Autopsy Cats lose to GWS by 7 points.

[Pure_Ownage]

Port, Lions, Pies- all may have a home final or 2, and their form, depth and talent is not crap.
We are getting beaten by bottom 8 teams- it is definitely us at present looking crap.

Lions are consistent finals pretenders as are port their conversion rate in finals says that. They will bomb out in prelims as they do every other year.
Pies are very fit and well coached which is their 1 wood but they dont have a lot of star power which means they could well be vulnerable in finals (when the cream rises).

No doubt we are crap but thats because we have injured guys playing, best 12 players out and no cohesion.
If we are at our best (we have to be fully fit and in form) no one in the top 8 worries me except melbourne (and i do think at our absolute best we can get them).

 

[Finknottle]

Fair point that you are entitled to hold, not going to argue it is wrong, it is just not something I think is wrong with us or ever a focal point. I know Clarkson used to brush it off and so does Scott and I tend to agree. Most elite level athletes are very highly motivated and don’t lack effort generally speaking and have the worlds finest at their disposal in terms of physical mental health support and also very well financially compensated and have great work life balance in their own time.
I tend to look at strategy and game plans personnel available and structures as the primary cause of loses and performance. I’d say es that easily drives 95% of outcomes. The rest you can dive down to other things

Running to space takes effort, GWS did it all day, Geelong players rarely did it. I'd say that helped GWS win the game.

 

[geelong_crazy26]

Running to space takes effort, GWS did it all day, Geelong players rarely did it. I'd say that helped GWS win the game.

It is all very structured these days where players run and go to generally speaking. It’s very well planned during the week. I agree our players lacked cohesion, but I would put that down to players being not talented enough with our current side to execute our plans as opposed to effort.

 

[Cataholic]

It is all very structured these days where players run and go to generally speaking. It’s very well planned during the week. I agree our players lacked cohesion, but I would put that down to players being not talented enough with our current side to execute our plans as opposed to effort.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.coachesontario.ca/articles/complacency/&ved=2ahUKEwiW7LW-vJf_AhUBbt4KHeAZDeoQFnoECBUQAQ&usg=AOvVaw2fqHLnZxG0MhD8jtBBxoZZ

 

[BotsMaster]

Yep

Always get scoffed at when I mention how big of a loss he is to non Geelong fans outside bigfooty.

 

[BotsMaster]

The frustrating thing for Geelong - is this year it is an absolute garbage comp - utter garbage

Cats just have to somehow qualify in the 8 - and might end up with some more silverware

The standard of the comp this year - Dimmeys wouldnt be out of place making and presenting the Premiership Cup

You don't rate the Flagpies?

 

[geelong_crazy26]

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.coachesontario.ca/articles/complacency/&ved=2ahUKEwiW7LW-vJf_AhUBbt4KHeAZDeoQFnoECBUQAQ&usg=AOvVaw2fqHLnZxG0MhD8jtBBxoZZ

You are not a full time motivational coach by any chance cataholic?

 

[gogeelongcats]

You don't rate the Flagpies?

The money says they are the best in the competition

 

[Cataholic]

You are not a full time motivational coach by any chance cataholic?

No mate

 

[Cataholic]

It's to get them to 110%.
Wiser heads than us have argued this on data since Adam was a boy.

110% can only be sustained for relatively short bursts, and can compromise the ability to apply 100% consistently thereafter.

A delicate balance.

 

[Vdubs]

Lions are consistent finals pretenders as are port their conversion rate in finals says that. They will bomb out in prelims as they do every other year.
Pies are very fit and well coached which is their 1 wood but they dont have a lot of star power which means they could well be vulnerable in finals (when the cream rises).

No doubt we are crap but thats because we have injured guys playing, best 12 players out and no cohesion.
If we are at our best (we have to be fully fit and in form) no one in the top 8 worries me except melbourne (and i do think at our absolute best we can get them).

Assuming we make the 8, and win an elim final, possibly interstate. Which of course we are capable of.
But Pies- Daicos x 2, JDG, Elliott, Mihocek, Pendles, Sidebottom, Moore- they have easily enough star factor.

 

[Goggin Our Best]

You don't rate the Flagpies?

They are going very well - and really have been pretty strong the last 20 years - so they deserve or need a 2nd flag to put a silver lining to that - like that flag we got last year - we needed it - for being up high consistemtly year in year out and got it

However Collingwood 23 are not a road block team like Rich or Haw in their 3 peats - and are thus beatable

 

[Micksy]

Lions are consistent finals pretenders as are port their conversion rate in finals says that. They will bomb out in prelims as they do every other year.

Has there ever been a team that's played poorly in finals that went on to win it all one year?
Surely it has to have happened at some point?

 

[catempire]

Always get scoffed at when I mention how big of a loss he is to non Geelong fans outside bigfooty.

