Preview Changes & Pre-match Discussion - Round 10 vs. Port Adelaide, MCG Sun 23/05 @ 3:20pm

[whiskeytown]

Re dragging out the process - I expect this will be the pattern for the year. Guys like Keane may be in and out of the team, rested, managed, swapped with other kids, with a core of older players retained to help hold it together - our 2021 version of ‘holding it together’ which, despite how utterly awful we are, is to avoid an absolute flogging. We haven’t yet lost a game by more than 30 points.

For that reason we may see some baffling ins and outs, as the club tries to balance age/experience/position/skill set, while still exposing the kids.

It’s a rough year.

I agree with what your saying. But we have only 8 this week with under 50 games and 7 with over 150 games.

Should really be 10 each week with under 50 games and no more than 5 players with 150 games... so that we can get as much as that 2020/21 young cohort up to 50 games as quick as possible

What difference between a 5 goal defeat to Port Adelaide or an 8 goal defeat?

The rebuild needs to be the priority... not saving face

 

[Horaceg]

Brown brothers make a nice wine, but they have zero business on an AFL field, this is Blair mrkII, exept we have 2 of them now, Bucks loves them, want's to prove everyone wrong, open your ******* eyes campaigner!!

We could use a good wine sponsor, maybe something subtle on the shorts, otherwise I agree no place for Brown Brothers out there

still holding hope for Tyler

 

[stormskye]

Re dragging out the process - I expect this will be the pattern for the year. Guys like Keane may be in and out of the team, rested, managed, swapped with other kids, with a core of older players retained to help hold it together - our 2021 version of ‘holding it together’ which, despite how utterly awful we are, is to avoid an absolute flogging. We haven’t yet lost a game by more than 30 points.

For that reason we may see some baffling ins and outs, as the club tries to balance age/experience/position/skill set, while still exposing the kids.

It’s a rough year.

When you are only kicking 6-7 goals, 5 goal losses are floggings

 

[TheGreatGrundy]

I found it uplifting

I suffered about 2 minutes of it and decided that his feigned or, even worse, genuine earnestness and serious demeanour made some of life's chores seem more appealing, hence occupying my time elsewhere.

 

[Vicky Park]

I agree with what your saying. But we have only 8 this week with under 50 games and 7 with over 150 games.

Should really be 10 each week with under 50 games and no more than 5 players with 150 games... so that we can get as much as that 2020/21 young cohort up to 50 games as quick as possible

What difference between a 5 goal defeat to Port Adelaide or an 8 goal defeat?

The rebuild needs to be the priority... not saving face

Re your last point about saving face, I think it’s more about saving the kids from getting regularly flogged. That’s a horrible way to start a career.

Also - how far have we fallen when we’re expecting to lose, but having a discussion about degrees of loss.

I’m going to the game tomorrow, and am feeling about as excited as I would if I was going to the dentist. Which is to say I’m dreading it. But my view is that when the club is in trouble, supporters should show support for the players and the team. By showing up.

At any rate, we’ll have another win soon, so why not this round? Adams will give us a lift.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

I agree with what your saying. But we have only 8 this week with under 50 games and 7 with over 150 games.

Should really be 10 each week with under 50 games and no more than 5 players with 150 games... so that we can get as much as that 2020/21 young cohort up to 50 games as quick as possible

What difference between a 5 goal defeat to Port Adelaide or an 8 goal defeat?

The rebuild needs to be the priority... not saving face

But most of our under 50 gamers are actually under 10 gamers... and they are skinny first and second year players. What you want is unachieveable because we have delisted/traded players in the age bracket where players would be hitting the 50 game mark. .

We have just three 20 year olds on the list and nine younger than that . YThey just cant be fast tracked any quicker than they are.

We have just five 21 year olds ... including an Irish rookie. Of that list Tyler Brown is getting chances, Quaynor is a regular, and Murphy would be playing if not out concussed last week.

We have JUST two 22 year olds and one of them is Daicos.

The players who should be in the 50 game age group just dont exist. You cant rush the 18 year olds just to achieve this.

 

[domus]

I found it uplifting

Stockholm Syndrome.

 

[domus]

He is a very polished performer and was excellent in the presser - honest and expansive, and upbeat for a guy with the world on his shoulders, in an imploding club environment.

I prefer results on match day over a slick post match or pre match speaker. I'd be up and about too if I'd been told I am likely to remain as coach on what I guess would be a truckload of money.

