Unofficial Preview Changes - Lions v Pies (Easter Thursday)

[martinson]

I like the idea of 2 rucks. The second one obviously isn't Fullarton. Fort has shown enough to be that man.

I'm not keen at all on Daniher taking second ruck duties. He's starting to run into very good form doing what he does best. Tbh I think it's a dumb idea.

Footy clubs and the brains there do do dumb things sometimes. If we're hell bent on only one ruck then they just lob on the biggest bloke who's there to do it.

 

[martinson]

I like the idea of 2 rucks. The second one obviously isn't Fullarton. Fort has shown enough to be that man.

I'm not keen at all on Daniher taking second ruck duties. He's starting to run into very good form doing what he does best. Tbh I think it's a dumb idea.

Footy clubs and the brains there do do dumb things sometimes. If we're hell bent on only one ruck then they just lob on the biggest bloke who's there to do it.

I can see the thinking. Hipwood comes in so that takes a load off Joe who can then ruck for say 25 % of the game.

I don't think he likes rucking.

 

[Nunez]

I like the idea of 2 rucks. The second one obviously isn't Fullarton. Fort has shown enough to be that man.

I'm not keen at all on Daniher taking second ruck duties. He's starting to run into very good form doing what he does best. Tbh I think it's a dumb idea.

Footy clubs and the brains there do do dumb things sometimes. If we're hell bent on only one ruck then they just lob on the biggest bloke who's there to do it.

I fully expect Oscar to take the bulk of rucking with McStay and Daniher to chop out up forward. Would be good if one of our KPD chop out down back so we can keep Oscar up the ground to take a contested mark.

 

[Nathan Barley]

There are a few on here, probably the same person with multiple accounts, who have gone hard at Fort every game. From what I have seen, he is a decent tap ruckman who is very strong mark above head. He cost us nothing and is producing what we need.

Fort 23 hit outs from 66 ruck contests
Stanley 21/39
Blicavs 20/37

Thats a belting from 2 average rucks who followed up better at ground level as well

Hes a competent contested mark which allows him to offer something when he’s forward but that’s about it

Will be an easy decision once Hippy is fit

 

[Timetoroarlike44]

Fort is showing signs of being better than the big O

Does some really nice things. But i think oscar the clearly better ruck. Has become quite good in close games at just smashing it forward, sometimes quick 30m handball or 40m kick. Seems to do it when we are struggling to win clearances to a pretty handy tactic.

 

[Mighty Lions]

I can see the thinking. Hipwood comes in so that takes a load off Joe who can then ruck for say 25 % of the game.

I don't think he likes rucking.

On the contrary, Joey has said more than once that he likes to ruck in a game...just not full time.

 

[Big Sauce 21]

If they go 1 ruck, Daniher shouldn't be the back up. He is useless in there and burns his energy chasing contests.

 

[beardancer]

Fort is showing signs of being better than the big O

I kind of agree, his marking around the ground is very good as well.

 

[martinson]

I fully expect Oscar to take the bulk of rucking with McStay and Daniher to chop out up forward. Would be good if one of our KPD chop out down back so we can keep Oscar up the ground to take a contested mark.

That's more my thinking if we play 1 ruck. McStay is competent enough to take a few stoppages. One of the defenders should also step up ,even if it's only 5 or 6 times a game.

I like Daniher in the Centre clearance as long as he's not rucking and just throws his body in when it hits the deck. Well he doesn't try to ruck anyway.

 

[Nathan Barley]

Oscars ruckwork is only slightly better than Forts but his follow up is much better. Often tackles well and wins multiple clearances.

 

[martinson]

On the contrary, Joey has said more than once that he likes to ruck in a game...just not full time.

Then what he says and what he does when he's doing it haven't shown any correlation so far.

 

[beardancer]

Fort 23 hit outs from 66 ruck contests
Stanley 21/39
Blicavs 20/37

Thats a belting from 2 average rucks who followed up better at ground level as well

Hes a competent contested mark which allows him to offer something when he’s forward but that’s about it

Will be an easy decision once Hippy is fit

Well, hippy isnt going to ruck though is he. The question is we need 2 rucks......Big O and who else.

 

[Nathan Barley]

Don’t dismiss the likelihood that Joes rucking will improve by at least as much as he’s improved as a key forward since last year.

 

[martinson]

Don’t dismiss the likelihood that Joes rucking will improve by at least as much as he’s improved as a key forward since last year.

I have thought that. I just don't want him getting injured or a corkie doing it.

 

[Nathan Barley]

I have thought that. I just don't want him getting injured or a corkie doing it.

Was probably the reason why he stopped jumping at ruck contests last year. Should be more confident now

 

[M Malice]

Fort 23 hit outs from 66 ruck contests
Stanley 21/39
Blicavs 20/37

Thats a belting from 2 average rucks who followed up better at ground level as well

Hes a competent contested mark which allows him to offer something when he’s forward but that’s about it

Will be an easy decision once Hippy is fit

Hit outs mean nothing IMO, one of if not the most useless stat in the game. Half the time when a ruck gets a hit out stat even he has no idea where the ball is going and on a good percentage of those occasions an opposition mid gets first hands on it, Fort is doing a serviceable job in negating and at least providing a decent contest in the ruck and is not too bad around the ground.

