Changes vs Tigers

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Good to have another POV on the Cleary omission. I asked a few weeks ago wondering what the reason he wasn't playing 1s despite our backline injuries as his good form in the VFL. Still developing strength and improving his tank (which is absolutely data our coaching staff monitor closely), does make sense in regards to why he hasn't been playing and was a quick out again this week. Rather than just "Bevo hates him".
The narrative of coaching favorites rarely plays out in reality.
The fact is, our players and coaches want to win as much as any supporters do.
 
Do we let the Tigers kick the first goal tonight? I think we have to.

If we kick the first three goals again, I'll lose my s**t. Since the 2022 EF, we've not learnt to get out of our comfort zone when getting off to a good start. It's a serious problem and it's all in the head.

Collingwood have shown that coming from behind is the new way to win matches and they're the bench mark of the competition.

Hopefully in the offseason we can address this issue and learn from the best.
 

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Norm Smith Medallist
Jan 19, 2014
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Was at Ballarat last week and watched Cleary closely. He was totally gassed and is still physically under the mark. Absolutely no surprise he is the first out.
Good to get another perspective.

If that's the case, then perhaps that is also a mitigating factor for Duryea. That is he had to cover for Cleary a lot defensively because Cleary was gassed. Can accept that if that's what happened.

How did you see the forward defensive effort? Any clear standout underperformers? The stats suggest there were 2 or 3 but they don't give a context.
 

Charlie Bucket

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Poor Taste from this piece of s**t


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IF ...​

Bevo often plays favourites ...

THEN ...​

James O’Donnell appears to be near the top of that list in 2023. Has obviously got genuine ability, O’Donnell, but plucked basically from nowhere to make his AFL debut in round nine, and has managed fewer than six disposals from eight games. Back for Friday night’s crunch game against Richmond.

Proof that the media’s football analysis is as deep as a teaspoon of water.

Although it’s almost guaranteed he’s aware of our lack of KPD’s, but chooses to be a f***wit regardless.
 

MaxiBont

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Sep 26, 2019
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Poor Taste from this piece of s**t


western-bulldogs-afl-banner.jpg

IF ...​

Bevo often plays favourites ...

THEN ...​

James O’Donnell appears to be near the top of that list in 2023. Has obviously got genuine ability, O’Donnell, but plucked basically from nowhere to make his AFL debut in round nine, and has managed fewer than six disposals from eight games. Back for Friday night’s crunch game against Richmond.

This is such a weird comment to make when we have 3 KPDs not available for selection.... JoD was literally the only other KPD apart from Jones we could have played with any AFL experience.
 

LondonBulldog

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Clearly had decent form in the two's. Yet lets be honest he didn't take his chance last week. A 15 possession game and it would have forced Bevo's hand. GWS last goal was from a terrible Clearly kick which swung inboard instead of down the line. He will learn from it and I'm sure his next game will be better. Duryea was awful yet was it the coaches direction or his poor judgment to leave Greene and attack the ball carrier sometime when it wasn't warranted.

Yet no point crying for Clearly, footy is a tough game, when you get you chance, grab it. I know he is young and I'm hopefully he will make it yet last week he did not force the coaches hand. I think our team looks stronger this week.
 
This is such a weird comment to make when we have 3 KPDs not available for selection.... JoD was literally the only other KPD apart from Jones we could have played with any AFL experience.
Or Busslinger who appears less physically advanced than JOD so on balance, for a no 2 KPD the right call has been made.

If it was for a 3rd, marking option, I'd opt for Buss.
 
Clearly had decent form in the two's. Yet lets be honest he didn't take his chance last week. A 15 possession game and it would have forced Bevo's hand. GWS last goal was from a terrible Clearly kick which swung inboard instead of down the line. He will learn from it and I'm sure his next game will be better. Duryea was awful yet was it the coaches direction or his poor judgment to leave Greene and attack the ball carrier sometime when it wasn't warranted.

Yet no point crying for Clearly, footy is a tough game, when you get you chance, grab it. I know he is young and I'm hopefully he will make it yet last week he did not force the coaches hand. I think our team looks stronger this week.
After another pre-season into some young bodies we may well have a very different defense next year.

Barring trade period one of JOD or Buss could be the third making option, and Cleary with a bit more physical development gets the bench spot.
 

Generation West

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I seriously don’t know why these discussions keep being had.