I have been a Buckley fan and defender for most of his tenure but I have lost faith in him. His presser disturbed me. I found his words to be very patronising with regard to the supporter base.

We are told to lower our expectations after a preseason and early season where our club told us we were contenders who were intent on playing finals. They didn't have the guts to speak the truth to us after the diabolical self inflicted mayhem in the preseason period.

Now, because Buckley and others can no longer sell their BS due to our win loss ratio he tries the new approach of the honest coach, calling it as it is and asking supporters to drop their unrealistical expectations.

He also said we had three pretty good years. Thanks Buckley. Ten years at the helm and we had 3 "pretty good ones" so shut up and suck up another 4 years of flux and development.

I would say that 2 of those 3 years were not pretty good. We were terrible to watch in 2019 and 2020. We played grinding negative, low scoring football and other than one memorable win against the eagles exited the finals in embarrassing fashion. Once against an undermanned giants on our home turf and the other at the Gabba against the Cats where we were humiliated.

Pretty good? We were never in contention.

And as I wrote in a previous post, Geelong continue to compete for premierships year after year and improve their list with brilliant recruiting. Hawks won 5 flags before finally hitting a state of flux and Richmond 3 and maybe 4. Yet their squad looks likely to see them contesting finals for many years.

He spoke as if our failure to score after quarter time is a recent phenomenon. We have been doing it for three years and he said 'for some reason' we lose our dare after quarter time.

You'd think the senior coach might have an idea or two as to why his team keeps repeating the same dreary pattern week after week.

I'm glad you are impressed with Buckley.

 

[jmac70]

Stockholm Syndrome.

I’ve never been there. What’s the beer like?

 

[jmac70]

I suffered about 2 minutes of it and decided that his feigned or, even worse, genuine earnestness and serious demeanour made some of life's chores seem more appealing, hence occupying my time elsewhere.

I like to do the vacuuming whilst wearing my Buckley t-shirt.

 

[No SPIN]

I prefer results on match day over a slick post match or pre match speaker. I'd be up and about too if I'd been told I am likely to remain as coach on what I guess would be a truckload of money.

I have been a Buckley fan and defender for most of his tenure but I have lost faith in him. His presser disturbed me. I found his words to be very patronising with regard to the supporter base.

We are told to lower our expectations after a preseason and early season where our club told us we were contenders who were intent on playing finals. They didn't have the guts to speak the truth to us after the diabolical self inflicted mayhem in the preseason period.

Now, because Buckley and others can no longer sell their BS due to our win loss ratio he tries the new approach of the honest coach, calling it as it is and asking supporters to drop their unrealistical expectations.

He also said we had three pretty good years. Thanks Buckley. Ten years at the helm and we had 3 "pretty good ones" so shut up and suck up another 4 years of flux and development.

I would say that 2 of those 3 years were not pretty good. We were terrible to watch in 2019 and 2020. We played grinding negative, low scoring football and other than one memorable win against the eagles exited the finals in embarrassing fashion. Once against an undermanned giants on our home turf and the other at the Gabba against the Cats where we were humiliated.

Pretty good? We were never in contention.

And as I wrote in a previous post, Geelong continue to compete for premierships year after year and improve their list with brilliant recruiting. Hawks won 5 flags before finally hitting a state of flux and Richmond 3 and maybe 4. Yet their squad looks likely to see them contesting finals for many years.

He spoke as if our failure to score after quarter time is a recent phenomenon. We have been doing it for three years and he said 'for some reason' we lose our dare after quarter time.

You'd think the senior coach might have an idea or two as to why his team keeps repeating the same dreary pattern week after week.

I'm glad you are impressed with Buckley.

Geel get a walk up start to finals every year with their HGA guaranteeing 9 wins.
You have forgetten that when they lost their first final last year the media was dragging Scott over the coals due to 75% LOSS rate in finals since the 2011 flag win. Proving that the HGA flatters them given how poor their finals win ratio has been.
They made the GF and got smashed.
Now they have a team with 9 best 22 over 30yo.
They are therefore on the precipous of a huge cliff.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Geel get a walk up start to finals every year with their HGA guaranteeing 9 wins.
You have forgetten that when they lost their first final last year the media was dragging Scott over the coals due to 75% LOSS rate in finals since the 2011 flag win. Proving that the HGA flatters them given how poor their finals win ratio has been.
They made the GF and got smashed.
Now they have a team with 9 best 22 over 30yo.
They are therefore on the precipous of a huge cliff.

