Preview Changes R6 v Geelong

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Sep 12, 2013
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I’m not as pessimistic about the game and not sure why.

The cigar shape of Kadina Park was similar to Subiaco which is were we still sometimes train and most of the squad have played many games at.

We are brining Cripps, Shuey, JK and Yeo back from an interrupted preseason so hopefully some gelling.

We were poor against Port so I am expecting a positive response.

Still 40% chance of rain so only 1 ruck is ok

We have a better balance with 1 more forward

Geelong are not the hardest nuts out there (Selwood aside) and have shown good Cats but also struggling Cats at times

Not seeing Cats defenders coping with the speed of Ryan and Petruccelle especially with Clark out

Not needing the 4 points to settle our season. Play with spirit and our brand and we can compete pretty well.
 

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Sep 12, 2013
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We don’t have any though. Brayshaw?
Going to the Beagles game at Claremont today and O’Neill, Brayshaw and Ainsworth are the three I want to see going up against Jye Bolton, Mountford and Mitchell. Will be telling
 

Astro7

Official Halftime Oranges Man
Aug 6, 2017
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Just rewatched some of the last game-a cracking match, score aside, it was pretty intense.
Port were sensational. As the talking heads said it looked like Port were playing with a dry ball and Eagles with a wet ball, such was the difference in skills. The ball just seemed to spill over, roll on or land at their feet every time, it was uncanny. The Eagles couldn't cop a break, nothing went their way. Pressure does that.
Skills aside, it looked like Port had luck on their side as well as the umpires and goalies calls. A good example of creating your own luck. How's all that 'noise of affirmation and umpires compensating for it' going? A subdued crowd that night.
With the Cat's tackling and pressure, it's like facing Port again, two weeks in a row, except we have to travel and play on a narrower ground?
A sense of foregone gloom over this game, with a glimmer of blind hope?
Curious to see if we still stick to the same old narrative?
A strong response with an upset would be good medicine going forward, and a rise on the ladder....(dreaming?)
 

twce13

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Good news, it should be easy to draft a Masten replacement, as long as he is a long distance runner, as apparently if he gets no disposals or tackles, it doesn't matter, not relevant. Scouts should hit up the marathon instead of the champs tbh.
 

LittleGreekGod

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Dec 24, 2015
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Well previously he's played the more traditional link man winger. Provides a mobile target out of defense for a short pass uncontested. Sometimes he had a ripper game and other games not so much, and then the poor games which every player has, some more than others.

Now I am reading about him evolving into a defensive winger who roles back and covers space behind the opposite attacking wing. Still provides a bit of an out but is covering space more than attacking.

I actually think his attributes dont suit that role. Experience obviously is a big advantage ans is being diligent in playing that role but I just think others could do better and offer more.

Duggan could take that role, Franky Watson and even Nelson. All are much better overhead, faster and can take and lay a tackle. Rotham is another.
Can you then explain why his clearances out of the defensive 50 have dramatically increased and is on par with most of the defenders and his inside 50’s have declined
His possession count is also on par with most of the defenders
What does tis tell you
Also note that apart from this, he has a secondary role in gut running to occupy space and deterring the opposition the use of that space
That role results in very few possessions but is integral to WCE central game plan.
 
Aug 14, 2004
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We don’t have any though. Brayshaw?

Sponsorship aside, Ah Chee comes to mind as the natural option here - yet he isn't even listed among the emergencies.

I would have preferred Brayshaw and his inside mongrel over Brander for this match, but it's kids to the wolves either way.

It will be uncomfortable watching Constable get the better of 30 possessions on Sunday whilst Ainsworth struggles to get 20 for the Beagles.
 
Jul 26, 2007
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Can you then explain why his clearances out of the defensive 50 have dramatically increased and is on par with most of the defenders and his inside 50’s have declined
His possession count is also on par with most of the defenders
What does tis tell you
Also note that apart from this, he has a secondary role in gut running to occupy space and deterring the opposition the use of that space
That role results in very few possessions but is integral to WCE central game plan.

