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perro_loco

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Apr 10, 2016
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Not sure why people are calling for Roarke to be dropped. As basically a fringe player, he got 15 disposals and a goal. That is a very acceptable output for your 22nd player. He hits contests hard both on the ground and aerially, usually plays within himself and gives his all. I think he's developed into pretty decent depth at this point.
Bailey Dale, who would be the most likely candidate to replace him has only hit that mark (15d/1g) once this season himself.

Gardner was good enough on the weekend also. I personally don't think Cordy or Wood have been playing super well. They have been at about the level of Gardner's game on the weekend. I think as long as only 2 of them are selected that should be fine. Might be worth giving Wood an extra week rest.

Out: McLean
In: Lipinski
Only one change for me. Mclean to be replaced by Wood to full-forward.
 

perro_loco

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Can I ask why they know nothing about footy? Are you happy to drop Cordy and/or keep Wood out of the side for a bloke who has had a couple of marks and a couple of kicks not to the opposition in 10 games of footy. Yes both Cordy and Wood make mistakes but both are premiership players with lots of experience. For team balance I am not sure you can have all in the backline, especially with the amount of left foot half back flankers that MC like to pick?
Our MC are a bunch of left wing communists who discriminate against right foot kickers. Our match committee are a bunch of left wing ideologues bent on taking away our rights and freedoms.:oops::rolleyes:
 

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Philthy1

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Need to drop Bailey Smith this week. He played well but it's obvious he's not AFL standard and never will be. Sick of seeing him get games ahead of Brad Lynch. Bevo just playing favourites
In all seriousness tho, it’s a shame Lynch hasn’t been able to his $hit together. Could have been anything. Amazing skills both sides.
 

yebiga

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OUT: Gardiner, Suckling, R.Smith
IN: Wood, Lipinski, Dale

I liked Bruce in the Ruck as he has a real presence and gives English the breaks he needs. It took a while but Bev finally relinquished on this one.

Keath and Cordy are both solid enough defenders against the Tall-forwards and Wood is a versatile back-up. Gardiner has filled in well enough to get another season. But it's now the business end of the season and Gardiner is still a project and simply not developed enough to handle finals pressure. Particularly, when there is a Premiership Captain available.

I would overlook Cavarra for the same reason: it's the business end of the season and he needs development.

Suckling is barely holding on and needs to make way. To be honest, he worries me more than Gardiiner. He has highly exaggerated confidence in his kicking ability and will inevitably make the mother of all clangers by either being careless or trying to make some incredibly low percentage kick.

Lipinski and Dale merely need to lift their pressure game to be regularly in the team. I am sure the omissions will have ingrained that message.

Finally, Roarke Smith - I don't mind him, don't mind him staying in the team because whilst he has limitations he gives 100% of what he has got. Just honest.
If the more talented options aren't convincingly champing at the bit and prepared to put in the necessary pressure - than keep R. Smith in.
 

Next Waiting

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Yes he fluffed one on the weekend that resulted in a goal to Hawthorn. Because everybody has this thing about him being a spud it gets highlighted to buggery. Why, at the same time, has almost nobody highlighted the five or six drilled passes from Bontempelli straight onto the chest of an opposition defender over the last couple of weeks? They weren't only blatant turnovers (sometimes not even under intense pressure) but they were wasted opportunities for a handful of goals. Now clearly Bont is a much much better player than Gardner but he seems to get a lot more leniency for a handful of stuff ups than Gardner does for one.
Agree Gardner has improved significantly. Confirmation bias may well be his lot for the forseeable future..unless we win big and he's part of it.

The bit about Bont is interesting. I don't recall him ever turning over so much ball and a fair number of those were unforced errors. And he was striking it beautifully. A series of perfectly timed and executed kicks straight to an opposition player.

He was our biggest momentum killer on Saturday. Would be an interesting post game review with whoever is conducting it...they might finally have something to talk about :tearsofjoy:
 

Doggies_13

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Out:
McLean - injured
Roarke - can’t question effort but fumbles enough in dry conditions let alone cairns conditions.

In:
Cavarra - conditions would suit a crumbling forward
Wood - just think he will come back in
 

lachy

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Trying to pick our team selections is harder than tattslotto and a bad sign is when the majority are happy and we tend to lose.

