Unofficial Preview Changes Round 12 vs Brisbane

[Dogsman16]

It's not just the height, it's the ability of a tall player being there to take a contested mark. Yes, the players you've listed are all over 190cm - none of them has a noted aptitude for taking contested marks as a key forward target. And based on last week's game, we constantly bomb the ball into the forward line - is that players getting it wrong week after week after week, or are they kicking to some mythical contested marking forward?

We have two talls on our list, of genuine KP height (mid 190s+) who have shown they can take a contested mark in F50 with at least some consistency - neither of them are in the selected team.

I agree with this, we just need a get out option that we can kick long and have confidence that he is a good chance at marking. Williams certainly isn't, Bontempelli isn't (and is only 18, cannot be expecting him as a young inside mid to be also providing a forward target) Crameri is decent one on one and good at ground level but hes not really the jumping over the pack type and Grant hasnt got the frame for those strong contested marks and plays like a medium forward.

My preference for the 2nd half of the season is to see 4 talls/tall medium forwards with a choice from these 5 players (Jones, Crameri, Grant, Stringer, Redpath) and complement these 4 with a mix of Dahlhaus, Hunter, Hrovat, Gia and resting forwards etc. Grant & Crameri the leadup half forwards if we have Jones and Stringer deeper/ or Jones and Crameri as the lead up CHF's and Redpath and Grant closer to goal. Picking 4 of these talls also gives us extra coverage down back if Minno goes down and say Roughy has to end up in the ruck/ or if we need an extra tall defender. That way Stringer picks up the 3rd tall forward ( or can give small bursts at the centre bounce) and yet we still have 3 tall forwards.

 

[Zgope1]

Tom Campbell.

Bontempelli is a tall midfielder in his first year, and has no weight to use in marking contests. You yourself said in an earlier post people get hung up on height - he is not a KPF.

Late last season, when Grant was on fire, he fed off Campbell's work in the air, and Campbell fired out handballs from contests to Grant. Having a Campbell/Jones (hell even Cordy) there, allows Grant more space, plus Crameri is there as well. It was no coincidence that Grant played better with a tall marking target to take the heat.

Yes, we played cohesive footy last week - until we got it to F50, and often kicked high to no-one, or no-one with any ability to take a mark. If we control the contest again but waste that advantage blazing away into F50, we will lose to Brisbane. And if we lose to Brisbane at Etihad, the coaching thread will go into meltdown - and rightly so.

Sadly Campbell hasn't recaptured his form at afl level for us this year. So often do people forget. He wasn't anymore effective as the marking target against Adelaide or West Coast this year as we had from the contests Williams, Crameri and Bontempelli made last week.

Re: Bonts, yep he's not a true kpf right now but there was a clear direction from the club that he present last week. he didn't do it incredibly well but while people trot out the development line for all our other key talls there's nothing wrong with trying to get an aerial contribution from players like he, Grant, Williams and Crameri. These sorts of roles will be really important for Bonts early in his career as players need to be encouraged early to use their size.

Last week we kicked high to no one because there was considerable pressure on the ball carrier at all times. We didn't work them out well enough and when we did we missed the shots or we stupidly took advantage.

Yes if we lose to brisbane the board will go into melt down, and if we beat them- and we probably will, you won't hear a peep from all these people complaining about it.

If i had it my way i'd have Jones in for Williams because he's more of a key forward but the club's obviously working hard with Williams in his new position. We'll see how it works out but i genuinely think Jones'll find his way in and missing this week won't spell the end of his career development wise.

So basically my point is, we won't have a problem making a contest. We get little from our other marking targets anyway and i think we'll get plenty from these medium tall forwards because they're the better footy players and will expose their mismatches.

 

[Igloo]

The height is fine. If anything, Brisbane are too tall in defence. Patfull, Gardiner, Clarke and Maguire isn't going to be able to go with our shorter, quicker forward line as well as they'd like. We just have to be smart about our entries.

 

[ivan rassmussen]

Sadly Campbell hasn't recaptured his form at afl level for us this year. So often do people forget. He wasn't anymore effective as the marking target against Adelaide or West Coast this year as we had from the contests Williams, Crameri and Bontempelli made last week.

Re: Bonts, yep he's not a true kpf right now but there was a clear direction from the club that he present last week. he didn't do it incredibly well but while people trot out the development line for all our other key talls there's nothing wrong with trying to get an aerial contribution from players like he, Grant, Williams and Crameri. These sorts of roles will be really important for Bonts early in his career as players need to be encouraged early to use their size.

Last week we kicked high to no one because there was considerable pressure on the ball carrier at all times. We didn't work them out well enough and when we did we missed the shots or we stupidly took advantage.

Yes if we lose to brisbane the board will go into melt down, and if we beat them- and we probably will, you won't hear a peep from all these people complaining about it.

If i had it my way i'd have Jones in for Williams because he's more of a key forward but the club's obviously working hard with Williams in his new position. We'll see how it works out but i genuinely think Jones'll find his way in and missing this week won't spell the end of his career development wise.