They might be able to turn the ship around now they have gotten rid of Selwood and invited Wells to return

 

[cakewalk06]

Geel get a walk up start to finals every year with their HGA guaranteeing 9 wins.
You have forgetten that when they lost their first final last year the media was dragging Scott over the coals due to 75% LOSS rate in finals since the 2011 flag win. Proving that the HGA flatters them given how poor their finals win ratio has been.
They made the GF and got smashed.
Now they have a team with 9 best 22 over 30yo.
They are therefore on the precipous of a huge cliff.

They are standing a metre back looking over the cliff.... we ran straight past them at speed

 

[whiskeytown]

But most of our under 50 gamers are actually under 10 gamers... and they are skinny first and second year players. What you want is unachieveable because we have delisted/traded players in the age bracket where players would be hitting the 50 game mark. .

We have just three 20 year olds on the list and nine younger than that . YThey just cant be fast tracked any quicker than they are.

We have just five 21 year olds ... including an Irish rookie. Of that list Tyler Brown is getting chances, Quaynor is a regular, and Murphy would be playing if not out concussed last week.

We have JUST two 22 year olds and one of them is Daicos.

The players who should be in the 50 game age group just dont exist. You cant rush the 18 year olds just to achieve this.

You can simply choose to not play Mayne (despite his form) and give Keane the game on Georgiades this

And rather than rush him back...choose to give Adams the extra week off to recover and play McRae or Bianco

So what I’m suggesting is far from impossible as you claim it to be

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

They are standing a metre back looking over the cliff.... we ran straight past them at speed

They are not the club we should be modelling ourselves on. Their strategy has yielded no flags

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

You can simply choose to not play Mayne (despite his form) and give Keane the game on Georgiades this

And rather than rush him back...choose to give Adams the extra week off to recover and play McRae or Bianco

So what I’m suggesting is far from impossible as you claim it to be

We already have Wilson back there so it’s really a choice at the moment between him and Keane. We aren’t ready to have them both in the 22 although that time will come. Maybe Keane gets the sub bench spot.

I’ve already agreed that Bianco could easily have played but that one extra spot to a young player is really flirting at the fringes. He is only just building up form after injury so another week won’t hurt.

That said Adams when fit is a walk up start. Judging from afar that he needs another week is just keyboard warrior stuff.

 

[domus]

Geel get a walk up start to finals every year with their HGA guaranteeing 9 wins.
You have forgetten that when they lost their first final last year the media was dragging Scott over the coals due to 75% LOSS rate in finals since the 2011 flag win. Proving that the HGA flatters them given how poor their finals win ratio has been.
They made the GF and got smashed.
Now they have a team with 9 best 22 over 30yo.
They are therefore on the precipous of a huge cliff.

Weve already gone over the edge. West Coast and Freo have just as big an advantage on their home turf.
Geelong are a chance to win this year.
They have not had years of non contention as we have from 2013-2017 where we floundered outside of the 8 on the promise that bucks was re building the team for long term success.
Three pretty good years and we are back in rebuild mode because of administrative incompetence and poor player management.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Weve already gone over the edge. West Coast and Freo have just as big an advantage on their home turf.
Geelong are a chance to win this year.
They have not had years of non contention as we have from 2013-2017 where we floundered out off the 8 on the promise that bucks was re building the team for long term success.
Three pretty good years and we are back in rebuild mode because of administrative incompetence and poor player management.

West Coast and Freo have ten genuine home games and ten genuine away games . Net result nil

With Geelong every game they play at the Cattery is an advantage. They are only at a disadvantage when they travel interstate. The games they play in Melbourne are on neutral territory. Net result is significantly in their favour.

It is what it is so no complaints but these things need to be taken into consideration when comparing success stories and when poaching their recruiting staff .

Their win loss in finals v home and away is unequivocal evidence that they benefit from the home and away fixture.

 

[frizzle]

They are not the club we should be modelling ourselves on. Their strategy has yielded no flags

I have a bad feeling that is going to change in 2021.

 

[No SPIN]

Weve already gone over the edge. West Coast and Freo have just as big an advantage on their home turf.
Geelong are a chance to win this year.
They have not had years of non contention as we have from 2013-2017 where we floundered outside of the 8 on the promise that bucks was re building the team for long term success.
Three pretty good years and we are back in rebuild mode because of administrative incompetence and poor player management.

