Preview Changes vs Hawthorn, Rd 22, 2023

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geoffjennings79

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🤣 I was happy to take a bit writer's licence and ignore the context. I've had cause to question the virtue of at least one his parents over the course of the season but queen was better .....

As for the triple Brownlow medallist, there can't be too many so off to google search I trot.....

Some of the reporting will be under his birth name, but amongst several incidents, he dragged a policeman along the road after jamming his arm in the car driver's window whilst in drag. Not casting aspersions on his personal choices, and different era where the populace at large would have been far less understanding of private peccadilloes. Unfortunately his fear of exposure caused him to take actions which resulted in court appearances.
 

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Jul 5, 2004
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What will the defensive match ups be
Good question not sure of the answer.

We win picking 3 talls we go 7 and 7 with this structure, lose and it is 6 and 8.

Really hope it is the break even which will keep some posters here happy to 'prove' them right as we have a real opportunity this season particularly if we can finish 5th or 6th with a home final.

We are 5 and 2 when we go with only 2 talls so hope this was an anomaly.

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Aug 24, 2012
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Good question not sure of the answer.

We win picking 3 talls we go 7 and 7 with this structure, lose and it is 6 and 8.

Really hope it is the break even which will keep some posters here happy to 'prove' them right as we have a real opportunity this season particularly if we can finish 5th or 6th with a home final.

We are 5 and 2 when we go with only 2 talls so hope this was an anomaly.

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What are the seven games we've played with only two talls? I don't remember playing many more than a couple this season.

Or are you not counting O'Brien? That's a fair stretch.
 
Oct 12, 2012
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So annoyed about JJ. He’s becoming very important for us at half back. Really need him, Dale and Richards in the back 6 to finish the season.
Yeah he's a real cream on top player... Sorry we've milked this too far now, it's getting cheesy.
 
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What are the seven games we've played with only two talls? I don't remember playing many more than a couple this season.

Or are you not counting O'Brien? That's a fair stretch.
As long as you consider Bont a KPF when he plays forward then your comments are fair given there is a 1 cm difference and most KPF's are 5 to 15cms taller than O'Brien

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Libbaaaa

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Seems the logical move with Nash to Bont. It'll be interesting to see though. Can you even really tag Libba? He gets most of his touches with 3 guys hanging off him as it is.
If I recall Willam Drew did a number on him in the last round of 2021. Ken Hinkley in his wisdom then started Drew on the bench in the Prelim and Libba got the first clearance.
 

Optimistic Dog

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Arty selection is a strange one. He has the pace and skills we need but does not look ready this season.
 

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If I recall Willam Drew did a number on him in the last round of 2021. Ken Hinkley in his wisdom then started Drew on the bench in the Prelim and Libba got the first clearance.
That's how I recall it too. One of the worst tactical (non) decisions in a big game in my viewing history. Happy to be on the receiving end though.
 
Aug 24, 2012
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As long as you consider Bont a KPF when he plays forward then your comments are fair given there is a 1 cm difference and most KPF's are 5 to 15cms taller than O'Brien

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Bont is not a KPF, but when forward often plays a KPF role.

O'Brien is absolutely a third tall KPD, and plays the same role JOD and Keath have at different stages this year. There is no meaningful difference between Jones, Keath and O'Brien and Bruce, Keath and O'Donnell, surely.

His height is comparable to Balta, Collins, Kolodjashnij, Himmelberg, Haynes, McCartin, Corr, May, Lever, Wilkie, Battle... all of whom I would say would unanimously be called key defenders. Bev himself has also referred to the "three talls" with TOB in there.

Finally, we are 4-3 with TOB in the team so I don’t think your numbers work out - it would have to be 5-3.
 

Foxman98

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Bont is not a KPF, but when forward often plays a KPF role.

O'Brien is absolutely a third tall KPD, and plays the same role JOD and Keath have at different stages this year. There is no meaningful difference between Jones, Keath and O'Brien and Bruce, Keath and O'Donnell, surely.

His height is comparable to Balta, Collins, Kolodjashnij, Himmelberg, Haynes, McCartin, Corr, May, Lever, Wilkie, Battle... all of whom I would say would unanimously be called key defenders. Bev himself has also referred to the "three talls" with TOB in there.

Finally, we are 4-3 with TOB in the team so I don’t think your numbers work out - it would have to be 5-3.
If TOB is a KPD why was everyone melting when he had to play as one against Port in gather round?
 
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If TOB is a KPD why was everyone melting when he had to play as one against Port in gather round?
I don't know what you're talking about because I ignore the melts on here like the plague and I don’t remember the game clearly enough. But presumably because he's not very good and he's only really serviceable when not forced to defend the team's best forwards.

He is a third tall for sure, but distinguishing the role he has played all year from the one JOD will play this weekend is pretty difficult to justify.
 

Foxman98

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I don't know what you're talking about because I ignore the melts on here like the plague and I don’t remember the game clearly enough. But presumably because he's not very good and he's only really serviceable when not forced to defend the team's best forwards.

