Changes v Brisbane

[marty36]

So your saying if you're playing but carrying an injury you will have no diminished output?

If your carrying an injury that forces you from taking the feild you are correct, everyone that has ever played footy has carried injuries and output has been no different, Danger would have been carrying that back last year and won the browlow, Macca carried hsi knee his entire career. Little niggles or injuries which hurt but not obvioulsy enough so that you are still taking to the ground are irrelevant

If any player or supporter or Coach uses them as an excuse the player shouldnt be on the ground, hate BS excuses

 

[Elite Crow]

If your carrying an injury that forces you from taking the feild you are correct, everyone that has ever played footy has carried injuries and output has been no different, Danger would have been carrying that back last year and won the browlow, Macca carried hsi knee his entire career. Little niggles or injuries which hurt but not obvioulsy enough so that you are still taking to the ground are irrelevant

If any player or supporter or Coach uses them as an excuse the player shouldnt be on the ground, hate BS excuses

Danger got hit in the ribs this year and hasn't missed a game, his output has dropped.

Ablett over recent years has played with sore shoulders and his output has dropped.

Jenkins went into the finals last year with a dodgy ankle and his output dropped.

Luke Brown was having a good year last year, hurt his groin and his his form was ordinary for the rest of the year and then had groin surgery. His year this year has been better.

Even Roo, he went into the 2007 final against Hawks injured and played shit.

History is littered with players playing injured and their performance has dropped.

 

[1970crow]

I do if one is to be selected...I think a lot are misjudging Pykey's footy I.Q. suggesting Thommo gets a call up....And I'll join that throng if Thommo plays.

I agree, but it's a pretty easy call. The test will be if Greenwood only picks up high teens touches and Thommo racks up 25 in the SANFL. Will they have the strength to persist with Greenwood for 2-3 more weeks to see if he adjusts and becomes a genuine asset in the midfield rotation.

 

[marty36]

Danger got hit in the ribs this year and hasn't missed a game, his output has dropped.

Ablett over recent years has played with sore shoulders and his output has dropped.

Jenkins went into the finals last year with a dodgy ankle and his output dropped.

Luke Brown was having a good year last year, hurt his groin and his his form was ordinary for the rest of the year and then had groin surgery. His year this year has been better.

Even Roo, he went into the 2007 final against Hawks injured and played shit.

History is littered with players playing injured and their performance has dropped.

Then what does that tell you about selection???????????

 

[1970crow]

That's one play, how many times did he do that?

100% of his opportunities to do so.

 

[Elite Crow]

Then what does that tell you about selection???????????

That's a completely different argument, I believe you shouldn't play injured players and if Cameron is injured which I think he is, he should be rested.

Last year we made the mistake of playing injured players and this hurt us in the end when our depth wasn't tested and we couldn't bring anyone up.

 

[Elite Crow]

100% of his opportunities to do so.

So you think the club has voluntarily decided not to play him in the role he excelled at in the first 3 rounds?

 

[1970crow]

Have you forgotten the infamous Van Berlo inclusion from last year ?

History will repeat itself

Who was upgraded for that? Wigg was travelling emergency and he wasn't off the rookie list. Plus, VB was genuinely the next medium/small half back flanker up and was off a full preseason. Wigg was playing as an inside mid, bit in the back half. I have as little trust as most that we can make the right decisions when it comes to working towards a future, but I'm quietly confident that Thommo has at least 1 more week in the SANFL. But I won't be surprised to see him with 22 touches, named our best and an article written somewhere about how brilliant his leadership was, despite us losing miserably again.

 

[Scrotes2000]

Rewatched the game in triple speed (fast forward) and it's obvious our game plan needs tweaking.

Highly recommend watching games like that if you want to see the forest from the trees. Although I'm sure most of you could see it anyway.

I don't think we're going to be able to turn ourselves into an unsociable gang - we just don't have the personalities. Can we be harder? Absolutely, we need to be.

Pyke needs to start adapting - he's got a decent sample size now.

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[Scrotes2000]

Rewatched the game in triple speed (fast forward) and it's obvious our game plan needs tweaking.

Highly recommend watching games like that if you want to see the forest from the trees. Although I'm sure most of you could see it anyway.

I don't think we're going to be able to turn ourselves into an unsociable gang - we just don't have the personalities. Can we be harder? Absolutely, we need to be.

Pyke needs to start adapting - he's got a decent sample size now.


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[1970crow]

You are totally forgetting how soft arse we were do we have any players that have some grunt maybe they will try and develop Hampton into that role it might take a few course of juice to give him some size and maybe aggression


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You're focusing entirely on Thommo's physique and the size of his biceps. But you know that little power comes from big biceps. Thommo gives us nothing because he's incapable of running hard all day and he has lost whatever acceleration he had. He's a witches hat that pushes an opponent before the ball up and if Sauce doesn't hit it straight to him, then he's a pure liability.

 

[marty36]

That's a completely different argument, I believe you shouldn't play injured players and if Cameron is injured which I think he is, he should be rested.

