Changes v Sydney

[Black 18]

If true that's a change from giving him every possible chance to get up. ie game day? Is there more to Lobsters injury?

Quad injury isn't it?

They can be a bugger to clear completely. You think you're close and they just keep hangin' around.

 

[RussellEbertHandball]

Can anybody tell me re this week and moving further into the year, is our forward line a problem with no key target, (i.e. Walker type) I guess if Lobbe plays Ryder will drop forward? then Butcher doesn't play? I though Pav last week was too big and strong, is a our forward line our achilies heel...

The dopey talk in the media and even by the odd person here that Ryder was exactly what we needed, was just that - dopey. If Roughead or Ryder were both available you'd pick Roughie 101 times out of 100 and go and find a couple of the best 23-27 year old state level ruckmen to help out Lobbe.

 

[RossFC]

Just heard on the radio that Lobbe is out. Mind you it was Nova so not sure that it is too reliable!

Damn you footy gods.

Ryder can't play the whole pre-season then as soon as he can play...Lobbe is out for possibly 2 games.

 

[JimmyBeerCans]

Lobbe will play Nova pfft

 

[RussellEbertHandball]

Just heard on the radio that Lobbe is out. Mind you it was Nova so not sure that it is too reliable!

FFS why is our recruiting and coaching panel so dead set against recruiting uninjured plug and play state league ruckmen for break in case emergency situation onto the rookie list??

 

[Seanybruz]

FFS why is our recruiting and coaching panel so dead set against recruiting uninjured plug and play state league ruckmen for break in case emergency situation onto the rookie list??

Reddens better than a break glass emergency state league ruckman even if he's only 3/4 fit, if we were coming up against West Coast or another club playing 2 genuine rucks he'd be a near certainty to play if Lobbe wasn't fit.

Sydney with only one genuine average ruck & Tippett to back up shouldn't be as big a disadvantage as it was against Freo, the main disappointment is that it means it's another week we can't play our ideal forward structure.

 

[RussellEbertHandball]

Reddens better than a break glass emergency state league ruckman even if he's only 3/4 fit, if we were coming up against West Coast or another club playing 2 genuine rucks he'd be a near certainty to play if Lobbe wasn't fit.

Sydney with only one genuine average ruck & Tippett to back up shouldn't be as big a disadvantage as it was against Freo, the main disappointment is that it means it's another week we can't play our ideal forward structure.

So we play 2 semi match fit players against a side we are 2-11 against since the flag. You need to maximize how many fit players you have to beat a hoodoo.

 

[Forzaport]

FFS why is our recruiting and coaching panel so dead set against recruiting uninjured plug and play state league ruckmen for break in case emergency situation onto the rookie list??

We should have a 4th ruckman on the list but it seems we're investing heavily in finding the next KPF which is arguably the greater need now.

 

[RussellEbertHandball]

We should have a 4th ruckman on the list but it seems we're investing heavily in finding the next KPF which is arguably the greater need now.

Not on our rookie list. We have 2 mature 6 foot defender defenders, a 6 foot young defender and a 5 foot 8 inch small forward and a mid sized forward from a TV show. No one can convince me we shouldnt have had a break in case of emergency state league 23-27 year old ruckmen given Ryder's issue re PED investigation, Redden's history and Frampton was a skinny kid who was years away from playing regularly. We would not even give Harvey a game to protect Lobbe for the finals. Its a dumb arsed mindset.

 

[Forzaport]

Not on our rookie list. We have 2 mature 6 foot defender defenders, a 6 foot young defender and a 5 foot 8 inch small forward and a mid sized forward from a TV show. No one can convince me we shouldnt have had a break in case of emergency state league 23-27 year old ruckmen given Ryder's issue re PED investigation, Redden's history and Frampton was a skinny kid who was years away from playing regularly. We would not even give Harvey a game to protect Lobbe for the finals. Its a dumb arsed mindset.

