misses a game. Casboult can ruck too, so I just don't see it as a need at the moment.

With another 3-4kgs on his frame, TDK should be good to go next season. Already showed in glimpses he was up to it this year too!!!
 
Stickitupthem said:
Hybrids are going to be the new must have with these list reductions .
I however feel the pure footballer will miss out imagine g Williams trying to get a gig these days no chance
Click to expand...
Diesel didn’t have to go to the bench very often.

He wasn’t quick, but think you might be underestimating his endurance running.
 

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Eiffel 65 said:
I could see why people would think two rucks aren't enough after having an injury plagued Kreuzer on our list the past decade. The reality is Pittonet is very durable as a backup. Literally never misses a game. Casboult can ruck too, so I just don't see it as a need at the moment.

With another 3-4kgs on his frame, TDK should be good to go next season. Already showed in glimpses he was up to it this year too!!!
Click to expand...
Still need one more coming through. We are small atm. TDK hasn’t proven resilience and Pitto can’t do anything outside of body contests. Either Pitto works on forward craft or H needs to ruck unless we find a fast growing project. Don’t talk to me about pinch hitting with Gov, SOS or any other as some have suggested.
 
Eiffel 65 said:
I could see why people would think two rucks aren't enough after having an injury plagued Kreuzer on our list the past decade. The reality is Pittonet is very durable as a backup. Literally never misses a game. Casboult can ruck too, so I just don't see it as a need at the moment.

With another 3-4kgs on his frame, TDK should be good to go next season. Already showed in glimpses he was up to it this year too!!!
Click to expand...

We need another ruck/forward
 
Eiffel 65 said:
Would you want to carry three ruckman (two of which are developing) given list sizes are reducing?

I'm not convinced we've seen the full extent of list size reduction.

If list sizes reduce by another 2 next season too, clubs may have to think about settling with one primary and one backup ruck only.

List spots are progressively becoming more valuable and need to be used wisely.
Click to expand...
Yes, yes and yes. Especially if our midfield has the limited rotation of 2020. Can carry an extra big with the available midfield. We are actually a bit on the small side.
 
Eiffel 65 said:
I could see why people would think two rucks aren't enough after having an injury plagued Kreuzer on our list the past decade. The reality is Pittonet is very durable as a backup. Literally never misses a game. Casboult can ruck too, so I just don't see it as a need at the moment.

With another 3-4kgs on his frame, TDK should be good to go next season. Already showed in glimpses he was up to it this year too!!!
Click to expand...
I’m in the camp that we need another ruck.

We needed one when Phillips left.

We need another one when Kreuzer retired.

We don’t want Harry rucking.

Casboult is an ok ruck but you don’t want him as the #1 but as relief.

Does’t take much to have both Pitto and TDK injured.
 
Eiffel 65 said:
I could see why people would think two rucks aren't enough after having an injury plagued Kreuzer on our list the past decade. The reality is Pittonet is very durable as a backup. Literally never misses a game. Casboult can ruck too, so I just don't see it as a need at the moment.

With another 3-4kgs on his frame, TDK should be good to go next season. Already showed in glimpses he was up to it this year too!!!
Click to expand...
TDK is only 21 years old and is not yet at the stage where we can rely on him as our sole ruck. Pittonet has played a total of 20 AFL games so it's very hard to back him as durable and never misses game.

Although Levi does have experience and has shown durability, he is turning 31 early next year. Also, I expect him to be playing primarily forward to cover for Charlie, or down back if we can't land another KPD.

Although I still think getting a key defender should be our no. 1 priority, a 3rd ruck is still important.
 

