Prediction CEY 2017, make or break, will he make it?

Will CEY make it?


  • Total voters
    41

Remove this Banner Ad

marty36

Brownlow Medallist
Aug 17, 2009
26,372
9,223
Adelaide
AFL Club
Adelaide
Can't have players you regularly only utilise 50% of the time, as would put to much pressure on other midfielders with rotations.

Better off playing Thommo mainly in th SANFL where he can do his job of working with young midfielders & give him the odd game in the AFL, where he will be fresh to give it his all.


If Thommo starts the season and plays extremly well, do you keep playing him until he falls apart or holds togetther, or drop a player who is performing ?
 

marty36

Brownlow Medallist
Aug 17, 2009
26,372
9,223
Adelaide
AFL Club
Adelaide
Lyons still provided better output than CEY would have last season ....and yet we still were willing to trade Lyons, so what does that say about CEY's future ??

From my limited viewing of training .....Hampton,& Knight would be in front of CEY for a midfield role


If CEY lines up in the SANFL gets 30 plus possesions and BOG every week do you give him an opportunity or bring up a younger player who isnt in the same form?
 
Nov 6, 2003
120,660
165,773
Melbourne
AFL Club
Adelaide
Other Teams
🇦🇺 🇦🇺 🇦🇺 West Adelaide
If CEY lines up in the SANFL gets 30 plus possesions and BOG every week do you give him an opportunity or bring up a younger player who isnt in the same form?
Always "best available" to provide a "balanced" side to win the game .....we are not a developing team, we're a team in contention, so it's all about winning now
 

Log in to remove this ad.

Jun 7, 2011
58,427
60,479
Mount Gambier
AFL Club
Adelaide
A side in premiership contention would only have CEY on their list as a handy depth player

I think that's about right, but if CEY gets a chance, I also won't be surprised if he has a year similar to Lyons. People writing him off for not having proved himself by now have very short memories. They were saying the same of Lyons last year.
 

marty36

Brownlow Medallist
Aug 17, 2009
26,372
9,223
Adelaide
AFL Club
Adelaide
Under this scenario, you keep playing Thommo .....refer my previous post


Then all these people wanting thommo out of the team may be extremly dissapointed, as he is clearly capable of turning it on. I dont care who is in the team whether they are 34 or 20 have a beard and tatts or clean cut. As long as they are performing and more importantly consistently
 
Last edited:
If Thommo starts the season and plays extremly well, do you keep playing him until he falls apart or holds togetther, or drop a player who is performing ?
Thommo won't play most of the season like previous years.
 

Alwaysacrow

Premiership Player
Jul 8, 2016
3,628
4,473
AFL Club
Adelaide
Why should he be "given" opportunities, if his past performance history doesn't justify it?

If he's good enough, then he should (and will) be given opportunities. If he's not, then he shouldn't (and won't). To date, he hasn't.

JL was given opportunities because, limited as he was, he was still the best option we had. I am far from convinced that CEY is the best option we have in 2017.
I'm not convinced about him either but I'd prefer they give him 3 or 4 afl games in a row to see if can step up. It's sink or swim for him this year. How long did we carry the likes of Wright, Petrenko, VB, Mackay when their performances were clearly " not justifying it"
As far as deserving it goes, he's clearly gone out of his way in the pre-season to improve himself (his extra training in the US on his own time). Whilst that alone can't guarantee a spot in the 22 I'd hope that the selectors would take that into consideration when deciding the team for round 1. Let's not throw him on the scrap heap just yet, give him a decent run and then we'll know for sure. Something has to change in or MF this year or it will be just 2016 rinse and repeat.
 

skoobydoo

Premiership Player
Apr 3, 2012
3,364
2,681
Under the Southern Cross
AFL Club
Adelaide
Other Teams
Bite Basebal Crystal Brook Roosters
If Thommo starts the season and plays extremly well, do you keep playing him until he falls apart or holds togetther, or drop a player who is performing ?

Extremely well? Thommo?

All this reminds me somewhat of the recent history of the Australian Cricket team.
 
Jun 29, 2009
1,842
2,887
Adelaide
AFL Club
Adelaide
Other Teams
San Antonio Spurs
He's had plenty of time to make it already, if he was good enough he would have forced himself into the team ages ago, depth player is the best I think he will be.
 