For sure, we could have delisted S.Gray or Russell and rookie listed a mature ruck. Even if we lost Lobbe for an extended period and Ryder was banned by ASADA, we'd rely on Redden and if Redden was unavailable, I'm still doubtful we'd play our emergency ruck. We barely played Renouf last year. We would persist with Trengove and Westhoff until one of our genuine rucks were ready to resume AFL duties.

 

[BrockBlitz]

For sure, we could have delisted S.Gray or Russell and rookie listed a mature ruck. Even if we lost Lobbe for an extended period and Ryder was banned by ASADA, we'd rely on Redden and if Redden was unavailable, I'm still doubtful we'd play our emergency ruck. We barely played Renouf last year. We would persist with Trengove and Westhoff until one of our genuine rucks were ready to resume AFL duties.

Indeed we would, but that would totally F*%K our structures. Jackson in the ruck leaves us vulnerable against the super tall forwards. Westy in the ruck means we have Butch and Sarge forward - and after the crying in the Butch thread it seems practically no one apart from me and El_Scorcho really want that . Hence REH's point about us needing a break the glass ruck.

 

[Long live PAFC]

FFS why is our recruiting and coaching panel so dead set against recruiting uninjured plug and play state league ruckmen for break in case emergency situation onto the rookie list??

I take your point but do you think they would fill a role or get selected?

Renouf was a premiership ruckman who was restricted by injuries but was never amazing but was certainly better than most state rucks. He got destroyed by Sandilands and had 3 touches to quarter time in his last game. Would a SANFL ruck do much better? Is there a point to playing a ruck who will get beaten every contest and may not give you much elsewhere around the ground? It might let us play Ryder up front but is that worth it?

Others may know more about rucking and may be able to give some good reasons as to why you would play such a ruck option.

 

[RussellEbertHandball]

I take your point but do you think they would fill a role or get selected?

Renouf was a premiership ruckman who was restricted by injuries but was never amazing but was certainly better than most state rucks. He got destroyed by Sandilands and had 3 touches to quarter time in his last game. Would a SANFL ruck do much better? Is there a point to playing a ruck who will get beaten every contest and may not give you much elsewhere around the ground? It might let us play Ryder up front but is that worth it?

Others may know more about rucking and may be able to give some good reasons as to why you would play such a ruck option.

Go back to that Freo game. He bashed and crashed Sandi for 3 quarters. Jacko pestered Kenny all week he could ruck all game to replace Lobbe. At 3/4 time Kenny said Jacko you've talked the talk all week lets see how good you are. So a fresh Jacko went up against a tired Sandi who had dominated Renouf but Renouf had done a job on him physically. Jacko then destroyed Sandi using his leap against a tired Sandi to get over the top of him in the Last quarter.

If Lobbe had of played I could have seen Lobbe doing the same and Ryder doing what Jacko did 11 months ago. A big lug like Baulderstone could have done the same job Renouf did and let Patty lead the charge in the last quarter.

 

[PatientMental]

Go back to that Freo game. He bashed and crashed Sandi for 3 quarters. Jacko pestered Kenny all week he could ruck all game to replace Lobbe. At 3/4 time Kenny said Jacko you've talked the talk all week lets see how good you are. So a fresh Jacko went up against a tired Sandi who had dominated Renouf but Renouf had done a job on him physically. Jacko then destroyed Sandi using his leap against a tired Sandi to get over the top of him in the Last quarter.

If Lobbe had of played I could have seen Lobbe doing the same and Ryder doing what Jacko did 11 months ago. A big lug like Baulderstone could have done the same job Renouf did and let Patty lead the charge in the last quarter.

We would have done this on Sunday if Carlile didn't get subbed. But he did so we had to restructure everything.

 

[Lawnchair Larry]

If no Lobbe, play Redden with Ryder.
John Butcher to the bench as sub.
If Redden blows up, Butcher to CHF and Ryder to ruck fulltime.

 

[RussellEbertHandball]

We would have done this on Sunday if Carlile didn't get subbed. But he did so we had to restructure everything.

But Ryder is a lot lighter than Renouf, Lobbe or even Baulderstone so he didnt physically rough up Sandi.