So basically my point is, we won't have a problem making a contest. We get little from our other marking targets anyway and i think we'll get plenty from these medium tall forwards because they're the better footy players and will expose their mismatches.

Okay, we will have to agree to disagree on some of your points, although I don't vehemently disagree, more just a different view of similar issues.

However, while I will concede that Freo pressured the ball carrier a lot last week, we had entries early in the game when we were dominating possession and ball movement where the kicker into the F50 had time to look for options/lower their eyes/whatever, and yet still kicked to a marking contest, or worse picked out Freo's loose defender in space.

We need to limit crowding in our F50 (another bugbear of mine related to slow ball movement through the middle allowing defences to clog up our F50, but that's a whole separate issue), but we also need our forwards to isolate their own opponent. A tall marking forward near or in the square and spread amongst the others creates that space, and limits the ability of third-man up, etc. The positioning of a player who can take a contested mark in a forward line affects the dynamics of the defence as much as our attack.

And even if we win, but in a struggle because our forward line is again dysfunctional, there will be no credits there for the coach - and whilst I'm still on my fence for the moment on the coach, (and it's a nice solid bluestone structure), I'm on the lookout for tools to start removing the mortar, just in case I need to start dismantling it in 10 or so weeks.

 

[Sharkey66]

Just on Williams, as much as i like the guy, he is out of form, out of confidence and a long way off the pace of the game. Now there is a good chance that if he gets some continuity in his game, these things will come back to him and he will become a very serviceable if not very good player.
But, at the moment he is a liability in the AFL team, The place to regain his touch, fitness, confidence etc, is in the VFL side that we created this year for just this purpose. Dont forget, that like Cordy, Cambell and Redpath, he is still learning how to be a forward. He has played, what, 8 or 9 full games as a forward?
Needs to go back to Footscray until he is absolutely killing it there.

 

[BEaston]

Yes, we played cohesive footy last week - until we got it to F50, and often kicked high to no-one, or no-one with any ability to take a mark. If we control the contest again but waste that advantage blazing away into F50, we will lose to Brisbane.

So is this more of an indictment on the forwards or the mids? Having some monster that can take contested marks wouldn't have done much last week as the Freo flood had all of our forwards well outnumbered anyway. The delivery into the forward line let us down more than the forwards not being able to take a contested grab. This week we see the inclusion of Grant who has a good ability to find space and run to the right places. The onus this week should be on the midfielders and their delivery going forward. They need to lower their eyes and deliver well.

 

[Oor Wally]

In: Grant

Out: Roberts

Well done!

 

[inyourfacedunk]

Just on Williams, as much as i like the guy, he is out of form, out of confidence and a long way off the pace of the game. Now there is a good chance that if he gets some continuity in his game, these things will come back to him and he will become a very serviceable if not very good player.
But, at the moment he is a liability in the AFL team, The place to regain his touch, fitness, confidence etc, is in the VFL side that we created this year for just this purpose. Dont forget, that like Cordy, Cambell and Redpath, he is still learning how to be a forward. He has played, what, 8 or 9 full games as a forward?
Needs to go back to Footscray until he is absolutely killing it there.

Nek minit he kicks 3 goals.
I think he stays in.

He did provide a contest last week, although he never really won a contest. Mostly 50/50. His height and ability to run is something that is required at the moment.
The only thing missing from his game right now (in my opinion) is taking a few marks or at the very least making sure the ball drops to the teams advantage when he does contest the footy.

All he needs to do is take a couple of marks in front of goals. Easier said than done, but the way he attacked the packs last week tells me he knows this and it shouldn't be long until he clunks a few.

 

[House_of_Dahl]

A few people on here wanting Campbell (or Cordy) to be named so we have a bail out option. But it wouldn't surprise me if Macca is thinking "no effing way am I going to encourage the team to bomb it in long". Picking one of them would kinda be giving that message.

 

[Dogs_R_Us]

Brave selections by Bulldogs this week

Should we put in a young forward (Redpath / Cordy) to see if we can straighten up the side ? No we will name a slow inside mid (Stevens) who struggles to kick 35m, he can do that job

Should we persist with our young backs to give them much needed senior exlperience in their 3rd afl season (Talia and Roberts), no we will go with our usual under sized backline and hope for the best

I can't think of ANY alternative selections that would be more likely to deliver us a win. We are not losing because Bloggs or Whatsit aren't in the team! We are losing because the TEAM comes apart at the seams at vital stages of the games, and anyone with the ball in his hands can't kick a ruddy goal - Redpath (rookie ) and Cordy won't make the magic difference. If only. Perhaps the answer is Grant .

PS: Interesting that BF now has a crying emoticon . I plan to use it a lot .

 

[Next Waiting]

A few people on here wanting Campbell (or Cordy) to be named so we have a bail out option. But it wouldn't surprise me if Macca is thinking "no effing way am I going to encourage the team to bomb it in long". Picking one of them would kinda be giving that message.