My only comment is, at this stage of their careers the following players all have something in common:

Schache
Lloyd
Dale
Lipinski
Lewis Young

They are all not hard enough at the contest consistently and lack strong defensive pressure. In order to consistently play at this level if this is your weakness you must be exceptional at other aspects of the game and non of them are.

I will be very clear, I am not calling any of them soft as there is enormous courage displayed by anyone who enters the field, particularly at AFL level. But their is an AFL level of contest and pressure that at this stage these players need to work on if they want a successful sustained AFL career.

So when a Gardner, Hayes, Jong, Butler, Cavarra or Rourke Smith get a game ahead of any of the above, it is not a skill thing or an ability it is they in genral provide AFL standard contest and pressure which is for a balanced team is what you want from your bottom 6 to 8 players
 

Yojimbo

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Need to drop Bailey Smith this week. He played well but it's obvious he's not AFL standard and never will be. Sick of seeing him get games ahead of Brad Lynch. Bevo just playing favourites
They had a close up of him against Hawthorn and he kept playing with his hair it was like a "Tradie Body Spray" add. He kept on
separating the mullet on either side of his neck and fluffing it like a long haired girl at a rock concert, it was disgusting and very
deserving of being dropped. You don't see Sam Walsh without a sensible hair cut, do you ? :moustache:
 
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threenewpadlocks

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Gardner was actually decent in traffic (not panicking and moving the ball well under pressure). After a horror game v Brisbane giving away all those frees to Hipwood he's improved in marking contests. He's not slow - has been able to run with small forwards - but gets blown by on the lead a few times (understandable given he's not a career defender, positioning a weakness). And he's been caught out a couple of times switching the ball or having to hit a narrow target 40+m away which cost him twice on the weekend.

Horses for courses wise he's a certainty to be picked v Freo where maybe against a shorter Hawthorn there could have been an argument for a medium defender in his place (ie Gunston very threatening through "small" means, not big, ie getting into space).

Certainly scope that he can be an improved AFL player given that the more he plays in defence the better he'll get at positining and the better he'll get at ball movement. I honestly thought that it was one of his better games given his lack of panic under pressure and in traffic, something that was a bit of a concern earlier.
 

In doG we Trust

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I can see 3 possible changes;

- Lipinski for Maclean. Seems a near certainty. Pat very unlucky not to get a gig this week

- Wood likely to come in if right. I disagree with most that it should be for Suckling. Wood only plays as a core defender and we can't keep chucking defenders forward.

For the sake of team balance, if Wood comes in it could be for one of Cordy, Gardner or Duryea. Tough call but right now if one has to go, I'd probably say Cordy.. I'd prefer to give Wood another week though.

- Suckling was innefcetual and I'd replace him. Think we need a more natural forward. Depending on scratch form I'd be giving a shot to either Cavarra, Greene,Schache or Weightman.

- If anyone shone through midfield/high half forward in the scratch, Roatke does barely enough, coughs it up too often and is replaceable.
4 choices of forward (Cavarra, Greene, Schache or Weightman) and not even a mention of Bailey Dale? What does he need to improve on from your POV? Serious question, not trolling our own people :)
 

threenewpadlocks

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I reckon there's a solid chance that we bring in Wood for McLean and look to use some of our HBF's further up the ground.

In the press conference Bevo smirked when he said Daniel was given a different role in the last quarter after Hawks put a tag on him in the third quarter.

Could be an interesting experiment to use his ball use kicking it inside 50 more often (doesn't have more than about 1 a game this season). Crozier's another one who could push up on a wing, be a "high half-back".
 

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weltschmerz

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I reckon there's a solid chance that we bring in Wood for McLean and look to use some of our HBF's further up the ground.

In the press conference Bevo smirked when he said Daniel was given a different role in the last quarter after Hawks put a tag on him in the third quarter.

Could be an interesting experiment to use his ball use kicking it inside 50 more often (doesn't have more than about 1 a game this season). Crozier's another one who could push up on a wing, be a "high half-back".
JJ and Daniel seem like good candidates for that. With Doc back our back line is great if a bit crowded, guys who can push forward will.
 

CaptainMurphy

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Certainly.
Of course they know something about footy.

"Anyone who <disagrees with me on whatever the topic is> clearly knows nothing about footy" is one of the most fatuous and irritating arguments on Big Footy (and believe me it has some serious competition!)