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iAsbestos said:
I'd like

The Best available KPD at 38 he can be our Jones long time sucessor.
Rookie a Mature aged Ruck to break glass if TDK and Pitt go down
Rookie James Rowe/ Best Available Small forward
Click to expand...
Arr0w said:
I too see this as the order of priority

I would also add a DFA KPD/Swingman
Click to expand...
I cannot understand this line of thinking. We have one, his name is Levi and he will be with us for another year or two.
It is the perfect opportunity to add a young developing ruck who will cost sweet FA. Our picks will be in the range, and we are going to need another
quality ruck coming through. We pretty much all have TDK pencilled in as the no. 1, either in the upcoming season or thereafter. Pitto pretty much has
too, alluding to things Tom can do that he can't. Pitto is going to continue to improve, but likely will remain behind TDK through their careers. Surely the
opportunity will come for big Marc to shift camp and become the no. 1 guy somewhere in the foreseeable future. While both of the lads are young, we need
to work on progression.

Stuff relying on a break glass DFA, or paying an extra $50 or $100 thousand for a half decent journeyman. This draft just screams of opportunity to fill the
gaps.

On your idea to draft best available KPD at 38 as the Jones successor, the theory is good, in practice not so good. We don't need an interceptor or an
undersized type, we need someone to play on the King twins, Daniher, Hipwood, Hawkins, Lynch, Dixon and the like. The big boys will be the requirement.
Weiters will be "the man", but needs help. Marchy, Plow and a collection of third tall types are adequate and offer more than any second tier, undersized type
in this draft.

The draft is a couple of weeks away, the players are known, name the possibilities in the draft range to fill your wish list or move on to what is practical.
Long term players are the preference. Ruck and small forward are the best options in this draft. We either run the gauntlet or as suggested take a DFA swingman, but there are pretty slim pickings out there. Most of the half decent ones won't want to play for rookie money, knowing that opportunity will
likely not come. They will head to lesser leagues and cop a decent pay cheque and job opportunities. Paying more for a back up potentially compromises our TPP management going forward.
 
Arr0w said:
I too see this as the order of priority

I would also add a DFA KPD/Swingman
Click to expand...

Like a majak daw or younger
 
Coona Blues said:
I cannot understand this line of thinking. We have one, his name is Levi and he will be with us for another year or two.
It is the perfect opportunity to add a young developing ruck who will cost sweet FA. Our picks will be in the range, and we are going to need another
quality ruck coming through. We pretty much all have TDK pencilled in as the no. 1, either in the upcoming season or thereafter. Pitto pretty much has
too, alluding to things Tom can do that he can't. Pitto is going to continue to improve, but likely will remain behind TDK through their careers. Surely the
opportunity will come for big Marc to shift camp and become the no. 1 guy somewhere in the foreseeable future. While both of the lads are young, we need
to work on progression.

Stuff relying on a break glass DFA, or paying an extra $50 or $100 thousand for a half decent journeyman. This draft just screams of opportunity to fill the
gaps.

On your idea to draft best available KPD at 38 as the Jones successor, the theory is good, in practice not so good. We don't need an interceptor or an
undersized type, we need someone to play on the King twins, Daniher, Hipwood, Hawkins, Lynch, Dixon and the like. The big boys will be the requirement.
Weiters will be "the man", but needs help. Marchy, Plow and a collection of third tall types are adequate and offer more than any second tier, undersized type
in this draft.

The draft is a couple of weeks away, the players are known, name the possibilities in the draft range to fill your wish list or move on to what is practical.
Long term players are the preference. Ruck and small forward are the best options in this draft. We either run the gauntlet or as suggested take a DFA swingman, but there are pretty slim pickings out there. Most of the half decent ones won't want to play for rookie money, knowing that opportunity will
likely not come. They will head to lesser leagues and cop a decent pay cheque and job opportunities. Paying more for a back up potentially compromises our TPP management going forward.
Click to expand...

Seems like we agree, mostly?

My concern is around injury to all parts of the ground/replenishing older players.

Our potential weak point is KPD stocks, if 2 of Jones, Weitering or Levi go down. Same can be said for our ruck stocks, TDK, Pitto, Levi

This is why I believe we need to target a DFA as pure cover. Forget the names, just think of the type, McKernan, Daw, etc, that can chop out anywhere down the spine

We then draft youth, a ruck/forward and a KPD

Compared to any other side (more importantly final's sides) we have lowest number of these types

We are no longer a bottom 4 side, thinking we can wait to see how things evolve, we are about to launch as a finals side
 
Arr0w said:
Seems like we agree, mostly?