I agree. I think that's a big part of the selection. Get the entries right regardless of who's in the forward line. It was the major difference between us and Freo going forward IMO, how we went inside 50 and the quality of the kicks going in there. Freo's kicks were beautifully weighted and placed for the forwards to run on to (most of the time), regardless of that forwards size. Our entries were mostly the opposite of that. High, slow and loopy giving the defence every possible chance to spoil. As you suggest, a tall bail out option might be too tempting and give little incentive to concentrate on the important side of entries.

 

[DexterTan]

Yes if we lose to brisbane the board will go into melt down, and if we beat them- and we probably will, you won't hear a peep from all these people complaining about it.

.

More likely the response will be "Yeah, we beat Brissy...but it's BRISBANE!"

 

[Next Waiting]

A few people on here wanting Campbell (or Cordy) to be named so we have a bail out option. But it wouldn't surprise me if Macca is thinking "no effing way am I going to encourage the team to bomb it in long". Picking one of them would kinda be giving that message.

On reflection it's probably the reason for Howard's selection on the wing. A good left kick on that side of the ground going inside 50. We are limited in options there. Smith is injured and I think McCrae's workload as well as the kick itself combine to make his entries a bit haphazard, especially as the game goes on and he fatigue's.
So Howard might pop up 5-8 times a game to deliver inside 50 from that wing and if he can reproduce his kick under pressure then it could be very useful. I do worry about what he'll do for the other 118 minutes though.

 

[Doggies_13]

The height is fine. If anything, Brisbane are too tall in defence. Patfull, Gardiner, Clarke and Maguire isn't going to be able to go with our shorter, quicker forward line as well as they'd like. We just have to be smart about our entries.

This is what happens every week and then that extra tall defender they have plays forward instead and we chuck one of our mid-tall forwards back to cover them all because we didn't select a balanced enough team to start with.

 

[ivan rassmussen]

On reflection it's probably the reason for Howard's selection on the wing. A good left kick on that side of the ground going inside 50. We are limited in options there. Smith is injured and I think McCrae's workload as well as the kick itself combine to make his entries a bit haphazard, especially as the game goes on and he fatigue's.
So Howard might pop up 5-8 times a game to deliver inside 50 from that wing and if he can reproduce his kick under pressure then it could be very useful. I do worry about what he'll do for the other 118 minutes though.

I wanted to see evidence of this last week, I really did. His first three or four kicks were average at best, did pass one later that looked ok. For several years now, some people have said he has the kick, just needs to address the rest of his game.

I think the kid tries, and I know he's had injuries, and supposedly personal issues if some posters are to be believed.

To me, he just looks like an average footballer, who seems unlikely to carve out an AFL career.

I will cheer for him when he plays, and I'd never abuse a player at a personal level at a game, or on this board, but I really just don't feel he's up to AFL standard.

If he proves me wrong, that's great, and I will congratulate him. I still can't see it though.

 

[Next Waiting]

I wanted to see evidence of this last week, I really did. His first three or four kicks were average at best, did pass one later that looked ok. For several years now, some people have said he has the kick, just needs to address the rest of his game.

I think the kid tries, and I know he's had injuries, and supposedly personal issues if some posters are to be believed.

To me, he just looks like an average footballer, who seems unlikely to carve out an AFL career.

I will cheer for him when he plays, and I'd never abuse a player at a personal level at a game, or on this board, but I really just don't feel he's up to AFL standard.

If he proves me wrong, that's great, and I will congratulate him. I still can't see it though.

We are in furious agreement.

 

[ivan rassmussen]

We are in furious agreement.

Excellent.

 

[Igloo]

This is what happens every week and then that extra tall defender they have plays forward instead and we chuck one of our mid-tall forwards back to cover them all because we didn't select a balanced enough team to start with.

Out of those 4, none have spent much time up forward at all. If they put Patfull or Maguire forward, they rob their backline of much needed experience, and puts them in a position they've rarely played. If they put Gardiner or Clarke up there, they aren't going to do much damage anyway, being incredibly inexperienced. It's different to more experienced teams doing it.

They've already got a backman come forward in Merrett down there to partner with Brown.

 

[staphy]

Just on Williams, as much as i like the guy, he is out of form,
.

At what stage was he ever in form

 

[Testekill]

The only thing that I'm begging for this weekend (outside of winning of course) is that we move the ball into our forward line low and fast.

 

[ivan rassmussen]

The only thing that I'm begging for this weekend (outside of winning of course) is that we move the ball into our forward line low and fast.

Do you mean just once, or on a regular basis?

 

[TheHoneyBadger]

The only thing that I'm begging for this weekend (outside of winning of course) is that we move the ball into our forward line low and fast.

As in out to the forwards on the lead instead of kicking to 2 on 1 marking contests? Stop speaking such sense.

 

[VitalDread]

Clay Smith and Josh Prudden are at the social club this week

 

[VitalDread]

 

[VitalDread]

Wallis!
Get around him.