Asia China's growing influence

[bzparkes]

Venezuelans standing up against a U.S. backed puppet in 2002

Except the first sanctions were in 2005 under Bush and only targeted Venezuelan officials and not anything related to the country's imports/exports.

These were continued under Obama from 2011-2014 and in 2015, Obama declared Venezuela a national security threat.

Trump imposed financial sanctions in 2017 by restricting Venezuela to US markets and blocked government and state oil from issuing new debt.

The oils exports to the USA were cut off in 2019. 2 decades after Chavez took power.

Venezuela collapsed long before their oil industry was sanctioned in 2019.

As for your 'puppet' claim, if you're referring to the coup attempt by Pedro Carmona, he only achieved that with help of some sections of the military before Chavez was restored to power 2 days later after a public backlash. He fled to Colombia after escaping arrest. If you have evidence he was backed by the USA, I'd like to see it. Not saying it's not possible but I daresay if the USA were fully behind it then it would've been a lot more successful than 48 hours.

 

[stax on the mull]

And why do you think the sanctions were on them to begin with?

Not the claim you made which was that Venezuela can't supply any more oil to places like China because their infrastructure is run down.

 

[bzparkes]

Not the claim you made which was that Venezuela can't supply any more oil to places like China because their infrastructure is run down.

Yes and what do you think the Chinese delegation was doing there meeting Maduro the day the USA snatched him?

 

[schneebly111]

Yes and what do you think the Chinese delegation was doing there meeting Maduro the day the USA snatched him?

These events demonstrate a clear difference between the two superpowers

One’s foreign policy encourages investment, infrastructure, and development.

The other’s contains airstrikes, coups, and theft.

It is clear China is a more responsible adult on the world stage.

 

[bzparkes]

These events demonstrate a clear difference between the two superpowers

One’s foreign policy encourages investment, infrastructure, and development.

The other’s contains airstrikes, coups, and theft.

It is clear China is a more responsible adult on the world stage.

Please, this is straight out of the CCP sycophant handbook.

Go and look at what they're actually doing in Africa.

Not to mention the encroachment in the Philippines, supplying the Laos, Cambodian and Burmese governments with weapons to put down uprisings, etc.

 

[schneebly111]

If you have evidence he was backed by the USA, I'd like to see it.

Washington channelled funds to groups that opposed Chavez

www.smh.com.au

Venezuela coup linked to Bush team

Specialists in the 'dirty wars' of the Eighties encouraged the plotters who tried to topple President Chavez.

www.theguardian.com

 

[schneebly111]

Please, this is straight out of the CCP sycophant handbook.

Go and look at what they're actually doing in Africa.

Not to mention the encroachment in the Philippines, supplying the Laos, Cambodian and Burmese governments with weapons to put down uprisings, etc.

Wah Wah Wah China bad China bad

Whatever

 

[bzparkes]

Washington channelled funds to groups that opposed Chavez

www.smh.com.au

Venezuela coup linked to Bush team

Specialists in the 'dirty wars' of the Eighties encouraged the plotters who tried to topple President Chavez.

www.theguardian.com

Fair enough but it still doesn't change the fact that sanctions on their economy weren't properly implemented until 2019, after international bodies said the 2018 elections were rigged. The economy had long collapsed by then by itself.

 

[bzparkes]

Wah Wah Wah China bad China bad

Whatever

You think it's fine for them to invade Philippines and Vietnam's sovereign waters and build up military bases whilst ramming their fishing ships with military vessels?

China is bad, just like every superpower(including the USA) is when you're a small country unable to protect it's sovereignty.

 

[stax on the mull]

Yes and what do you think the Chinese delegation was doing there meeting Maduro the day the USA snatched him?

What's the underlying question that you're asking here? Is Chinese govt investment more appealing to a country than the threat of regime change by the US?

Regardless of who is in power, I can't recall there being a great track record where countries have benefited after US has used it's military for regime change.

 

[bzparkes]

What's the underlying question that you're asking here? Is Chinese govt investment more appealing to a country than the threat of regime change by the US?

Regardless of who is in power, I can't recall there being a great track record where countries have benefited after US has used it's military for regime change.

China clearly wants a friendly country as close to the USA as possible and that country just so happens to have the most oil reserves in the world.

China just happens to be the largest importer of oil in the world. It's the one resource they need more of and Venezuela would provide that access to them, conveniently right on the USA's doorstep.

The USA has also long claimed that Venezuela has had terrorist training camps for years(Hezbollah one of the main beneficiaries) and they have noted in the past(2010, under Obama) that the Iranian regime were sending IRGC troops to Venezuela, which they have claimed has only increased over the years.

If that's true, then that proposes an unacceptable national security risk to the USA. The allegations form the USA is that the Iranian terror regime funds its terrorist proxies via drug money obtained from smuggling to the USA and this is an ongoing claim for many years, not just under Trump.

https://docs.house.gov/meetings/FA/FA18/20130320/100534/HHRG-113-FA18-Wstate-NoriegaR-20130320.pdf

 

[stax on the mull]

China clearly wants a friendly country as close to the USA as possible and that country just so happens to have the most oil reserves in the world.