Football isn’t a game of chess that’s controlled by the coaches. Games don’t constantly change because of moves made by the coaches. Systems teams play to include knowing what to do when momentum shifts in different areas on the ground. Players know what to do, they train for it constantly and have a strong understanding of how and why games are playing out a certain way. So called Plan A’s incorporate all of this. To suggest our players play a way that doesn’t incorporate this is ridiculous.

Shifts in games happen because one team is executing better than the other. Be it the ability and experience of the list (a Geelong vs a North) or how well the coaches have the team drilled. Collingwood getting on top of teams late in games after being 5 goals down at 3qtrs time isn’t because of moves McRae makes. It happens because he’s great at having them find their best footy again when it matters late in games.

In your eyes, and a lot of others, momentum shifts happen because one coach makes a move and we don’t respond well because our coach doesn’t make his own move. That’s just ridiculous.

Just like your comment about Bont being tagged. It doesn’t make sense because it isn’t what changed the momentum of that game. What you said is straight up wrong. It’s clear that you don’t understand how football games are played out. Just like our mate doggies.

You talk about oppo mids getting a run on and our team not knowing what to do. What you’re suggesting is pretty silly. Of course our team knows what to do. The oppo team didn’t just bring out some sort of Flying V move that no one’s ever seen before. Our mids would know exactly what’s happening when it happens, and if it’s a case of not being able to negate it accordingly, it’s because they aren’t executing how they should. They don’t need a coach to make a move from the box to save them.

You clearly see the game differently to how it’s actually played out and will always take issue with our coaches when we’re losing because if it. Have a think about it next time the opposition get a run on and look at how our players are playing, rather than waiting for an apparent coaching move that doesn’t necessarily need to happen.
Think I agree with MaxiBont on this. We all think what a talented list we’ve got and Bevo bangs on about us believing we believe internally that we are a top 4 side, but the reality I see is very different.

We won it in 2016 and made the GF in 2021, but have been a mediocre side every other year, including those 2 years, albeit having great finals series.

We are either not as strong and talented as we think we are or have poor tactical coaches. I suspect it’s a bit of both.

Bevo is a great relationship builder, but he has rules for some and rules for others. Why I don’t know, but selection integrity is terrible at our club.

Game day strategy is pretty simple. We play how we want to play regardless of how the opposition is travelling. We look to have momentum/control in most games, only for the opposition to work us out, momentum shifts and the game changes. The reason this happens is because we fail to adjust tactically to shift momentum back our way.

Bevo has incredible self belief and is as stubborn as anyone in the game, but sometimes you need to check your ego for the benefit of the club.

Tell me this. We lose Bruce and Keath in our backline last week. Taylor is all over Naughton and marking everything. Why do you move Lobb to defence instead of Naughton? The logical move was Lobb/English deep forward on Taylor with JUH doing his thing further up the ground and Naughton to the backline. Bevo does not do logical.
 

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This is such a weird comment to make when we have 3 KPDs not available for selection.... JoD was literally the only other KPD apart from Jones we could have played with any AFL experience.

But we all know that possession numbers are absolutely critical for a KPP
 

Mr. Walker

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I think I am being picky just because of who the author is but why would Barrett go with “ has had fewer than six possessions in eight games”? Isn’t accuracy an aim in journalism? Why not just say “five possessions “. Does he get paid by the word? This is an important issue.
 

tonzdogs

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The narrative of coaching favorites rarely plays out in reality.
The fact is, our players and coaches want to win as much as any supporters do.
If you think the current coach doesn’t play favorites, you’re kidding yourself. It has been very evident for years now. Remember Billy Gowers and Mitch Honeychurch?
 
If you think the current coach doesn’t play favorites, you’re kidding yourself. It has been very evident for years now. Remember Billy Gowers and Mitch Honeychurch?
Yes. I remember Gowers winning our goal kicking award one year when we were desperate for talls. I remember him getting delisted not long after.

Honeychurch played a 35 games over a few years and was delisted.

Not sure how that supports the motion that Bevo would rather play favorites than win games of footy.
 

Golden_6

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Very interested to see how we respond after last week. This is the best team on paper that we’ve fielded all year or will continue to field this season (other than Keath & Gardner). The lack of KPDs for this match is a non issue with the Tigers only having one genuine key forward.

Excited to see how JOD goes tonight. He’ll be given a lot of opportunity to intercept. Assuming Jones goes to Riewoldt, his matchup will either be a slow lumbering ruckman or a mid-sized forward.
 
Very interested to see how we respond after last week. This is the best team on paper that we’ve fielded all year or will continue to field this season (other than Keath & Gardner). The lack of KPDs for this match is a non issue with the Tigers only having one genuine key forward.