 

[chimmez]

But Ryder is a lot lighter than Renouf, Lobbe or even Baulderstone so he didnt physically rough up Sandi.

The issue is that you're never going to have the 'perfect' ruck setup against every opponent. I don't disagree that putting another ruck, especially on the rookie list, would have been somewhat beneficial, but the overall implications of having a Baulderstone-type player in our team would cripple our style of play.

The biggest advantage of the inclusion of Ryder was that he is an athletic ruck/resting forward. Lobbe is much the same in that he has a very large tank. Playing Renouf had much the same effect of somewhat ruing our fast-running style. And while I agree that Renouf 'did his job' against Fremantle last year, carrying a lumbering-type ruckman for three quarters before subbing them out, especially when there were so many PA players who had less than desirable pre-seasons, could have been a disaster had there been an injury.

 

[UrbanElectric]

Not particularly bothered about the Rucking against Sydney. It'll be great if Lobbe comes up, if not just Ryder will do.
I'm also not too bothered with the Neade/Young swap. If Neadey plays this week, I'm sure he'll play better than he did. Regardless who gets picked, I don't think it will be a huge bearing on how the game will pan out.

Monfries needs to play himself into form, at AFL or SANFL level. He can be a brilliant intuitive player, but runs hot and cold a bit.
He, Westhoff, Wingard and Hartlett's form over the course of the year will be the best indicator of how far we can go this season.

Krakouer is a no-no. He recently lost 30kgs, and struggled for fitness in the NAB Challenge games. He may have all the skills in the world, but needs time to get his fitness levels up to standard before he is considered.

 

[Long live PAFC]

Whilst I think Young should come in for Neade to give us another midfield rotation and allow Winguard/Gray some more time resting up front, what are people's thoughts on Clurey/O'Shea in for Butcher?

Then Trengrove to ruck or rest forward or drop back if we are being killed. Means Ryder can ruck but also have a good run in the forward line where he is needed. O'Shea can provide run and is a reasonable except mark and Clurey is developing in those areas.

 

[UrbanElectric]

Whilst I think Young should come in for Neade to give us another midfield rotation and allow Winguard/Gray some more time resting up front, what are people's thoughts on Clurey/O'Shea in for Butcher?

Then Trengrove to ruck or rest forward or drop back if we are being killed. Means Ryder can ruck but also have a good run in the forward line where he is needed. O'Shea can provide run and is a reasonable except mark and Clurey is developing in those areas.

If there is anything to learn from the Fremantle game... It's that if you have a chance to win the ruck contest decisively, you should.
If Lobbe can wear down Pyke and allow Ryder (and even Trengove) to get the jump and tap to advantage, it will save our mids a lot of unnecessary trouble battling Sydney's big mids for first touch.

O'Shea is an interesting thought, he has proven himself in some big games. Clurey though I don't think is anywhere near ready.

 

[davesnothere]

If no Lobbe, play Redden with Ryder.
John Butcher to the bench as sub.
If Redden blows up, Butcher to CHF and Ryder to ruck fulltime.

Way too early for Jarrod, two years out and we throw him in as a Hail Mary selection against the Swans could only end badly but a few games with the Magpies then testing the water could go a little better. 3 or 4 weeks maybe the difference between staying sound or us losing him. [emoji53]

 

[port always]

Out Butcher

In Redden

Query on sub....Monfries will play and Neade will be sub

 

[*PAF]

If true that's a change from giving him every possible chance to get up. ie game day? Is there more to Lobsters injury?

Well there is a Crow poster that could probably let us know more, however last time he posted on here, pre Freo game, many told him to **** off just because he is a Crow supporter.

 

[Forzaport]

Well there is a Crow poster that could probably let us know more, however last time he posted on here, pre Freo game, many told him to **** off just because he is a Crow supporter.

TheRoo32 I think it was. Was on the money.

 

[Chokito]

Anyone feel Impey or Whitey could be replaced by O'Shea for this game?

(Young + Lobbe in for Neade + Butch is practically a given)