Changes for next year, Round 1

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Craze

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Aug 7, 2013
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Trent Cotchin just on Game Day, interviewed by Hamish McLachlan, saying that yes he's going to celebrate and take a couple of days to recharge the batteries, but moving on pretty quickly to plan for 2020. The prospect of making the cub even better is exciting to Cotchin.

What a captain. What a leader.
 

Meteoric Rise

All Australian
Feb 4, 2008
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102 goals 110 behinds is what we conceded in our 12 game winning streak post bye. So 8.75 goals and 9.16 behinds. Teams averaged 61 points against us in that period when the backline was together and settled the whole way I think.

177 goals 131 behinds is what we scored. 14.75 goals and more or less 11 behinds. We averaged 99 points for to show scoring conditions were not especially difficult on the whole.

In 2018 with Rance in the backline in 24 matches teams scored 256.199 against us, about 72 points on average.

In 2017 with Rance there the team averaged conceding similar in the low 70's.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Where I am going with this is to ask has the structure of the backline worked better in 2019 without Rance once it was fully stocked from round 15 onwards? And if so, why would that be?

I personally don't think it has to do with Rance the player. I think the issue is Rance the backline general, where it might have been a little bit all about him. So my submission would be that whoever was leading that backline in Rance's absence, presumably Astbury, should continue to do so. And Rance should play a role really no more prominent in the structure and chain of command than Vlastuin or Grimes did this year.

But in for me Rance(of course) Stack(of course) and any of Graham, Ross, CCJ, Balta, Naish, and any ready made recruit/s.

Out Ellis, and after that it gets tougher.

Curve ball trade deal: Only if the players are comfortable with this...go to GCS and offer Rance, Macintosh, maybe even Markov or Moore if they want them, along with Ellis of course. The immediate influx of hardened solid senior players and leadership is what they desperately need. And the fact all of those players come from one successful club should be helpful to them as well. In return we want the bloke who won the GF sprint yesterday - King, and/or another future gun. Use draft picks to equalise the deal.

Rance should theoretically love it, he is just what they need, high profile, high quality, leadership and he has the perfect beach boy looks to suit the Gold Coast, and can get a huge pay packet. Macintosh can get a decent wedge as well.

We benefit by starting to stagger the transition between Rance, Cotchin, Riewoldt, Astbury, Edwards, Martin, Houli and the next group of quality players who lead the team. We clear some nice cap space to help with retention of all our good youngsters.

Gold Coast benefit from getting something meaningful into their club for the inevitable loss of one of these young guns, not just more high end draft picks.

The young gun benefits from coming to a brilliant club and fitting comfortably into the overall plan for us.
 

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sante

Premium Platinum
Oct 8, 2003
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102 goals 110 behinds is what we conceded in our 12 game winning streak post bye. So 8.75 goals and 9.16 behinds. Teams averaged 61 points against us in that period when the backline was together and settled the whole way I think.

177 goals 131 behinds is what we scored. 14.75 goals and more or less 11 behinds. We averaged 99 points for to show scoring conditions were not especially difficult on the whole.

In 2018 with Rance in the backline in 24 matches teams scored 256.199 against us, about 72 points on average.

In 2017 with Rance there the team averaged conceding similar in the low 70's.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Where I am going with this is to ask has the structure of the backline worked better in 2019 without Rance once it was fully stocked from round 15 onwards? And if so, why would that be?

I personally don't think it has to do with Rance the player. I think the issue is Rance the backline general, where it might have been a little bit all about him. So my submission would be that whoever was leading that backline in Rance's absence, presumably Astbury, should continue to do so. And Rance should play a role really no more prominent in the structure and chain of command than Vlastuin or Grimes did this year.

But in for me Rance(of course) Stack(of course) and any of Graham, Ross, CCJ, Balta, Naish, and any ready made recruit/s.

Out Ellis, and after that it gets tougher.

Curve ball trade deal: Only if the players are comfortable with this...go to GCS and offer Rance, Macintosh, maybe even Markov or Moore if they want them, along with Ellis of course. The immediate influx of hardened solid senior players and leadership is what they desperately need. And the fact all of those players come from one successful club should be helpful to them as well. In return we want the bloke who won the GF sprint yesterday - King, and/or another future gun. Use draft picks to equalise the deal.

Rance should theoretically love it, he is just what they need, high profile, high quality, leadership and he has the perfect beach boy looks to suit the Gold Coast, and can get a huge pay packet. Macintosh can get a decent wedge as well.

