No, Sav is behind them
Review Cats defeat Doggies by 22 points.
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Would love Mitchell to work on his foot-speed during the off-season.
- Sep 26, 2017
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Wouldn’t shock me if teams start applying the pressure on Miers going forward
Sttew
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Sav received coaches votes in a few games this year. J Henry yet to hit form
Coaches votes say no.
To be fair though, the marking target for Gryan Miers kicking inside 50 is often Jeremy Cameron.
cats_09
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RE: the Ratugolea vs J. Henry debate
Ratugolea has played 10.5 games this season (prior to injury) and all in defence
Henry has played 3 games this season, with half his time spent up forward
It's not exactly an equal comparison being made
It's similar with SDK - he's played 8 games, where he was subbed out with concussion in one, played as our #1 ruck in two of them and in his return from injury he spent half a match up forward
Ratugolea has played 10.5 games this season (prior to injury) and all in defence
Henry has played 3 games this season, with half his time spent up forward
It's not exactly an equal comparison being made
It's similar with SDK - he's played 8 games, where he was subbed out with concussion in one, played as our #1 ruck in two of them and in his return from injury he spent half a match up forward
Rubberducky
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Very hard to compare, I think Sav's 18 contested marks & 79 1%ers have a lot of people seeing his value to the team. When playing alongside SDK he's been the bigger body to crash the packs etc. And its a very different role to what J Henry plays in defence.
Its going to be interesting to see which way the MC goes when picking our best team from a full list... Got to bet on them knowing better...
Great, that gets Stengle, Close and Holmes to do what they like
You can be ahead of someone without there being equal opportunities. It's their job with opportunities to then push past you. SDK has had enough though and his year so far hasn't matched Sav's.
Ratugolea's numbers are actually really similar to J.Henry's from 2022. He's bigger but has that similar athleticism. He's nothing like a Henderson style slow tall.
A lot depends on how well the underperforming smalls go - Tuohy, MOC, Zuthrie and Bews have had shaky years, or inconsistent years. One or two could miss out if they aren't somewhere near their best.
I think crashing the packs is overvalued. It's always been the one wood attributed to Sav when we previously couldn't think of anything else nice to say. If you're huge and uncoordinated, it might be helpful or might not, after all it's a 50/50 when the ball hits the deck-and now in the opposition forward line. Marking is best, and J Henry does that better and his disposal is more assured, not just a long bomb to the midfield.
splashwave
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I think Sav has been great but at this stage he almost seems a little disruptive to the backline. it was a well oiled machine last year, so even though his numbers might be better than Henry’s I think having Jack there makes Stewart and SDK better.
Tuohy can still turn a game, Bews is the BP quiet achiever given a job, when was the last time he was in the best players?
Zuthrie still learning with the best. inconsistent occasionally but has the MC's confidence.
It's MOC who went wayward, then discovered his mojo in time for the GF but is on shaky ground now when you look at his inability to impact the midfield.
- Nov 18, 2015
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I hope they try. Would be a nightmare tagging him given the ground he covers and would let others off the leash if used two players rotating on him. Between him and JC that could tie up 4 opposition players in defensive roles.
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Much easier said than done. He's very good at finding space in traffic.
I reckon I could mark most of the passes he's made inside 50 this year. Look at the ones to Stengle and Bruhn this week. Just stand in the space and wait for the footy to turn up on a platter.
Finknottle
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Last couple of weeks MOC was below par but he has been one of our better players this year. When the ball hits the ground in defence it gives me more confidence when O'Connor is there. He gets to the drop quickly and can close down space faster than our other defenders. However I think the coaches are experimenting with him as an onballer. Bews has been a bit off this year but we don't have a better player for his role. Kolo changed my mind when he stepped up in the finals. Jack Henry is a bit rusty since coming back, I'd like to see him take the game on with his running ability.
Yeah one thing injuries did was provide positional rethinks. MOC as an onballer floats outside the pack and it makes him look awkward. Not saying he doesn't have a go. He rarely looks at home with the Miers/Atkins/Close partnership when anywhere near forward. He seems to know his job in defence, dependable. He's overcome his mental (confidence) demons and homesickness, sturdy physical disposition, has garnered a premiership and is mentoring Mullin. Valuable but might not survive the avalanche of new talent.
I haven't been a fan of O'Connor being used as a tagger, but I think he kept Bontempelli pretty quiet last week.
And Miers twists and turns, and is hard to tackle when given a metre or two of space.
Dixon would smash into SDK at every opportunity
Sav has been good, saved us quite a few times when we’ve been caught out on a counter.
But when we look at our mechanism to win matches I don’t think he suits us in our current form. In a team with a more dominant midfield, we’d be able to tolerate less rebound from defence for the extra defensive strength. But given that we need to attack from deep, fast quality ball movement is more important. When the system is built around him intercepting, we lose too much on offence, his first choice options are other players’ bail out kicks. Even if he generates more interceptions, we get less from them.
But when we look at our mechanism to win matches I don’t think he suits us in our current form. In a team with a more dominant midfield, we’d be able to tolerate less rebound from defence for the extra defensive strength. But given that we need to attack from deep, fast quality ball movement is more important. When the system is built around him intercepting, we lose too much on offence, his first choice options are other players’ bail out kicks. Even if he generates more interceptions, we get less from them.
Its a tough one - but i think Jack Henry is a tad overrated
And what i use as a barometer is the 2011 Geelong Premiership winning team - and in my opinion J Henry would not get in it - and Darren Milburn admittedly at the end of his career - couldnt get in that 11 premiership team .
And Milburn was a better footballer than J Henry . I like backmen who within reason - try to mark the ball where possible not punch it - are attacking players and high possession players - and i dont see that in J Henry - thats why i think he is a bit overrated
He is an ok player - but like i say - i dont think he would push anyone out of the 2011 Premiership team
What you're describing is also essentially saying that defensive spoils are useless, when the narrative used to be that Sav wasn't spoiling enough (he has a team high 6.6 per game by the way).
But anyway the "doesn't mark as well" claim is interesting.
Jack Henry 2022: 1.8 intercept marks per game
Jack Henry 2021: 2.3 intercept marks per game (2nd in B&F year)
Ratugolea 2023: 3.3 intercept marks per game
With a more coordinated defence players will run past for the handball from Sav more often. And I agree you can't have a group full of defenders who go long for territory each time but you can afford one.
Fair enough, but there's not much diiff when we're talking -1.5 marks, and Jack only just returned from injury.
It's what you do with them, and how many goals the opposition score from defensive body positioning between a couple of intercept marks. IMO Jack is the more rounded footballer, at home with our defenders, and therefore more trustworthy. 'Important to our system and the way we play"
Sav has been given every chance known to man, and finally looks to have found a niche. Unlike the media and this board, I'm not completely sold as yet on 3.3 and human bowling ball capabilities for all the chaos it causes. He's just not good or super alert when he comes to ground.
Harsh, I know, since all the big men fly........and usually recover.
PS Spoils arent useless, they after all are so common, if an intercept mark is not possible.
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