China just happens to be the largest importer of oil in the world. It's the one resource they need more of and Venezuela would provide that access to them, conveniently right on the USA's doorstep.

The USA has also long claimed that Venezuela has had terrorist training camps for years(Hezbollah one of the main beneficiaries) and they have noted in the past(2010, under Obama) that the Iranian regime were sending IRGC troops to Venezuela, which they have claimed has only increased over the years.

If that's true, then that proposes an unacceptable national security risk to the USA. The allegations form the USA is that the Iranian terror regime funds its terrorist proxies via drug money obtained from smuggling to the USA and this is an ongoing claim for many years, not just under Trump.

https://docs.house.gov/meetings/FA/FA18/20130320/100534/HHRG-113-FA18-Wstate-NoriegaR-20130320.pdf

Do you think this is why Netanyahu just dropped by this week to see Trump at Mar-a-Lago?

 

[bzparkes]

Do you think this is why Netanyahu just dropped by this week to see Trump at Mar-a-Lago?

Probably about Iran, I imagine.

 

[stax on the mull]

Probably about Iran, I imagine.

So just backtrack again. What's the threat from China?

 

[bzparkes]

So just backtrack again. What's the threat from China?

What do you think? I'll let you simmer on it for a while.

 

[stax on the mull]

What do you think? I'll let you simmer on it for a while.

I think there also got to a secret Greenland separatist movement we don't know yet about and maybe ISIS is involved as well. amiright?

 

[bzparkes]

I think there also got to a secret Greenland separatist movement we don't know yet about and maybe ISIS is involved as well. amiright?

No, it's a geopolitical move so that USA can assert more direct power over Russia, as well as gain access to rare earth minerals.

Currently, China produces 90% of rare earth minerals and Greenland has a very large supply that's mostly untapped.

Rare earths are used for electrics - Cars, smartphones, TVs and, of course, defense systems.

USA is clearly making a play here to get direct access to rare earth themselves without pandering to China, whilst denying them access to Venezuelan oil.

USA, being China's #1 importer, will be able to produce many of the advanced electronics they currently buy from China, so it's essentially a bit of a triple whammy.

1. Prevent China's access from the world's largest oil reserve = Have to go via USA
2. Reduce USA's dependence on China for electrical goods and products = USA more self-sufficient
3. With the USA, China's #1 customer, no longer reliant on them for their goods(they will just tariff Chinese goods until they're more expensive than locally-produced ones), the Chinese economy will weaken whilst USA's grows.

Now, for all this to happen it'll need to happen within the next 3 years. Is it plausible? I don't know. What Trump's doing however aligns incredibly closely with what he stated in an interview on the Oprah show in 1988. He's clearly had this on his mind for a very long time.

 

[stax on the mull]

No, it's a geopolitical move so that USA can assert more direct power over Russia, as well as gain access to rare earth minerals.

Currently, China produces 90% of rare earth minerals and Greenland has a very large supply that's mostly untapped.

Rare earths are used for electrics - Cars, smartphones, TVs and, of course, defense systems.

USA is clearly making a play here to get direct access to rare earth themselves without pandering to China, whilst denying them access to Venezuelan oil.

USA, being China's #1 importer, will be able to produce many of the advanced electronics they currently buy from China, so it's essentially a bit of a triple whammy.

1. Prevent China's access from the world's largest oil reserve = Have to go via USA
2. Reduce USA's dependence on China for electrical goods and products = USA more self-sufficient
3. With the USA, China's #1 customer, no longer reliant on them for their goods(they will just tariff Chinese goods until they're more expensive than locally-produced ones), the Chinese economy will weaken whilst USA's grows.

Now, for all this to happen it'll need to happen within the next 3 years. Is it plausible? I don't know. What Trump's doing however aligns incredibly closely with what he stated in an interview on the Oprah show in 1988. He's clearly had this on his mind for a very long time.

Sounds great for the population of Venezuela.

 

[bzparkes]

Sounds great for the population of Venezuela.

Well, currently the people of Venezuela get 0% going to them from their oil and gold reserves, so it sure isn't going to get any worse.

 

[nut]

China no longer having direct access to Venezuela's oil unless it deals with the United states directly will certainly curb their influence in the western hemisphere.

It will only expedite their transition to electrification… 60% of new cars are EVS

 

[bzparkes]

It will only expedite their transition to electrification… 60% of new cars are EVS

What are their war machines fueled with?

 

[nut]

What are their war machines fueled with?

China builds walls. They play they long game.


"If you sit by the river long enough, you will see the body of your enemy float by,"

 

[rank and file]

What are their war machines fueled with?

Batteries,diesel and jet fuel.
They'll be fine.

 

[ferball]

China builds walls. They play they long game.


"If you sit by the river long enough, you will see the body of your enemy float by,"

You could sing another rousing chorus while you're waiting.

 

[rank and file]

China builds walls. They play they long game.


"If you sit by the river long enough, you will see the body of your enemy float by,"

"Don't poke the bear" we