There’s your first mistake.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

Assuming we make the 8, and win an elim final, possibly interstate. Which of course we are capable of.
But Pies- Daicos x 2, JDG, Elliott, Mihocek, Pendles, Sidebottom, Moore- they have easily enough star factor.

Thats a fair point re elim im just saying beating port or bris on the road is different to beating sides like rich in their prime its very difficult.

As for the pies. Nick daicos is a star, moore likewise.
Pendles and sidebottom are legends in their twilight they cant be expected to dominate.
Elliot is honestly in poor form lately.
Jdg is absolutely the type i was talking about-star who can win you finals but inconsistent.

Jdaicos is not a star hes a decent middle tier role player as is mihocek.
All in all they lack star power-nothing against them in fact its credit to them that they are doing so well without depth of stars but it might be an issue that undoes them in finals.

 

[Seeds]

His tackling numbers may not be high. But perceived pressure and his manic chasing absolutely leads to turnovers.

Yeah it does. Occasionally. But no way near as often as people think it does.

 

[Romeoh1]

I see it differently, but that's BF, hey?!

To me, if a player can be invited to drive themselves further it means they're coming from an initial position of less than 100%.

We have had quite a chunk of our best players out all year- that means everyone else has to lift, that our bottom 6-8 etc have to play at their best every week. Trying to do so takes a toll- they must be pretty weary. They all gave their absolute best last year. Let’s get to the bye- get everyone well rested, get players back- come home like a wet sail!

 

[Seeds]

If I’m a defender I’d remember if Rohan was chasing me or if Parfitt was, and more often than not, my disposal would reflect this. Not recorded on your stats sheet either. Perceived pressure is real.

I believe this is post hoc rationalisation. When presented with facts counter to our view we desperately search for an alternative reason that could still fit rather then change our view.

You are right there are also chases that get close enough to impact the kick in a meaningful way without actually being a tackle.

But let's be honest. This doesn't happen all that much in games. There would be less then 10 occasions in most games where this plays out. Where a defender coming out of defence is hurried into a poor disposal without being tackled. If I'm generous Rohan might be doing 2 a game at best. And I think that is overly generous.

 

[Seeds]

That's gotta be a record, 7 sentences and every single one of them wrong in one way or another

Great reasoning. You've changed my view.

 

[Seeds]

It has been pointed out to you previously that tackles don't measure the value that Rohan brings in terms of defensive pressure.

It's been suggested. But the reasoning is deeply flawed or non existent. Already replied to this in a different post so won't go through it again.

Also note that the whole debate in this thread about rohans value came up cos someone posted the forwards tackle count.

 

[catempire]

It's been suggested. But the reasoning is deeply flawed.

You yourself in another post above acknowledged that sometimes his pressure is in the form of a chase that causes a turnover…

As is his chases that cause a poor kick and turnover.

 

[Catsace]

Always get scoffed at when I mention how big of a loss he is to non Geelong fans outside bigfooty.

His loss is huge, his winningness is something he brought to the club. Just 95 of his 355 games were defeats, already in 11 games (albeit with many injuries, and our midfield right now minus the outs is d-grade) we've had six in just 11 matches.

He was a Geelong icon, and as we all know his era was our greatest era. Only one of him walks through the door in a lifetime pretty much. Hopefully someone at the club can emulate some of his attributes, but he is a package of football genius in every aspect that is as big a loss as anyone.

Danger, Cuthrie, Duncan and Stanley add a hell of a lot, and Bowes was establishing himself nicely in the team. Sadly Menegola just cannot get on the park, and already Jye Clark is pretty much consigned to 2024 now. I just hope we can get some of those important players back, as right now with Atkins pretty much our 'star' midfielder, we really are having a bunch of mids that is a million miles away from many sides on star power and oomph.

 

[Play it Sam]

You yourself in another post above acknowledged that sometimes his pressure is in the form of a chase that causes a turnover…

I can't believe we are debating Rohan's worth in forward pressure when he brings that and so much more.
Speccy and goal to save the game anyone?
Bust his butt running to point, fall over, hand pass, ditto.
Takes leads to allow other big boys space. Check.
Smacks and attacks them when midfield. Yes.
Controversial sometimes. Scott doesn't know why.
Hurry back Gaz.

 

[FredLeDeux]

Great reasoning. You've changed my view.

 

[Finknottle]

I reckon the opposition backline and coaches would see the forwards they'll be playing on and adjust their normal plans accordingly. E.g. Tomahawk - no defensive pressure, Cameron - moderate pressure, O Henry - limited pressure, etc. They would have devised a plan to run the ball out of defence using their superior leg speed expecting limited pressure from Geelong. It would have been a different story if Rohan was playing forward and more so if Dangerfield and Holmes were in the team.