Geels win rate at home is close to 85%. Give any team with that advantage cruise into finals.

After losing their first final last year, they had is a 75% loss rate in finals since the 2011 flag - how is that a metric that proves they have been contending.
They have made 1 GF since 2011, as have we.

 

[Gone Critical]

I agree with what your saying. But we have only 8 this week with under 50 games and 7 with over 150 games.

Should really be 10 each week with under 50 games and no more than 5 players with 150 games... so that we can get as much as that 2020/21 young cohort up to 50 games as quick as possible

What difference between a 5 goal defeat to Port Adelaide or an 8 goal defeat?

The rebuild needs to be the priority... not saving face

The mantra of we need to play kids and get them up to 50 games asap to aid development doesnt make sense to me. Simply giving games to kids when there are better options around the club doesnt help. At the moment we are a poor team and its not to hard to get a spot in the 22 compared to most other lists. Play the kids that are good enough to displace the more senior players but if they are not they need to play VFL, develop their game and earn the spot. Thats much better development for mine.

While there is no way to measure these things and everyone has their own opinion my view would be Ollie Henry's development hasnt been helped by playing AFL games where he looked totally out of his depth. I would think the club will be thinking he needs a good block of VFL time now whereas Poulter will gain a lot from the 3 games he has had. Poulter may easily drop off and go back to the VFL at some point but the experience of handling the AFL speed of game will be invaluable to him. Henry on the other hand may have been a little damaged by his experience.

It's horses for courses. If they are not ready dont play them. Its like any sport experience and practice don't help if they are not good quality. Having a load of kids belted each week while they underperform will only teach them bad habits and crush confidence.

 

[whiskeytown]

We already have Wilson back there so it’s really a choice at the moment between him and Keane. We aren’t ready to have them both in the 22 although that time will come. Maybe Keane gets the sub bench spot.

I’ve already agreed that Bianco could easily have played but that one extra spot to a young player is really flirting at the fringes. He is only just building up form after injury so another week won’t hurt.

That said Adams when fit is a walk up start. Judging from afar that he needs another week is just keyboard warrior stuff.

Lol. Adams has a history of rushing back and getting re injured. You completely trust the injury management history of the club in recent years??

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Lol. Adams has a history of rushing back and getting re injured. You completely trust the injury management history of the club in recent years??

I hope they’ve made the right call but I’m not going to be an armchair medical expert on the matter and pontificate.

What makes you think we should wait one week for Adams? why not two? six? Maybe we should just shoot him now and put him out of his misery?

 

[whiskeytown]

The mantra of we need to play kids and get them up to 50 games asap to aid development doesnt make sense to me. Simply giving games to kids when there are better options around the club doesnt help. At the moment we are a poor team and its not to hard to get a spot in the 22 compared to most other lists. Play the kids that are good enough to displace the more senior players but if they are not they need to play VFL, develop their game and earn the spot. Thats much better development for mine.

While there is no way to measure these things and everyone has their own opinion my view would be Ollie Henry's development hasnt been helped by playing AFL games where he looked totally out of his depth. I would think the club will be thinking he needs a good block of VFL time now whereas Poulter will gain a lot from the 3 games he has had. Poulter may easily drop off and go back to the VFL at some point but the experience of handling the AFL speed of game will be invaluable to him. Henry on the other hand may have been a little damaged by his experience.

It's horses for courses. If they are not ready dont play them. Its like any sport experience and practice don't help if they are not good quality. Having a load of kids belted each week while they underperform will only teach them bad habits and crush confidence.

See what you’re saying... but for the life of me can’t see how giving Keane the extra week and bringing one of McRae/Rantall/Bianco in is going to hurt their development. Especially in a round where there is no VFL.

Putting Keane on Dixon perhaps yeah... but putting him on another young kid in Georgiades should be fine.

Likewise bringing in one of McRae, Rantall, Bianco... there’s not a crucial one on one match up in the port game that they’ll be charged with...

Anyhow agree to disagree with someone who is a courteous poster

 

[whiskeytown]

I hope they’ve made the right call but I’m not going to be an armchair medical expert on the matter and pontificate.

What makes you think we should wait one week for Adams? why not two? six? Maybe we should just shoot him now and put him out of his misery?

You deny Adan’s has a history of coming back early? Put all faith in the medical dept?

Couldn’t be a case of rushing a player back so as to prevent the club having a bigger loss?

Every regime needs it’s yes men