It's arrogant, dismissive, intimidatory and pre-emptively ad hominem which of course is no way to conduct a debate on its merits.

Sooner or later people will realise I'm taking the piss (probably later) but I'm hoping if I use it to introduce every statement of opinion I have about footy eventually it will be seen for the risible device that it is. You can all help by doing likewise!

Anybody who doesn't agree with this clearly knows nothing about Big Footy.

On a more serious note:


No I think there's a role for all three of Cordy, Wood and Gardner. It's probably academic anyway as I can't see MC dropping Gardner. My tip is they'll find room for all of them in the 22 this week, assuming Wood is 100% fit.


I do want to make a point on Gardner's kicking though. His kicking has been great the last few matches.

Yes he fluffed one on the weekend that resulted in a goal to Hawthorn. Because everybody has this thing about him being a spud it gets highlighted to buggery. Why, at the same time, has almost nobody highlighted the five or six drilled passes from Bontempelli straight onto the chest of an opposition defender over the last couple of weeks? They weren't only blatant turnovers (sometimes not even under intense pressure) but they were wasted opportunities for a handful of goals. Now clearly Bont is a much much better player than Gardner but he seems to get a lot more leniency for a handful of stuff ups than Gardner does for one. Here's another example - Clangers on Sunday: Keath 3, Gardner 1. Who talks about Keath's clangers?

And this one - who has headed the team's 1%ers the last few weeks? Ryan Gardner of course. On Sunday he had 12. The next best were Keath and Crozier with 7 each. Cordy had only 3. Nobody (outside MC and his teammates) seems to take any notice of these but they are potentially goalsaving each time.

It reminds me of the joke about Stavros the goat f**ker. Gardner only has to make one error and it's talked about forever. Nobody remembers (or perhaps nobody wants to see?) the good things that he does.

He's no superstar but gee he gets a bad rap around here. Especially for a bloke who has only played 10 games and understandably is still finding his feet at the top level.
Massively agree with what you're saying about how people assess Gardiner's performances now. It's classic confirmation bias - they expect him to fail, so every mistake he makes becomes proof that he's sh*t, and everything he does well is forgotten.
 

bobs head soup

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4 choices of forward (Cavarra, Greene, Schache or Weightman) and not even a mention of Bailey Dale? What does he need to improve on from your POV? Serious question, not trolling our own people :)
Fair enough question. I feel like that last forward spot has been a problem for us. In recent times we've tried Dickson, Lloyd and Suckling, experienced players who'd done the job in previous years, ahead of guys who'd done more in scratch matches.

I don't really mind who that last spot goes to, as long as they are in form and kicking goals. If it's Dale, sobeit (haven't seen any details from this week's game). I just haven't seen his name mentioned at all in recent weeks, is he injured?
 

In doG we Trust

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Fair enough question. I feel like that last forward spot has been a problem for us. In recent times we've tried Dickson, Lloyd and Suckling, experienced players who'd done the job in previous years, ahead of guys who'd done more in scratch matches.

I don't really mind who that last spot goes to, as long as they are in form and kicking goals. If it's Dale, sobeit (haven't seen any details from this week's game). I just haven't seen his name mentioned at all in recent weeks, is he injured?
Yeah he kicked a goal the other week and isn't injured. Bevo finally mentioned him in a presser the other day too, always a good sign. I just think he has the most potential of the lot aiming for that spot but sometimes potential is a dirty word. We'll see.
 

doggies ftw

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I reckon there's a solid chance that we bring in Wood for McLean and look to use some of our HBF's further up the ground.

In the press conference Bevo smirked when he said Daniel was given a different role in the last quarter after Hawks put a tag on him in the third quarter.

Could be an interesting experiment to use his ball use kicking it inside 50 more often (doesn't have more than about 1 a game this season). Crozier's another one who could push up on a wing, be a "high half-back".
I don’t mind the idea of trying to move Williams, JJ, Croz etc up the ground at times but do we really want Wood, Cordy, Keath, Gardner and to a lesser extent Dureya playing in the same backline? Literally the one and only consistent edge we’ve had on our opponents all year has been our drive and precise ball use from half back. We’d absolutely kill that part of our game with that set up. And if things go badly what changes can we make? Cordy is the only real one out of that group that can play a different position as a defensive tall forward other than that we’re stuck with no options to swing stuff around other than sitting blokes on the bench or trying to hide them in other parts of the ground.

