Opinion Changes v Essendon ins Neale, Shane, Collins, Rixx, Griff, DP

[Docker82]

It makes you wonder why Essn are finishing so strongly though.

Are they though?

Last four games

Beat NM by 27 - any team higher than about 12th should beat them easily
Lost to WB by 30 - Bulldogs have struggled all year
Beat Carlton by 8 - In the middle of the blues eight game losing streak
Lost to Adelaide by 43 - hammered by a good side
Beat GC by 27 - side full of kids was in it at half time

Beaten three bottom four sides and lost two other games. Wouldn't say many their best players ATM are those who were out last year either. Watson, Stanton, Hocking, Myers and Howlett look cooked, Bellchambers and Colyer have been in and out of the side. Heppell, Hurley and Hooker were absolute guns and still are. Elsewhere Ryder, Hibberd and Carlisle are doing well, Monfries and Crameri are really struggling, Melksham doing ok for Melksham. Mixed bag all round really when looking at players who had a year off.

 

[Mudd]

Jesus Christ that can't be used as an excuse to why he can't do the very basics week in week out at a senior level at the very least. He spent 2 years in the AFL system before having an entire year to himself to train and get his fitness up out of desperation to play for us. He had one on one training which is more effective than group training in some aspects. Also upon arrival he was cited as being "one of the hardest trainers" at the club before the 17' Season started. Not being a "developed player", "# Games played" and this make believe "body-building transitioning" doesn't excuse him from being trash and poorly skilled all year long.

What about every other player that debuted this year and last who isn't a "developed player". who doesn't have the "right body" and "hasn't been in the AFL system" for even 12 months and were thrown in the deep end but at least have been more serviceable to their club than McCarthy has been to us. I could name 10+ players easily that have performed better AND are working with less greater preparation than him.

It's time for this board to stop making excuses for McCarthy. The truth is he's a rubbish, inconsistent player who has a lot to work on. To defend him with that is simpleton and obvious thinking. His situation can rightly be compared to debutants, to LTI players and to the Essendon players. Maybe he's just a poorly skilled footballer right now and isn't "a natural player (Quoted by BF posters throughout 2016/2015)" . Maybe fitness isn't the issue and he needed his confidence and skills developed in the seconds for JUST ONE MONTH. Although people don't want to think of that.

Are you telling me a player needs more than 21 games and 3 years in the system to have any kind of confidence or know how to take a chest mark?

Keep in mind he was a non-factor in our good stretch bar one game and was THE major factor in a few of our losses. Even I thought at one stage that maybe, just maybe being out of the game for a year might of effected him more than others and that he might need a rest. After the bye round he loses us the Geelong game, after 2 weeks of suspension he then comes back and shows no tightening up or fixes in his own playing until he plays a team as dysfunctional as us in GCS.

The reality is I want McCarthy to come good although I don't think him having his hand held by the club and being wrongfully backed in for the amount of games he was was the right way to go about his development as a player.

Has been shocking and any players "lack of experience / preparation" can't be used as the excuse. It's a real shame it took this long for him to be dropped.

He's done for the year so I'm done talking about him until next season.

This post gets interesting if you substitute the word McCarthy with Taberner...

 

[meima]

This post gets interesting if you substitute the word McCarthy with Taberner...

Or Kersten

 

[Lance Uppercut]

...and a year of drug assisted gains

yeah I'm sure that 6 month period of using recovery assistance drugs 5 years ago is key in the players being in form this year, sound real legit

 

[Taylor]

yeah I'm sure that 6 month period of using recovery assistance drugs 5 years ago is key in the players being in form this year, sound real legit

It absolutely does. Recovery is the hurdle that limits physical cap, once you raise that level your body conditions for it and you can train at a higher level as long as you keep training. We are talking a game of % here.

I'm on record here saying that players found guilty of drug cheating should be confined to their beds for a month to cancel the effect.

A different but similar boost could be seen in 15/16 year old boys who have an offseason on the juice to boost their physical ability, put on size and strength. They stop taking the steroids but the muscle doesn't all fall back to previous levels, they maintain an improvement which they exploit against the clean competition.

 

[Lance Uppercut]

It absolutely does. Recovery is the hurdle that limits physical cap, once you raise that level your body conditions for it and you can train at a higher level as long as you keep training. We are talking a game of % here.

I would love for you to provide even a shred of proof for that assertion but somehow I don't think I should hold my breath

 

[Taylor]

I would love for you to provide even a shred of proof for that assertion but somehow I don't think I should hold my breath

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/next/body/effects-performance-enhancing-drugs-may-last-decades/

There's one.

 

[Unique Name]

I would love for you to provide even a shred of proof for that assertion but somehow I don't think I should hold my breath

How on earth are you blokes still in so much denial! Let me guess Hird did nothing wrong. Lol

 

[Lance Uppercut]

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/next/body/effects-performance-enhancing-drugs-may-last-decades/

There's one.

I knew you'd come back with that article. Did you even read it?