Last year we made the mistake of playing injured players and this hurt us in the end when our depth wasn't tested and we couldn't bring anyone up.

This is where the BS excuses are being made up by supporters

The club will not and I repeat will not pick players that are injured and not capable of playing where the team will be affected and disadvantaged

I am yet to see the coaches or club confirm they are picking players like this and will contiune to say they will not

And unless you have a tin foil hat on and believe in copnspiracy theories there is nothing to suggest otherwise

Or are you saying the club is picking players who are injured at the risk of disadvantaging the team and becoming a liability, like I said players will play injured but not to the affect it will disadvantage the team

 

[marty36]

You're focusing entirely on Thommo's physique and the size of his biceps. But you know that little power comes from big biceps. Thommo gives us nothing because he's incapable of running hard all day and he has lost whatever acceleration he had. He's a witches hat that pushes an opponent before the ball up and if Sauce doesn't hit it straight to him, then he's a pure liability.

Im looking at Thommo's strenght and know how he would have handled Viney in close or put a hard tackle or bump on Bernie Vince in close to make way for someone like Sloane or Crouch, even Eddie Betts said we were soft FFS

 

[1970crow]

So you think the club has voluntarily decided not to play him in the role he excelled at in the first 3 rounds?

Yes I do. Better that than drop Otto after all the positive press and his successful return after 1000 days or whatever. Or instead of JJ's fitness test being a few side on bumps that were fully expected and he's fully protected himself followed by the key test, "lift up one of your arms if you want to play AFL this week" he was actually forced to prove himself in the SANFL. That's our club, that's our selection culture and Pyke doesn't look an agent of change thus far.

 

[Geoffa32]

The club seem to have identified the softness issue.

Now time to implement it.


Time to walk the talk.

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[1970crow]

Wouldn't be surprised if there's a few whispers coming from the Thommo camp regarding him being in the selection mix. They used the media at every opportunity last year, there was no team first mantra from them with regards to getting an extra year. Plus there'd be no doubt the dynamic duo of midfield coaching would be pushing hard to get him in and retain Mackay. Then there's Don's statement last year that, "you reward players who have done good things for your club over a long period of time" prior to the Gold Coast game. Which I mistook for keeping Plodder Mackay in the side, not the return of NVB. Still, I'm quietly confident it'll be at least another week, if at all, but there would no doubt be immense momentum towards Thommo's return.

 

[marty36]

The club seem to have identified the softness issue.

Now time to implement it.


Time to walk the talk.

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

Im keen to see how they will implement it

I would think harder mature players, it s a pity Cheney is injured he fits the solution so does Thommo but I will even admit that is one huge risk but is it one worth taking?

The fact evey other club is going to get more physical with us means we cant hide from it, weak clubs it wont matter with, but mid road or strong clubs it will.

 

[Vhaluus]

Wouldn't be surprised if there's a few whispers coming from the Thommo camp regarding him being in the selection mix. They used the media at every opportunity last year, there was no team first mantra from them with regards to getting an extra year. Plus there'd be no doubt the dynamic duo of midfield coaching would be pushing hard to get him in and retain Mackay. Then there's Don's statement last year that, "you reward players who have done good things for your club over a long period of time" prior to the Gold Coast game. Which I mistook for keeping Plodder Mackay in the side, not the return of NVB. Still, I'm quietly confident it'll be at least another week, if at all, but there would no doubt be immense momentum towards Thommo's return.

**** I forgot Don saying that and it's ridiculously damning.

Getting picked in the 22 isn't a reward, it's something you have to EARN, week in, week out.

That just summarizes our selection policy so perfectly. I bet a lot of our players would go harder if they weren't so sure they were going to be rewarded with yet another senior game no matter what they do. Bevo got this right at the Bulldogs and I think it was a big part of their success, he didn't give a **** what your name was or what you'd done.. if you weren't performing right now, you're out.

 

[n4sir]

Who was upgraded for that? Wigg was travelling emergency and he wasn't off the rookie list.

Wigg was our second round pick of his draft (ahead of Caleb Daniel - ouch!), never on the rookie list to be elevated.

 

[Cap]

I can recall the same things being said about protecting Dangerfield. so clearly the club hasn't learnt.

 

[Elite Crow]

This is where the BS excuses are being made up by supporters

The club will not and I repeat will not pick players that are injured and not capable of playing where the team will be affected and disadvantaged

I am yet to see the coaches or club confirm they are picking players like this and will contiune to say they will not

And unless you have a tin foil hat on and believe in copnspiracy theories there is nothing to suggest otherwise

Or are you saying the club is picking players who are injured at the risk of disadvantaging the team and becoming a liability, like I said players will play injured but not to the affect it will disadvantage the team

You're not serious are you?

I've just given you a few examples, Danger even said the other day he was playing sore. Do you thinks it's a coincidence his form has just dropped off after receiving consecutive hits to the ribs?

Did you watch Roo in the 2007 Hawks final after going into the game under an injury cloud?