Ive made my thoughts on Gardner clear I’m not going to go into it again but if he plays we just have to drop Cordy or leave out Wood or I think we could get really burnt, maybe not this week but at some stage. I know who I’d want in my team with 2mins left on the clock in a final...
 

Proffessor

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In all seriousness tho, it’s a shame Lynch hasn’t been able to his $hit together. Could have been anything. Amazing skills both sides.
I'd be interested to hear some insights regarding Brad Lynch if you have any Philthy1, he impressed me in his appearances at senior level, but clearly fell out of favour for reasons other than form.

His treatment is essentially the opposite of Roarke Smith, Lachie Young and Ryan Gardner, who have all really struggled at senior level but have continued to receive a comparatively unwarranted level of opportunity.
 

scooter600x

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I'd be interested to hear some insights regarding Brad Lynch if you have any Philthy1, he impressed me in his appearances at senior level, but clearly fell out of favour for reasons other than form.

His treatment is essentially the opposite of Roarke Smith, Lachie Young and Ryan Gardner, who have all really struggled at senior level but have continued to receive a comparatively unwarranted level of opportunity.
Lynch has quite literally not made a bests list in the VFL or scratch matches for two years. You couldn't select him for AFL, he has to go.
 

Proffessor

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Certainly.
Of course they know something about footy.

"Anyone who <disagrees with me on whatever the topic is> clearly knows nothing about footy" is one of the most fatuous and irritating arguments on Big Footy (and believe me it has some serious competition!)

It's arrogant, dismissive, intimidatory and pre-emptively ad hominem which of course is no way to conduct a debate on its merits.

Sooner or later people will realise I'm taking the piss (probably later) but I'm hoping if I use it to introduce every statement of opinion I have about footy eventually it will be seen for the risible device that it is. You can all help by doing likewise!

Anybody who doesn't agree with this clearly knows nothing about Big Footy.

On a more serious note:


No I think there's a role for all three of Cordy, Wood and Gardner. It's probably academic anyway as I can't see MC dropping Gardner. My tip is they'll find room for all of them in the 22 this week, assuming Wood is 100% fit.


I do want to make a point on Gardner's kicking though. His kicking has been great the last few matches.

Yes he fluffed one on the weekend that resulted in a goal to Hawthorn. Because everybody has this thing about him being a spud it gets highlighted to buggery. Why, at the same time, has almost nobody highlighted the five or six drilled passes from Bontempelli straight onto the chest of an opposition defender over the last couple of weeks? They weren't only blatant turnovers (sometimes not even under intense pressure) but they were wasted opportunities for a handful of goals. Now clearly Bont is a much much better player than Gardner but he seems to get a lot more leniency for a handful of stuff ups than Gardner does for one. Here's another example - Clangers on Sunday: Keath 3, Gardner 1. Who talks about Keath's clangers?

And this one - who has headed the team's 1%ers the last few weeks? Ryan Gardner of course. On Sunday he had 12. The next best were Keath and Crozier with 7 each. Cordy had only 3. Nobody (outside MC and his teammates) seems to take any notice of these but they are potentially goalsaving each time.

It reminds me of the joke about Stavros the goat f**ker. Gardner only has to make one error and it's talked about forever. Nobody remembers (or perhaps nobody wants to see?) the good things that he does.

He's no superstar but gee he gets a bad rap around here. Especially for a bloke who has only played 10 games and understandably is still finding his feet at the top level.
I'll grant you that Gardner has significantly improved Dogwatch, however some of his supporters/defenders including yourself could also be accused of eulogising his recent performances a little too much. They haven't been that good.

It is possible for stats to look better than they really are, for instance some of the 1%ers Gardner would have been credited for on the stats sheet, I'd prefer he hadn't done. He still goes for some balls he probably shouldn't, where he fails to either mark or kill the ball, and occasionally takes out better positioned team mates, leaving us exposed when the ball hits the deck.

He had 5 kicks on Sunday, 2 were spoiled as they reached their intended target resulting in turnovers that ended up with shots on goal (1 goal 1 behind), 1 went directly to an opponent, and the remaining 2 were extremely short (but effective) passes, in fact one was so short that the resulting mark wasn't paid and it was called play on.

I wouldn't call that kicking exactly great.
 

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