It's about anabolic steroids. It has exactly zero relevance to anything to do with what Essendon did. It couldn't be more irrelevant

 

[Lance Uppercut]

How on earth are you blokes still in so much denial! Let me guess Hird did nothing wrong. Lol

ermahgerd you have to be kidding me. I'm not going to derail your thread with this s**t. I was simply having a conversation with Tayl0r about a point raised.
But do yourself a favour, seriously, and get some idea of what someone actually thinks before you make an assumption...

 

[Taylor]

I knew you'd come back with that article. Did you even read it?

It's about anabolic steroids. It has exactly zero relevance to anything to do with what Essendon did. It couldn't be more irrelevant

Mmhmm.

Anabolic steroids are beneficial in the recovery phase.

 

[Lance Uppercut]

Mmhmm.

Anabolic steroids are beneficial in the recovery phase.

and Essendon didn't take anabolic steroids. That's precisely my point. There has never even been the slightest suggestion that they did. TB4 (or more precisely TB-500) is a peptide fragment hormone. AOD 9604 is an anti-obesity drug. Both would help recovery which would boost performance in the short term, which is why they are banned, but it is an insanely long bow to suggest that any usage of these drugs would give you a life long performance boost.

You can't seriously be trying to say that anabolic steroids help in recovery therefore anything that helps in recovery gives the same long-term effects as anabolic steroids? Surely?

 

[Kram]

Who cares, Essendon served their time let's move on.

 

[Taylor]

You can't seriously be trying to say that anabolic steroids help in recovery therefore anything that helps in recovery gives the same long-term effects as anabolic steroids? Surely?

Considering the anabolic steroids themselves aren't what allows the muscles to "remember" the higher load, it is that the allow the recovery of the muscles faster that allows the training harder to remember the higher load then anything that enhances recovery will have that same effect.

That will range from ice baths all the way to testosterone boosting peptides. The body being taken to a new high is the key.

 

[Lach72]

How abut you guys piss off with this s**t.
It was bad enough the first time

 

[Lance Uppercut]

Considering the anabolic steroids themselves aren't what allows the muscles to "remember" the higher load, it is that the allow the recovery of the muscles faster that allows the training harder to remember the higher load then anything that enhances recovery will have that same effect.

That will range from ice baths all the way to testosterone boosting peptides. The body being taken to a new high is the key.

once again, neither TB4 or AOD increase muscle gain, so your contention around muscle memory is just spurious. You may as well complain about the program of whey extract that any club would have. Or, as you say, ban the ice bath.

Anyway, I'm clearly not going to change your mind and only succeed in boring everyone stupid so I'll quit while I'm ahead and we can agree to disagree

 

[freo1997]

Who cares, Essendon served their time let's move on.

Absolutely. Personally I hope they do well this finals series. Worsfold has been brilliant for the bombers.

 

[Belnakor]

Who cares, Essendon served their time let's move on.

once a cheat always a cheat. Best predictor of future behaviour is past behaviour.

 

[freoextra]

Sutcliffe is playing on Sunday going by the 100 game special on the Freo site. So perhaps just Griff, Neale and Kersten in, pity, I wanted to see if Sheridan has improved his effort after a few good weeks at Peel, I might be the only one though!!

 

[apuchar]

Midfielder Lachie Neale headlines five inclusions for Fremantle as they take on Essendon on Sunday at Etihad Stadium.

After playing 20 games so far in 2017, Neale is looking to make his return after a week on the sidelines with knee and groin soreness.

Shane Kersten, Sam Collins, Tommy Sheridan and Jon Griffin have been called into the final 22.

As the lone specialist ruckman in Freo’s squad, Griffin will play his seventh game of the season, coming in to replace the suspended Sean Darcy.

Kersten replaces the omitted Cam McCarthy up front. With 24 goals in 2017, the key forward needs two majors to overtake McCarthy as Fremantle’s leading goalkicker.

Collins and Sheridan come in to the side after impressive recent performances for Peel.

Josh Deluca and Griffin Logue have both been omitted but will join Danyle Pearce as emergencies.

 

[G Mus]

It's a joke Neale is playing, this club is run like crap. Will have another underdone preseason and carry niggles all year

 

[meima]

Poor Deluca , just warming the seat for Sheriden .

 

[Talking Dockers]

Can't see the logic in Suban playing in place of Logue who needs games into him. It is obvious that Kersten, McCarthy, Cox and Tabs can't all play in same side. I'd play McCarthy any day over Kersten whose last game(Swans) was just if not worse than McCathy's last week. Kersten would have been dropped if not for his groin injury last week.

So Nyhuis and Logue carry the can for our poor defensive effort last week.

 

[Deathly]

Neale mismanaged? Logue and Deluca out? Sheridan in and Sutcliffe keeps his spot?

Hope we lose by 104 again.

 

[freoextra]

Well, the two guys that had absolute howlers being Logue and McCarthy got dropped, so can't complain about that. Wanted to see if Sheridan and Collins have improved after their latest dropping so also ok with that. The only one you could argue is DeLuca who seemed to be more involved than some others but I have always felt he is a gonner at the end of the year and I guess they have seen enough, sadly for him.