Why did we play Jenkins late last year when he had hurt his ankle?

Some clubs form a view that the output of a quality player even with an injury will be better than a lesser player. I'm pretty sure Choco even said it.

 

[Elite Crow]

Yes I do. Better that than drop Otto after all the positive press and his successful return after 1000 days or whatever. Or instead of JJ's fitness test being a few side on bumps that were fully expected and he's fully protected himself followed by the key test, "lift up one of your arms if you want to play AFL this week" he was actually forced to prove himself in the SANFL. That's our club, that's our selection culture and Pyke doesn't look an agent of change thus far.

Otten played in defence on the weekend, why didn't we move Charlie up the ground?

 

[FantasticShirt]

Im looking at Thommo's strenght and know how he would have handled Viney in close or put a hard tackle or bump on Bernie Vince in close to make way for someone like Sloane or Crouch, even Eddie Betts said we were soft FFS

It's frustrating but I entirely agree. Thompson would've been a liability around the ground but he would've put some serious blocks on and help negate the Viney/Vince style tactics.

The issue is that he's not best 22 anymore, he's lost another yard of pace (when he didn't have much more to lose) and doesn't have the evasiveness or foot skills of other older mids like Mitchell, Hodge, Burgoyne etc.

Could we have used him on the weekend? Absolutely. Should he be picked? Absolutely not.

The Crouch brothers have some serious mongrel in them. But Brad is just fighting to stay fit and regain form, and appears to be overly focused on his own game rather than the teams. Matt is a see ball, get ball type player and just keeps battling his ass off trying to win. Rather than picking Thompson they'd be better off helping these guys to put the team first and not try win the ball themselves at all cost.

 

[n4sir]

I get the feeling if Thompson is brought in it will be a further step backwards - prior to the last two weeks when we were running so strong I actually entertained the thought of this as a farewell game for him (and to give sore players like Sloane a rest), but our alarming drop in form means we not in a position to gift anyone anything.

There are lots of little differences to the beginning of the year - at the start of a game McKay spent a good deal of time on the bench, by the time he came on a lot of the initial heat and heavy bodywork had settled down - when he spends more time out there, especially early on and when it gets really physical, he looks way out of his depth. His drop off from the first few games (after he kicked those three goals against Hawthorn I was prompted to say who is this new David Mckay?) is pretty damning, I guess his critics will say we all knew this was coming - its pretty clear he has to be managed or dropped, and given that he is a senior player who should really be better, I lean to the latter.

This maybe a thought way outside the norm, but I am beginning to think that Brad Crouch could be better suited to an outside role? After many years his erratic disposal under pressure still shits me to tears, when he is in space his composure seems much more assured - then again, he is hardly alone in that department. He is not the quickest guy around, but he can gut run - when is fully fit. I still get the feeling we rushed him back way too early after two games of SANFL, Knight was injured but still, I would have liked to have at least another couple of high possession games there to earn his spot back in.

We are really unbalanced, over tall and slow with all of Otten, Jenkins, Walker, Talia & Hartigan in the side - ultimately they have to make a decision between Otten & Jenkins. I think Otten has been pretty lucky to be overlooked here for criticism compared to Walker and Jenkins - yes he's the feel good story of the year, but I think he is the weakest and slowest link of the group. If Jenkins is fit I would keep him in, but unfortunately our club has a history of persisting with injured players at our detriment...

Hartigan has struggled all year, and this has effected Talia - those two were so effective and read each other so well last year. Even from the first game against GWS Hartigan seemed to be running under the flight of the ball, and now he has troubles spoiling? It's a bizarre turnaround from his great form last year, I am seriously beginning to wonder if he needs his sight checked? Better be specsavers and not OPSM, we all know how good the umpires are with them

 

[Jack is Back]

There have been very few criticisms of our selection until last week and even then it was a marginal call regarding the 22nd play picked.

THE MAESTRO has had few options with a group of experienced players injured or not ready yet to play AFL (CEY, Seedsman, Cheney, Thompson). The most experienced player not used is Riley O'Brien who has played 2 games (posters who watch SANFL will confirm that Thommo is not ready and may never be ready to return).

Our KIDS (Gallucci, Poholke, Himmelberg, Signorello and Jarman) are not breaking the door down and Davis has been injured.

That leaves a group of developing players (Wigg, Beech, Doedee, Dear, Gore, Keath, Hunter and The MIGHTY THOR) and IMHO only The MIGHTY THOR is demanding to be selected although you can mount a case for Beech.

Excluding injured players and those coming back from injury, IMHO the players on the edge of selection are Mackay, Kelly, Otten, Menzel and Hampton. If Lever and Knight return this week then two of these players will miss out this week (Let's assume Menzel and Otten but you can make a case for any two of the five players to be dropped. Bringing in say Beech and The MIGHTY THOR will not greatly improve the team but it will give us more options if more players lose form or are injured.

As much as I would like to see Bran Nue Mackae providing run and carry against West Adelaide on Saturday it is very much a 50/50 call.