Oct 14, 2005
52,179
36,117
Canberra
AFL Club
Adelaide
Other Teams
Norwood, Adelaide Crows
I think that's about right, but if CEY gets a chance, I also won't be surprised if he has a year similar to Lyons. People writing him off for not having proved himself by now have very short memories. They were saying the same of Lyons last year.
Lyons had achieved a hell of a lot more prior to 2016 than CEY has going into 2017.
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

Oct 14, 2005
52,179
36,117
Canberra
AFL Club
Adelaide
Other Teams
Norwood, Adelaide Crows
I'm not convinced about him either but I'd prefer they give him 3 or 4 afl games in a row to see if can step up. It's sink or swim for him this year. How long did we carry the likes of Wright, Petrenko, VB, Mackay when their performances were clearly " not justifying it"
As far as deserving it goes, he's clearly gone out of his way in the pre-season to improve himself (his extra training in the US on his own time). Whilst that alone can't guarantee a spot in the 22 I'd hope that the selectors would take that into consideration when deciding the team for round 1. Let's not throw him on the scrap heap just yet, give him a decent run and then we'll know for sure. Something has to change in or MF this year or it will be just 2016 rinse and repeat.
I agree that his decision to go to the US to improve his fitness is definitely a good sign. It shows that he's determined to be the best player that he can be. He knows that this is a make-or-break year for him, and that he will almost certainly be gone if he doesn't establish himself in the 22 this year. He's done everything in his power to improve the fitness aspect of his game. This is highly commendable.

The problem with CEY is that many of his flaws aren't fitness related, and I'm not sure if he's capable of addressing these issues.

As for the players you named.. Wright, VB and Mackay had all proven themselves capable players over a long period of time. The selectors were a bit slow in accepting that their declines were career-terminal (Mackay's career remains viable for now). Petrenko was fortunate that we didn't have any other small forwards to replace him, and that Rendell flat out refused to draft any replacements (and when he did the player was Jarrhan Jacky). He was gone the instant we landed Betts & CC.

I don't see any reason at all why they would need to give him 3-4 games "to see if he can step up". They have seen him play at AFL level, at SANFL level, and training against his AFL teammates. The coaches & selectors have an excellent idea of what he's capable of - both his strengths and his weaknesses. It's just the mug punter in the stands, who doesn't have that level of exposure to the players, who feels the need to "see if he can step up". Nothing wrong with you wanting to see it for yourself, but the coaches & selectors have no such requirements.

I don't think anyone is "throwing him on the scrapheap", but most of us accept that he's a limited player who doesn't have the talent to justify special treatment. After 5+ years there's no more "potential" left, he has to be judged purely on performance. If his pre-season training is good, and his form in the pre-season games justifies it, then he should be selected. If not, he can spend the entire year in the SANFL. I wouldn't be upset or surprised by either outcome.
 
Oct 14, 2005
52,179
36,117
Canberra
AFL Club
Adelaide
Other Teams
Norwood, Adelaide Crows
What do you think Thommo has ability?
Thommo is like Michael Clarke, circa 2014 - a player who has a proven track history, and oozes class, but who is in terminal decline; still capable of turning it on occasionally (as Clarke did in the World Cup Grand Final against NZ), but mostly playing at a level well below his previous best.
 

marty36

Brownlow Medallist
Aug 17, 2009
26,372
9,223
Adelaide
AFL Club
Adelaide
Thommo is like Michael Clarke, circa 2014 - a player who has a proven track history, and oozes class, but who is in terminal decline; still capable of turning it on occasionally (as Clarke did in the World Cup Grand Final against NZ), but mostly playing at a level well below his previous best.


Then the coaches might find themselves in a little bit of dilema, if he pulls out a pearler in round 1 gets 35 possesions and destroys it and does the same in round two and three. how long do you give him if he plays a stinker in round 4. He will be giving a fair bit of time i would think. All hypothetical but if he plays a stinker in round 1 do you drop him immedaitly.

Personally I would be looking at who has form in the two's if Thommo starts with a stinker, although a lot dont look at that, they just like the fact you can bring in a young guy regardless of form.
 
Oct 14, 2005
52,179
36,117
Canberra
AFL Club
Adelaide
Other Teams
Norwood, Adelaide Crows
Then the coaches might find themselves in a little bit of dilema, if he pulls out a pearler in round 1 gets 35 possesions and destroys it and does the same in round two and three. how long do you give him if he plays a stinker in round 4. He will be giving a fair bit of time i would think. All hypothetical but if he plays a stinker in round 1 do you drop him immedaitly.

Personally I would be looking at who has form in the two's if Thommo starts with a stinker, although a lot dont look at that, they just like the fact you can bring in a young guy regardless of form.
Given what we've been told, about his position in the team no longer being secure, I'd suggest that he only gets 1-2 bad games in a row before being dropped. Much like VB was last year.

If he plays really well in R1-3, and has a stinker in R4, then he needs to perform in R5 or face being dropped to the SANFL.
 

marty36

Brownlow Medallist
Aug 17, 2009
26,372
9,223
Adelaide
AFL Club
Adelaide
Given what we've been told, about his position in the team no longer being secure, I'd suggest that he only gets 1-2 bad games in a row before being dropped. Much like VB was last year.

If he plays really well in R1-3, and has a stinker in R4, then he needs to perform in R5 or face being dropped to the SANFL.