We benefit by starting to stagger the transition between Rance, Cotchin, Riewoldt, Astbury, Edwards, Martin, Houli and the next group of quality players who lead the team. We clear some nice cap space to help with retention of all our good youngsters.

Gold Coast benefit from getting something meaningful into their club for the inevitable loss of one of these young guns, not just more high end draft picks.

The young gun benefits from coming to a brilliant club and fitting comfortably into the overall plan for us.
Trade Rance and destroy everything the club is and why we are as good as we are
 

Meteoric Rise

All Australian
Feb 4, 2008
614
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Melbourne
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Trade Rance and destroy everything the club is and why we are as good as we are
I am not suggesting trading him against his will, nor anyone else for that matter. If he wants to stay you keep him, end of. But let's say Rance was open to the move...I think it is less damaging to stagger the loss of the leaders and lose them one at a time rather than get to about 2022 and you might be looking at about 5 major players finishing up over a 1-2 year span. Not suggesting anyone should be forced out early but there should be constant dialogue with them from now to monitor their thoughts about what they want to do, with a view to possibly managing the transition as smoothly as possible. Rance could probably get a good 3-4 year deal at GCS on over a million per year, and should certainly attract something of strong value in return. Wait another year or two and those dynamics change, so it is always worthy of consideration while there is A) currency and B) proof the team can function at a high level without him.
 

energyquant

Team Captain
May 23, 2017
496
2,554
AFL Club
Richmond
102 goals 110 behinds is what we conceded in our 12 game winning streak post bye. So 8.75 goals and 9.16 behinds. Teams averaged 61 points against us in that period when the backline was together and settled the whole way I think.

177 goals 131 behinds is what we scored. 14.75 goals and more or less 11 behinds. We averaged 99 points for to show scoring conditions were not especially difficult on the whole.

In 2018 with Rance in the backline in 24 matches teams scored 256.199 against us, about 72 points on average.

In 2017 with Rance there the team averaged conceding similar in the low 70's.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Where I am going with this is to ask has the structure of the backline worked better in 2019 without Rance once it was fully stocked from round 15 onwards? And if so, why would that be?

I personally don't think it has to do with Rance the player. I think the issue is Rance the backline general, where it might have been a little bit all about him. So my submission would be that whoever was leading that backline in Rance's absence, presumably Astbury, should continue to do so. And Rance should play a role really no more prominent in the structure and chain of command than Vlastuin or Grimes did this year.

But in for me Rance(of course) Stack(of course) and any of Graham, Ross, CCJ, Balta, Naish, and any ready made recruit/s.

Out Ellis, and after that it gets tougher.

Curve ball trade deal: Only if the players are comfortable with this...go to GCS and offer Rance, Macintosh, maybe even Markov or Moore if they want them, along with Ellis of course. The immediate influx of hardened solid senior players and leadership is what they desperately need. And the fact all of those players come from one successful club should be helpful to them as well. In return we want the bloke who won the GF sprint yesterday - King, and/or another future gun. Use draft picks to equalise the deal.

Rance should theoretically love it, he is just what they need, high profile, high quality, leadership and he has the perfect beach boy looks to suit the Gold Coast, and can get a huge pay packet. Macintosh can get a decent wedge as well.

We benefit by starting to stagger the transition between Rance, Cotchin, Riewoldt, Astbury, Edwards, Martin, Houli and the next group of quality players who lead the team. We clear some nice cap space to help with retention of all our good youngsters.

Gold Coast benefit from getting something meaningful into their club for the inevitable loss of one of these young guns, not just more high end draft picks.

The young gun benefits from coming to a brilliant club and fitting comfortably into the overall plan for us.
Insta-ban!
 

energyquant

Team Captain
May 23, 2017
496
2,554
AFL Club
Richmond
I am not suggesting trading him against his will, nor anyone else for that matter. If he wants to stay you keep him, end of. But let's say Rance was open to the move...I think it is less damaging to stagger the loss of the leaders and lose them one at a time rather than get to about 2022 and you might be looking at about 5 major players finishing up over a 1-2 year span. Not suggesting anyone should be forced out early but there should be constant dialogue with them from now to monitor their thoughts about what they want to do, with a view to possibly managing the transition as smoothly as possible. Rance could probably get a good 3-4 year deal at GCS on over a million per year, and should certainly attract something of strong value in return. Wait another year or two and those dynamics change, so it is always worthy of consideration while there is A) currency and B) proof the team can function at a high level without him.
I understand the point you are making, but you misunderstand the culture of a football club. You don't trade guys like Alex Rance.
 

tony__montana

Club Legend
Jan 25, 2018
2,838
9,221
AFL Club
Richmond
102 goals 110 behinds is what we conceded in our 12 game winning streak post bye. So 8.75 goals and 9.16 behinds. Teams averaged 61 points against us in that period when the backline was together and settled the whole way I think.