Didnt I just do that?

I get that his role may have changed for some reason.

As I clearly stated if he is now a defensive winger playing this new role then IMO he is not as well suited to the role than others on our list. Masten is an endurance player and that is his one strength he has over most. However this new role sounds like less running is required than being a link player between the backline and forward line. Block space, cover the the space behind the other attacking winger, provide a switch option.

I like how you totally ignored the point about others being far better equiped to play this role you described. It sounds like a perfect role for Duggan who is excellent over head, an excellect reader of play and interceptor. He can also lay a tackle and a bump.

Likewise from reports Watson is a pretty special player across half back and defensively. Serious pace, good height and can chase and tackle like a demon. Can get the ball and rebound. IMO this role would be great for Nelson, not too close to goals, pace, size, good over head and hard.

Then we have Rotham as well.

Why are you refusing to discuss other younger players who are better equiped to play this defensive role?
 

LittleGreekGod

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Didnt I just do that?

I get that his role may have changed for some reason.

As I clearly stated if he is now a defensive winger playing this new role then IMO he is not as well suited to the role than others on our list. Masten is an endurance player and that is his one strength he has over most. However this new role sounds like less running is required than being a link player between the backline and forward line. Block space, cover the the space behind the other attacking winger, provide a switch option.

I like how you totally ignored the point about others being far better equiped to play this role you described. It sounds like a perfect role for Duggan who is excellent over head, an excellect reader of play and interceptor. He can also lay a tackle and a bump.

Likewise from reports Watson is a pretty special player across half back and defensively. Serious pace, good height and can chase and tackle like a demon. Can get the ball and rebound. IMO this role would be great for Nelson, not too close to goals, pace, size, good over head and hard.

Then we have Rotham as well.

Why are you refusing to discuss other younger players who are better equiped to play this defensive role?
Not ignoring but just think it ridiculous to assume that those players you mentioned have anywhere near the running capacity of Masten
Also despite your criticism of Madtens kicking skills he maintains an average of 80% DE
His role is not one of an intercept player or mark as you suggested but to occupy space to discourage the opposition in the use of this space
The coaches and his fellow players understand his role but it appears that some on here don’t
Pure stat watchers can never make a true accessment of of a players role unless they understand exactly what the MC expects of them
 
Jan 9, 2013
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Can you then explain why his clearances out of the defensive 50 have dramatically increased and is on par with most of the defenders and his inside 50’s have declined
His possession count is also on par with most of the defenders
What does tis tell you
Also note that apart from this, he has a secondary role in gut running to occupy space and deterring the opposition the use of that space
That role results in very few possessions but is integral to WCE central game plan.

Didnt I just do that?

I get that his role may have changed for some reason.

As I clearly stated if he is now a defensive winger playing this new role then IMO he is not as well suited to the role than others on our list. Masten is an endurance player and that is his one strength he has over most. However this new role sounds like less running is required than being a link player between the backline and forward line. Block space, cover the the space behind the other attacking winger, provide a switch option.

I like how you totally ignored the point about others being far better equiped to play this role you described. It sounds like a perfect role for Duggan who is excellent over head, an excellect reader of play and interceptor. He can also lay a tackle and a bump.

Likewise from reports Watson is a pretty special player across half back and defensively. Serious pace, good height and can chase and tackle like a demon. Can get the ball and rebound. IMO this role would be great for Nelson, not too close to goals, pace, size, good over head and hard.

Then we have Rotham as well.

Why are you refusing to discuss other younger players who are better equiped to play this defensive role?

The frustrating thing about Masten for me is not his reduced number of possessions, it is his consistently questionable ball use. All too often, apart from the odd dart into the forward line (which proves he can be a really good kick) he chooses bad options or executes skill errors - resulting in either direct turnovers or increased pressure on team mates, causing them to turn the ball over.