Id like to think between 5 and 10 players only get giving a little bit time, all players after say your 10th best should be picked on form probably after two weeks of poor games so that all those tearing it up in two's get an opportunity to prove themselves
 
Oct 14, 2005
52,179
36,117
Canberra
AFL Club
Adelaide
Other Teams
Norwood, Adelaide Crows
Id like to think between 5 and 10 players only get giving a little bit time, all players after say your 10th best should be picked on form probably after two weeks of poor games so that all those tearing it up in two's get an opportunity to prove themselves
Not usually the way it works, or appears to work.

Once a player has established themselves in the best 22, then they are usually given a seriously prolonged period before they are dropped. The selectors like to give them every possible opportunity to return to form. This is probably true for the top 18-20 players, not just the top 5-10.

It's probably only the bottom 2-3 players, and younger players who have not yet established themselves, who are on a "2-3 bad games and you're out" policy.

Whether or not this is a good way of operating is a valid question.. but this is the way that the club has operated for a very long time.
 
Jun 7, 2011
58,427
60,479
Mount Gambier
AFL Club
Adelaide
Then all these people wanting thommo out of the team may be extremly dissapointed, as he is clearly capable of turning it on. I dont care who is in the team whether they are 34 or 20 have a beard and tatts or clean cut. As long as they are performing and more importantly consistently

Consistently offering 21 touches from 78% TOG with all minutes being midfield minutes and offering nothing by way of spread or defensive positioning isn't enough to hold a spot in a contending side. That was his average from round 7 onwards after averaging 29.5 for the first 6 rounds. He wasn't up and down or inconsistent. He was great early and then contributed little after that. His b&f polling from round 7 onwards would have had him 23rd on votes per game. That's a big and consistent chunk of the season being below average. When fresh I have no doubt that he's still a very capable accumulator, but keeping him fresh is the challenge.
 
Jun 7, 2011
58,427
60,479
Mount Gambier
AFL Club
Adelaide
That wasnt the question if he performs after being picked and puts it on the park, how long should he stay in the team for? Or on the other hand if he doesnt perform how long before he gets dropped?

My prediction is that he'll probably get a couple of games if his possession volume drops. Having said that, given his inability to play anywhere or do much of anything outside of stoppages, especially work backwards in a rolling zone, I won't be too surprised if he ends up as injury replacement only. For years we've complained about our poor defensive action between the arcs and the quality of our spread from stoppages. Thommo's been a key part of that failing and if we're only sacrificing 3-4 touches per game, assuming it's even that much, we'd likely be miles ahead with a well drilled runner who can work back hard.
 
Jun 7, 2011
58,427
60,479
Mount Gambier
AFL Club
Adelaide
Lyons had achieved a hell of a lot more prior to 2016 than CEY has going into 2017.

Was CEY playing in the 1's under Walsh whilst Lyons was playing SANFL? Not saying Walsh was perfect, but he saw something in CEY and I'd not be surprised if he performs decently if he gets a go. But I doubt he will unless injury or suspension hits our midfield.
 

marty36

Brownlow Medallist
Aug 17, 2009
26,372
9,223
Adelaide
AFL Club
Adelaide
Consistently offering 21 touches from 78% TOG with all minutes being midfield minutes and offering nothing by way of spread or defensive positioning isn't enough to hold a spot in a contending side. That was his average from round 7 onwards after averaging 29.5 for the first 6 rounds. He wasn't up and down or inconsistent. He was great early and then contributed little after that. His b&f polling from round 7 onwards would have had him 23rd on votes per game. That's a big and consistent chunk of the season being below average. When fresh I have no doubt that he's still a very capable accumulator, but keeping him fresh is the challenge.

True but 21 touches at78% may be better than galluci or cey can achieve so it comes down to who will do the best job on the day


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app
 
Oct 14, 2005
52,179
36,117
Canberra
AFL Club
Adelaide
Other Teams
Norwood, Adelaide Crows
Was CEY playing in the 1's under Walsh whilst Lyons was playing SANFL? Not saying Walsh was perfect, but he saw something in CEY and I'd not be surprised if he performs decently if he gets a go. But I doubt he will unless injury or suspension hits our midfield.
Walsh passed away before R14 2015. During the period he was in charge:
CEY played R1-5 and 8-13
Lyons played R1, R4, R6-9

CEY's missed games (R6-7) were due to a hamstring injury.
Lyons played SANFL in R2-3, R5, R10-13.

I think Walsh was, in some ways, the polar opposite of Pyke. I think Walsh wanted to see what his players could do, and used a fair chunk of our list as a result (we used 32 players in 2015). Pyke had a very fixed idea of the best 22, and refused to countenance the selection of anyone else (unless injury forced his hand).
 
That wasnt the question if he performs after being picked and puts it on the park, how long should he stay in the team for? Or on the other hand if he doesnt perform how long before he gets dropped?
Speak to Pyke what the exact plan is.

I doubt he will play more than 3 games in a row, but I'm guessing... & who knows when we will need to cover injuries or suspension.
 
Back