177 goals 131 behinds is what we scored. 14.75 goals and more or less 11 behinds. We averaged 99 points for to show scoring conditions were not especially difficult on the whole.

In 2018 with Rance in the backline in 24 matches teams scored 256.199 against us, about 72 points on average.

In 2017 with Rance there the team averaged conceding similar in the low 70's.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Where I am going with this is to ask has the structure of the backline worked better in 2019 without Rance once it was fully stocked from round 15 onwards? And if so, why would that be?

I personally don't think it has to do with Rance the player. I think the issue is Rance the backline general, where it might have been a little bit all about him. So my submission would be that whoever was leading that backline in Rance's absence, presumably Astbury, should continue to do so. And Rance should play a role really no more prominent in the structure and chain of command than Vlastuin or Grimes did this year.

But in for me Rance(of course) Stack(of course) and any of Graham, Ross, CCJ, Balta, Naish, and any ready made recruit/s.

Out Ellis, and after that it gets tougher.

Curve ball trade deal: Only if the players are comfortable with this...go to GCS and offer Rance, Macintosh, maybe even Markov or Moore if they want them, along with Ellis of course. The immediate influx of hardened solid senior players and leadership is what they desperately need. And the fact all of those players come from one successful club should be helpful to them as well. In return we want the bloke who won the GF sprint yesterday - King, and/or another future gun. Use draft picks to equalise the deal.

Rance should theoretically love it, he is just what they need, high profile, high quality, leadership and he has the perfect beach boy looks to suit the Gold Coast, and can get a huge pay packet. Macintosh can get a decent wedge as well.

We benefit by starting to stagger the transition between Rance, Cotchin, Riewoldt, Astbury, Edwards, Martin, Houli and the next group of quality players who lead the team. We clear some nice cap space to help with retention of all our good youngsters.

Gold Coast benefit from getting something meaningful into their club for the inevitable loss of one of these young guns, not just more high end draft picks.

The young gun benefits from coming to a brilliant club and fitting comfortably into the overall plan for us.
This new setup will benefit Rance(and us) next year bc he wont be expected to stretch himself like he used to and it gives us another elite interceptor we can use. He'll be able to play a role and do the work of one man instead of playing on an elite fwd AND being an interceptor.
I may be wrong but the way i see it is we try and setup with a +1 and that +1 is usually Grimes or Vlastuin the majority of the time but its not set in stone which is what makes us unpredictable to setup against. One game they tried to tie Grimes down so Vlastuin bobs up and takes 12 intercept marks. Adding Rance into the backline where he can set himself to sometimes play as a pure stopper or sometimes play as our legitimate loose man will be better for his longevity and for our team balance.
 

Calcium Man

🏆🏆
Jan 13, 2005
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Where I am going with this is to ask has the structure of the backline worked better in 2019 without Rance once it was fully stocked from round 15 onwards? And if so, why would that be?

I personally don't think it has to do with Rance the player. I think the issue is Rance the backline general, where it might have been a little bit all about him. So my submission would be that whoever was leading that backline in Rance's absence, presumably Astbury, should continue to do so. And Rance should play a role really no more prominent in the structure and chain of command than Vlastuin or Grimes did this year.
Tell that to Grimes and Astbury who all year have talked about how important Rance has been teaching them how to get better or watch how the VFL boys all celebrated with Alex last week as he has stepped into that coaching/mentoring role.

The reason our defence looks so much better this year is because it was a collective effort to replace him, while Grimes is the most obvious one Vlas, Houli, Astbury and Broad have all stepped up in his absence and improved tremendously to make the group as a whole better.

Alex will slot in nicely next year as the leader with a year of coaching experience and a whole summer of working as defence again.

Poor guy probably to lose out is likely Baker as Broad, Rance and Grimes can play tall and small. Think Stacky replaces Short too.
 