However hit outs to a clear advantage ah la what Nic Nat/Gawn can do are a useful stat, I'm happy with a ruck who can half contests and provide a marking option around the ground, Max Gawn or Dean Cox type rucks are a rare breed.

 

[martinson]

Hit outs mean nothing IMO, one of if not the most useless stat in the game. Half the time when a ruck gets a hit out stat even he has no idea where the ball is going and on a good percentage of those occasions an opposition mid gets first hands on it, Fort is doing a serviceable job in negating and at least providing a decent contest in the ruck and is not too bad around the ground.

However hit outs to a clear advantage ah la what Nic Nat/Gawn can do are a useful stat, I'm happy with a ruck who can half contests and provide a marking option around the ground, Max Gawn or Dean Cox type rucks are a rare breed.

The one thing Oscar can do is a la Keating style bang it forward once the opposition rucks get a bit tired or soccer it hard off the ground and that can give you a big advantage as the game wears on.

He's not near the ruckman Keating was but can bring about a similar result on occasions.

 

[Saucery]

Fort 23 hit outs from 66 ruck contests
Stanley 21/39
Blicavs 20/37

Thats a belting from 2 average rucks who followed up better at ground level as well

Hes a competent contested mark which allows him to offer something when he’s forward but that’s about it

Will be an easy decision once Hippy is fit

So one guy playing in the most brutal job on the ground against two rotating guys who get to regularly rest. Yeah I'm sure he took a belting, just not the kind you mean.

 

[Nathan Barley]

Hit outs mean nothing IMO, one of if not the most useless stat in the game. Half the time when a ruck gets a hit out stat even he has no idea where the ball is going and on a good percentage of those occasions an opposition mid gets first hands on it, Fort is doing a serviceable job in negating and at least providing a decent contest in the ruck and is not too bad around the ground.

However hit outs to a clear advantage ah la what Nic Nat/Gawn can do are a useful stat, I'm happy with a ruck who can half contests and provide a marking option around the ground, Max Gawn or Dean Cox type rucks are a rare breed.

So one guy playing in the most brutal job on the ground against two rotating guys who get to regularly rest. Yeah I'm sure he took a belting, just not the kind you mean.

Are you guys factoring in the quality of the opposing rucks? He wasn’t up against Gawn and Jackson. He’s up against a part timer and a guy Geelong have been desperate to replace.

 

[martinson]

So one guy playing in the most brutal job on the ground against two rotating guys who get to regularly rest. Yeah I'm sure he took a belting, just not the kind you mean.

He taps it out quite intelligently sometimes.

Ironically people are prepared to give Rayner and Cockatoo however long they want and this guy has played 3 senior games in what ? And not very many overall.

So he's obviously no star but he was given a big job Friday and wasn't disgraced . With not much help from Fullarton.

I think I spent a long time defending McCarthy and Adams when most were saying drop them. And then Ah Chee who copped it every week but now looks like becoming a valuable player.

So who's to say Fort mightn't get better.

 

[M Malice]

Are you guys factoring in the quality of the opposing rucks? He wasn’t up against Gawn and Jackson. He’s up against a part timer and a guy Geelong have been desperate to replace.

Mine was an opinion on the hit out stat generally... although I thought Fort was pretty good on the night, not glaringly beaten IMO.

 

[Saucery]

Are you guys factoring in the quality of the opposing rucks? He wasn’t up against Gawn and Jackson. He’s up against a part timer and a guy Geelong have been desperate to replace.

I's saying that two big bodies taking turns at crashing into one is going to take its toll on a guy just finding his feet at AFL level.

 

[Nathan Barley]

I's saying that two big bodies taking turns at crashing into one is going to take its toll on a guy just finding his feet at AFL level.

Hes 28. We don’t have time to let him find his feet at AFL level against dud rucks. Go back to the Essendon game when Draper got the best of our two rucks for a comparison.

 

[Sanchez365]

I was happy enough with Forts effort on Friday night, but I wouldn't put our ruck division in the top 8 of the comp. Geelongs wouldn't be their either though.

Realistically Fort was brought in incase for some reason the big O couldn't play (like a brain fade suspension) and we didn't have to get dominated playing Fullerton in the ruck all night. Imagine that disaster.

 

[spotthedog1]

Ely over Sharp? Interesting call.


Do you think there are other players in our squad who might also be AFL standard and will be in form by finals with games in the seniors? Perhaps their skills are better to fill the shortcomings we experienced against Geelong. I think we need an extra midfielder and it's possible Dev could be the missing piece of the puzzle if he got an opportunity.

Absolutely. I think we have a few players in the ressies who might be very good, and I strongly favour a rotation policy. Unfortunately, I don't think we are doing that or are likely to do that- not how we have operated.

That said, I'd rotate players out who aren't crying out for game time (being Rayner, Cocky and Bez). They seriously need the minutes. Plenty of solid players around who could be gifted a week off as managed (not dropped), so that someone else could have a few rounds.

I also would not bring in anyone for one game- pointless for their development. If we want to give Dev a run, do it. Give Lyons, Zorko, Bailey and Ah Chee a week off each. None of them are going to be negatively impacted by the week off, and Dev gets 4 games on the trot.