My concern is around injury to all parts of the ground/replenishing older players.

Our potential weak point is KPD stocks, if 2 of Jones, Weitering or Levi go down. Same can be said for our ruck stocks, TDK, Pitto, Levi

This is why I believe we need to target a DFA as pure cover. Forget the names, just think of the type, McKernan, Daw, etc, that can chop out anywhere down the spine

We then draft youth, a ruck/forward and a KPD

Compared to any other side (more importantly final's sides) we have lowest number of these types

We are no longer a bottom 4 side, thinking we can wait to see how things evolve, we are about to launch as a finals side
Click to expand...
We do agree in the sense of where we need to bolster the list. I cannot and will not argue against a DFA KPD, although as I said the pickings are slim. I can't
see the sense of grabbing a 194cm type. We can cover the third tall scenario with Plow, Marchy, JSOS, McGovern and maybe Kemp, we need that big bopper.
I can't see any real candidates except maybe Trengove, Daw is cooked. We need to gauge commitment levels, a stopgap player is unlikely to buy in and we end up with O'Shea like levels. While I understand moving him on with limited spots, I can't help thinking Goddard would serve us better than any on offer and be a valuable piece in the twos.

I don't like the concept of fill ins, dead end types, and even less now spots are a premium. As I have said earlier, I would almost prefer to run the gauntlet and
pick up a speculative type like Crippas "little" brother who could be just what we want post ACL. Fills that forward/ruck criteria, but next year pretty much a wipe out. I understand your leaning to a forward/ruck rather than a Walsh type who, to date has been ruck only. I cannot profess intimate knowledge of the boys, but Heath's standing is pure projection, Henry has more exposed form, Lane twice the ruck that hybrid Neale has been to date. I like the family
connection angle for multiple reasons, although would be happy if HW had exposed forward creds.

The area we can most capitalise on is the small forward role. Rowe, while small projects well, at least from an attacking perspective. There are plenty of other prospects who will appear through the draft, and some will not. Tom Papley was a no one pre draft, hope we have done homework on his brother. With the
way the game is going, most genuine small forwards are busting their butts to get in to the midfield to enhance their prospects at an early age. Wishing some would concentrate on their prime craft more pre draft to give a more accurate guide. This is why Rowe just seems a good bet in a compromised year, he has been the attacking weapon, like Ryan, W.Rioli and the like. The two named had absolutely no defensive rating prior to joining a list.

We will have three live picks and a rookie spot. Can't cover all bases, I would rather grab long term prospects than fill ins. I must say I expected some announcement from AFL about some supplemental opportunities with our feeder competition players, this would give more flexibility to list decisions. It is ludicrous to reduce lists when clubs are at different stages of development. Swans building like us and forced to delist 4 handy types today, juggling numbers and cap just seems wrong. So bloody annoying with the ongoing leg up the Suns are getting and the inconsistencies in Academy and NGA hauls. Remember reading Josh Eyre, tied to * was looking forward to more involvement with * before covid hit, but his one session was good (bloody cheap access).
 

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Eiffel 65 said:
I could see why people would think two rucks aren't enough after having an injury plagued Kreuzer on our list the past decade. The reality is Pittonet is very durable as a backup. Literally never misses a game. Casboult can ruck too, so I just don't see it as a need at the moment.

With another 3-4kgs on his frame, TDK should be good to go next season. Already showed in glimpses he was up to it this year too!!!
Click to expand...

Agree that TDK will cement his spot as number 1 and Pitto does seem durable, it will be interesting though to see what we do in Charlie’s absence, if he misses a large chunk, then there is other injuries. If TDK has to play as a predominant forward with Pitto in the side, it leaves no ruck for the 2s.