Barry_Badrinath

Brownlow Medallist
Aug 23, 2011
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Home Finals at the MCG
102 goals 110 behinds is what we conceded in our 12 game winning streak post bye. So 8.75 goals and 9.16 behinds. Teams averaged 61 points against us in that period when the backline was together and settled the whole way I think.

177 goals 131 behinds is what we scored. 14.75 goals and more or less 11 behinds. We averaged 99 points for to show scoring conditions were not especially difficult on the whole.

In 2018 with Rance in the backline in 24 matches teams scored 256.199 against us, about 72 points on average.

In 2017 with Rance there the team averaged conceding similar in the low 70's.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Where I am going with this is to ask has the structure of the backline worked better in 2019 without Rance once it was fully stocked from round 15 onwards? And if so, why would that be?

I personally don't think it has to do with Rance the player. I think the issue is Rance the backline general, where it might have been a little bit all about him. So my submission would be that whoever was leading that backline in Rance's absence, presumably Astbury, should continue to do so. And Rance should play a role really no more prominent in the structure and chain of command than Vlastuin or Grimes did this year.

But in for me Rance(of course) Stack(of course) and any of Graham, Ross, CCJ, Balta, Naish, and any ready made recruit/s.

Out Ellis, and after that it gets tougher.

Curve ball trade deal: Only if the players are comfortable with this...go to GCS and offer Rance, Macintosh, maybe even Markov or Moore if they want them, along with Ellis of course. The immediate influx of hardened solid senior players and leadership is what they desperately need. And the fact all of those players come from one successful club should be helpful to them as well. In return we want the bloke who won the GF sprint yesterday - King, and/or another future gun. Use draft picks to equalise the deal.

Rance should theoretically love it, he is just what they need, high profile, high quality, leadership and he has the perfect beach boy looks to suit the Gold Coast, and can get a huge pay packet. Macintosh can get a decent wedge as well.

We benefit by starting to stagger the transition between Rance, Cotchin, Riewoldt, Astbury, Edwards, Martin, Houli and the next group of quality players who lead the team. We clear some nice cap space to help with retention of all our good youngsters.

Gold Coast benefit from getting something meaningful into their club for the inevitable loss of one of these young guns, not just more high end draft picks.

The young gun benefits from coming to a brilliant club and fitting comfortably into the overall plan for us.
Scoring is just down across the board. Lowest scoring year in a long time.
 

tropicaltiger

🏆2017🏆2019
Jan 4, 2002
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I am not suggesting trading him against his will, nor anyone else for that matter. If he wants to stay you keep him, end of. But let's say Rance was open to the move...I think it is less damaging to stagger the loss of the leaders and lose them one at a time rather than get to about 2022 and you might be looking at about 5 major players finishing up over a 1-2 year span. Not suggesting anyone should be forced out early but there should be constant dialogue with them from now to monitor their thoughts about what they want to do, with a view to possibly managing the transition as smoothly as possible. Rance could probably get a good 3-4 year deal at GCS on over a million per year, and should certainly attract something of strong value in return. Wait another year or two and those dynamics change, so it is always worthy of consideration while there is A) currency and B) proof the team can function at a high level without him.
Enjoy the win mate, Trading players like horseflesh is for the other 17 teams...We will be sitting down and reworking our list with maintaining our envious camaraderie and culture as a premium.... Which is the envy of all sporting clubs in Australia.
 

_RT_

🏆20🏆21🏆32🏆34🏆43🏆67🏆69🏆73🏆74🏆80🏆17🏆19
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Furies Premiers 2010
B: Grimes Astbury Rance
HB: Houli Vlastuin Stack
C: Pickett Prestia Caddy
HF: Rioli Lynch Edwards
F: Castagna Riewoldt Bolton
R: Nankervis Cotchin Martin
INT: Soldo Broad Graham Lambert
EMG: Ross Baker CCJ RCD

Good Luck Carlton and the rest of the comp
 

Craze

Club Legend
Aug 7, 2013
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B: Grimes Astbury Rance
HB: Houli Vlastuin Stack
C: Pickett Prestia Caddy
HF: Rioli Lynch Edwards
F: Castagna Riewoldt Bolton
R: Nankervis Cotchin Martin
INT: Soldo Broad Graham Lambert
EMG: Ross Baker CCJ RCD

Good Luck Carlton and the rest of the comp
There will be the inevitable surgeries and managed older players, but OMG that's frightening.

Rance is going to be hell-bent on returning to the GF in 2020. You need players like him motivating others to get back to the big dance, because of his misfortune this year. Also, he's pretty handy.
 

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