Excited to see how JOD goes tonight. He’ll be given a lot of opportunity to intercept. Assuming Jones goes to Riewoldt, his matchup will either be a slow lumbering ruckman or a mid-sized forward.
JOD seems a glimpse into the Bevo mindset.
We know he doesn't rate slowish tall ruckmen who can't get involved in possession chains.

It seems he views KPDs in the same way. We seem desperate to fast track JOD and he is a brilliant trainer.
 

tonzdogs

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Yes. I remember Gowers winning our goal kicking award one year when we were desperate for talls. I remember him getting delisted not long after.

Honeychurch played a 35 games over a few years and was delisted.

Not sure how that supports the motion that Bevo would rather play favorites than win games of footy.
Gowers and Honeychurch were complete spuds, like Hannan, McComb, McNeil, Gardner etc. the fact Beveridge keeps playing them says that he plays favorites. Those blokes wouldn’t get games on another AFL list
 

Bulldogs85

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Gowers and Honeychurch were complete spuds, like Hannan, McComb, McNeil, Gardner etc. the fact Beveridge keeps playing them says that he plays favorites. Those blokes wouldn’t get games on another AFL list
That’s incorrect Hannan played 50 games for Melbourne I will see myself out
 
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I seriously don’t know why these discussions keep being had.

Football isn’t a game of chess that’s controlled by the coaches. Games don’t constantly change because of moves made by the coaches. Systems teams play to include knowing what to do when momentum shifts in different areas on the ground. Players know what to do, they train for it constantly and have a strong understanding of how and why games are playing out a certain way. So called Plan A’s incorporate all of this. To suggest our players play a way that doesn’t incorporate this is ridiculous.

Shifts in games happen because one team is executing better than the other. Be it the ability and experience of the list (a Geelong vs a North) or how well the coaches have the team drilled. Collingwood getting on top of teams late in games after being 5 goals down at 3qtrs time isn’t because of moves McRae makes. It happens because he’s great at having them find their best footy again when it matters late in games.

In your eyes, and a lot of others, momentum shifts happen because one coach makes a move and we don’t respond well because our coach doesn’t make his own move. That’s just ridiculous.

Just like your comment about Bont being tagged. It doesn’t make sense because it isn’t what changed the momentum of that game. What you said is straight up wrong. It’s clear that you don’t understand how football games are played out. Just like our mate doggies.

You talk about oppo mids getting a run on and our team not knowing what to do. What you’re suggesting is pretty silly. Of course our team knows what to do. The oppo team didn’t just bring out some sort of Flying V move that no one’s ever seen before. Our mids would know exactly what’s happening when it happens, and if it’s a case of not being able to negate it accordingly, it’s because they aren’t executing how they should. They don’t need a coach to make a move from the box to save them.

You clearly see the game differently to how it’s actually played out and will always take issue with our coaches when we’re losing because if it. Have a think about it next time the opposition get a run on and look at how our players are playing, rather than waiting for an apparent coaching move that doesn’t necessarily need to happen.
Nothing in your post I disagree with.

Most teams changes are actually just getting back to what they practice and planned all week. For those that heard Mitch Duncan after they beat us the Journo asked what they changed to turn the momentum, his answer was simply going back to and trusting what they prepared all week.

Ward to Bont would have been discussed and implemented if Bont was having to much influence, I am not sure however what put plan is when Bont gets a heavy tag as.he sometimes does.

Most matchday moves are of necessity, last week for example the pies were going to lose so Howe was put up forward to try and pinch a win amd also to have a look at how that may work in the business end of the season.

We had 2 KPD's go down, and bluntly beleive we really blew it with the options we chose bit that is Bev's to wear.

My concern is twofold. Once the opposition start making a run not only do we struggle to lock it down, we rarely turn it around and it has happened too often to not question the sustainability of the system.

The second it is often our better players, Bont, Naughton and JUH missing relatively simple goals or poor turnovers or kicks to position by Dale. This is where my concern at our systems amd execution also cone from

On SM-G996B using BigFooty.com mobile app
 

geoffjennings79

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So Smiley Boy says A Jones in, but A Jones is then named as an emergency? Hmmm.

Someone at the club is either trying to flush out SB, or SB's source.

Or... Given I've previously guessed (amongst others) that SB is either of Bevo or Spangher, I'm now wondering if Bevo has hacked SB's account just to troll BF posters?

Is that you Bevo...??!! :think:
 

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