Ideally we should target a ruck/forward for the 2s, if not target a mature ruck for a season or two and draft a new ruck next year, age wise drafting a ruck this year isn’t ideal, as TDK is only 21 I think, I just don’t want to see us in the crap if we have an injury, we are competing next year, development years are over.
 
Coona Blues said:
We do agree in the sense of where we need to bolster the list. I cannot and will not argue against a DFA KPD, although as I said the pickings are slim. I can't
see the sense of grabbing a 194cm type. We can cover the third tall scenario with Plow, Marchy, JSOS, McGovern and maybe Kemp, we need that big bopper.
I can't see any real candidates except maybe Trengove, Daw is cooked. We need to gauge commitment levels, a stopgap player is unlikely to buy in and we end up with O'Shea like levels. While I understand moving him on with limited spots, I can't help thinking Goddard would serve us better than any on offer and be a valuable piece in the twos.

I don't like the concept of fill ins, dead end types, and even less now spots are a premium. As I have said earlier, I would almost prefer to run the gauntlet and
pick up a speculative type like Crippas "little" brother who could be just what we want post ACL. Fills that forward/ruck criteria, but next year pretty much a wipe out. I understand your leaning to a forward/ruck rather than a Walsh type who, to date has been ruck only. I cannot profess intimate knowledge of the boys, but Heath's standing is pure projection, Henry has more exposed form, Lane twice the ruck that hybrid Neale has been to date. I like the family
connection angle for multiple reasons, although would be happy if HW had exposed forward creds.

The area we can most capitalise on is the small forward role. Rowe, while small projects well, at least from an attacking perspective. There are plenty of other prospects who will appear through the draft, and some will not. Tom Papley was a no one pre draft, hope we have done homework on his brother. With the
way the game is going, most genuine small forwards are busting their butts to get in to the midfield to enhance their prospects at an early age. Wishing some would concentrate on their prime craft more pre draft to give a more accurate guide. This is why Rowe just seems a good bet in a compromised year, he has been the attacking weapon, like Ryan, W.Rioli and the like. The two named had absolutely no defensive rating prior to joining a list.

We will have three live picks and a rookie spot. Can't cover all bases, I would rather grab long term prospects than fill ins. I must say I expected some announcement from AFL about some supplemental opportunities with our feeder competition players, this would give more flexibility to list decisions. It is ludicrous to reduce lists when clubs are at different stages of development. Swans building like us and forced to delist 4 handy types today, juggling numbers and cap just seems wrong. So bloody annoying with the ongoing leg up the Suns are getting and the inconsistencies in Academy and NGA hauls. Remember reading Josh Eyre, tied to * was looking forward to more involvement with * before covid hit, but his one session was good (bloody cheap access).
Click to expand...

Do I really want a fill in, no, but many clubs acquire these types as a break glass, right or wrong. It's one of the reasons Saints grabbed McKernan, it's a smart, short term move.

No matter how you dissect it, or how you rectify it, our priorities won't change
 
for the draft aficionados out there: I understand Tom Greene (gws) has brother in this years draft...where is he projected to go? Is there much difference between the two?

thanks in advance.
 
AT97 said:
for the draft aficionados out there: I understand Tom Greene (gws) has brother in this years draft...where is he projected to go? Is there much difference between the two?

thanks in advance.
Click to expand...

Like his brother in many ways, slightly taller that is more a forward but can play elsewhere

Doubt anyone would bid on him
 



www.carltonfc.com.au

Blues complete pick swap with Swans

Blues upgrade draft hand.
www.carltonfc.com.au www.carltonfc.com.au


The Blues have acquired pick No.31 from the Swans in the upcoming 2020 NAB AFL Draft in exchange for pick No.48 and a future third-round selection.
The trade now means the Club has upgraded its draft hand, acquiring an additional second-round selection ahead of December's draft.

Carlton’s now holds picks Nos.31, 38 and 78 in the 2020 NAB AFL Draft.
Click to expand...
 
EnkRo_bUcAAG4h9
 

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