The 80% KE, (Masten's was listed as 67% last week) loses credibility when our players have been passing the ball around the backline in dinky little kicks. I am sure most of their stats would be up in that respect. Another interesting stat, seeing as we are using stats... 4 of Masten's 15 possessions last week were recorded as clangers.

There is the case of players employing those 1m hand passes to someone about to be tackled, which may register as an effective possession because it reached it's target, albeit bad ball use.
 
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LittleGreekGod

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Dec 24, 2015
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The frustrating thing about Masten for me is not his reduced number of possessions, it is his consistently questionable ball use. All too often, apart from the odd dart into the forward line (which proves he can be a really good kick) he chooses bad options or executes skill errors - resulting in either direct turnovers or increased pressure on team mates, causing them to turn the ball over.
This is a misnomer
Mastens ball use is up with all the defenders with a DE of 80%+ and far in excess of the DE of our midfielders
 
When was the last time any of us, other than Thorne had Marsden in our best players?


Also, did Ah Chees AFL career effectively end when he got injured on the eve of the season last year? Has he strung 2 games together in a row?

Big sliding doors moment considering it was Marsden who came out of absolutely nowhere to get a round 1 birth and do the minimum required to keep his spot all year.
 

FKASC

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May 28, 2017
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Sponsorship aside, Ah Chee comes to mind as the natural option here - yet he isn't even listed among the emergencies.

I would have preferred Brayshaw and his inside mongrel over Brander for this match, but it's kids to the wolves either way.

It will be uncomfortable watching Constable get the better of 30 possessions on Sunday whilst Ainsworth struggles to get 20 for the Beagles.
I doubt Constable will get 30, but yeah I agree
 
Jul 26, 2007
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Not ignoring but just think it ridiculous to assume that those players you mentioned have anywhere near the running capacity of Masten
Also despite your criticism of Madtens kicking skills he maintains an average of 80% DE
His role is not one of an intercept player or mark as you suggested but to occupy space to discourage the opposition in the use of this space
The coaches and his fellow players understand his role but it appears that some on here don’t
Pure stat watchers can never make a true accessment of of a players role unless they understand exactly what the MC expects of them

Firstly I didn't criticise his kicking skills, that must have been someone else. Playing this new role you described he should be kicking at 80% chipping it sideways across half back.

So he occupies space defensively but his role isn't to intercept poor kicks? OK.:think: So Masten is what a traffic cone a kick behind play?

He rolls back to cover Jettas man when Jetta rebounds, your words. Masten is not a great one on one defender, not fast, not great overhead, easily out muscled and rarely lays a tackle. Duggan, Watson, Rotham and Nelson all do that better.

So again the only strength Masten has is running ability / endurance. But you don't need that as much playing a semi loose defensive roll behind play / across half back. You aren't required to power run back and forth up and down the wings. You are describing his role as a loose defender / mid a kick behind play. Again that role can be played by someone with better attributes and skill set. Its actually a perfect role or Hurn as he gets a bit older and a bit slower. Rotham takes the one on one defensive role and Hurn can play loose a kick behind play, much better set up.

As I will keep saying this new role YOU are describing actually doesn't suit Mastens skill set, he isn't a loose defender he's a hard running winger who accumulates uncontested possessions and provides a link between the backline and forwards. There are others who would be much, much better at defending. That's my point. :thumbsu:
 
Jul 26, 2007
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Lel

In terms of maintaining a successful side once Shuey and Redden retire or start to break down.

We have very little else in the cupboard when it comes to on-ballers

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We have a plan.:thumbsu:
 

End Game

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Sep 9, 2018
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Did you read the second part of my post?
Love reading all the stuff on Masto, particularly from HT, I reckon the umps are in on the gag as well. The amount of times he gets pinged for holding the ball even when he isn't is hilarious. Which one of you is an AFL ump ?
 

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