He is a third tall for sure, but distinguishing the role he has played all year from the one JOD will play this weekend is pretty difficult to justify.
There’s a difference between an interceptor TOB Haynes Wilkie Sicily usually guys 188-199cm but less than 95kg and KPD usually 193cm+ 95kg+
 
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Bont is not a KPF, but when forward often plays a KPF role.

O'Brien is absolutely a third tall KPD, and plays the same role JOD and Keath have at different stages this year. There is no meaningful difference between Jones, Keath and O'Brien and Bruce, Keath and O'Donnell, surely.

His height is comparable to Balta, Collins, Kolodjashnij, Himmelberg, Haynes, McCartin, Corr, May, Lever, Wilkie, Battle... all of whom I would say would unanimously be called key defenders. Bev himself has also referred to the "three talls" with TOB in there.

Finally, we are 4-3 with TOB in the team so I don’t think your numbers work out - it would have to be 5-3.
TOB is an intercept defender never been anything else never will be. You can call him a KPD which each of Jones, Gards, Keath, Bruce and JOD are as much as you like, that's your interpretation but he is not a KPD.

Irrelevant as to what the results are with TOB I'm, never a statistic I used. We are 5 and 2 with any 2 of the genuine KPD'S in that is a statistical fact, as is we are 6 and 7 when we play 3. Cause amd effect who knows. The additional loss you raise with TOB in was when he played with 3 KPD'S. What a shock we lacked run, skill and intercept and lost

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Aug 24, 2012
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There’s a difference between an interceptor TOB Haynes Wilkie Sicily usually guys 188-199cm but less than 95kg and KPD usually 193cm+ 95kg+
Good thing TOB is listed as 193cm 92kg then. :)

Btw, none of O'Donnell, Gardner or Keath are >95kg.

TOB's size is comparable to many KPDs in the league and in our squad. He may not be very good but that doesn't mean you can stop considering him to be a KPD.

He plays on opponent talls. He plays them by pushing them out to bad positions and then coming off his man to intercept, because that's his go - but you can't tell me that playing TOB as a third is distinguishably different from playing JOD as a third.
 

Foxman98

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Good thing TOB is listed as 193cm 92kg then. :)

Btw, none of O'Donnell, Gardner or Keath are >95kg.

TOB's size is comparable to many KPDs in the league and in our squad. He may not be very good but that doesn't mean you can stop considering him to be a KPD.

He plays on opponent talls. He plays them by pushing them out to bad positions and then coming off his man to intercept, because that's his go - but you can't tell me that playing TOB as a third is distinguishably different from playing JOD as a third.
Yes and that’s the problem they aren’t good enough interceptors or with the ball that’s why when Jones is out we are screwed
 
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TOB is an intercept defender never been anything else never will be. You can call him a KPD which each of Jones, Gards, Keath, Bruce and JOD are as much as you like, that's your interpretation but he is not a KPD.

Irrelevant as to what the results are with TOB I'm, never a statistic I used. We are 5 and 2 with any 2 of the genuine KPD'S in that is a statistical fact, as is we are 6 and 7 when we play 3. Cause amd effect who knows. The additional loss you raise with TOB in was when he played with 3 KPD'S. What a shock we lacked run, skill and intercept and lost

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Come on, how can you justify calling JOD a key defender but not TOB? JOD has only played an intercepting role as well (except when others have gone down with injury - so the same as TOB) and is only a few cm taller and slighter than TOB. Both are intercepting KPDs.

Can you show me the games with and without? I can only see three talls in each of TOB's losses - JOD played forward in the ones he played in.
 
Jul 5, 2004
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Come on, how can you justify calling JOD a key defender but not TOB? JOD has only played an intercepting role as well (except when others have gone down with injury - so the same as TOB) and is only a few cm taller and slighter than TOB. Both are intercepting KPDs.

Can you show me the games with and without? I can only see three talls in each of TOB's losses - JOD played forward in the ones he played in.
JOD doesn't intercept yet nor get enough of the ball so it is between him and Keath/Gards in that role.

Will he develop into that who knows but he is playing there ahead of Buss who is 198cm and is more physically developed.

Again you can call TOB what you like, your choice, but he is nothing more than an intercept 3rd tall not KPD with supposed good skills

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He does bring pressure though, on a young side like Hawthorn.
Sorry DRB, whilst his intent to bring defensive pressure is beyond question, I would dispute that he currently brings much to the table in that regard.

He is just too light at the moment and is so easily fended off by those he is trying to tackle or pushed off the ball by his opponents. I hope I'm wrong, but I expect very little impact from him this match. He needs a huge pre-season (and possibly more than 1) at both the dining table and in the Gym to give him a chance of becoming a significant contributor at senior AFL level.

Our best hope is that Hawthorn players don't realise when its Arty coming for them and panic rather than realising they can simply fend him off, if necessary.
 
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