Coach Chris Scott re-signs to 2022 (aka the Chris Scott discussion Part IV)

[FredLeDeux]

Blicavs has two b&Fs, which are just as much won with what he does on the training track and behind closed doors as on the field.

Former Carlton Assistant Coach Marcello Truzzi said that "An extraordinary claim requires extraordinary proof."

Do you have any evidence supporting your extraordinary claim?

 

[cynical]

How about we choose the best coach for the job?
Or do you want to set quotas for outsiders?

so the best (assistant) coach happens to be the captains brother who was a Geelong player for 4 years?

the Geelong coaching group is basically Chris Scott and friends

Knights, Lappin, Rahilly and O'Bree have been there forever, Enright hasn't been anywhere else and Scarlett was at the Bulldogs for a few years and they were Geelong 2.0

have to bring in some outsiders

most at the club are far too secure

 

[Max Milburn]

so the best (assistant) coach happens to be the captains brother who was a Geelong player for 4 years?

the Geelong coaching group is basically Chris Scott and friends

Knights, Lappin, Rahilly and O'Bree have been there forever, Enright hasn't been anywhere else and Scarlett was at the Bulldogs for a few years and they were Geelong 2.0

have to bring in some outsiders

most at the club are far too secure

They tried that approach with Scott, and look what happened...

 

[David the Cat]

See this is the level of stupidity that I have to contend with here when this comment is endorsed by a mod <_<

Haven't you heard? Truth isn't truth my friend....and you talk about stupidity on this board...how horrifying that this came from a highly placed source representing the leader of the free world.

Maybe its catching....

 

[Max Milburn]

They tried that approach with Scott, and look what happened...

Seriously though, I do understand your point.
But it can't be a blanket approach.
The coaching mix is already made up of insiders and outsiders.
I honestly don't care where they come from, as long as they are good coaches.
To be honest, I don't know for sure whether they are good or not.
I don't get to see them doing their job.
But it seems like many just decide "oh, they can't be good because I don't like them" or "they can't be good because they are best buddies with CS" or "they can't be good because they are from Geelong..."
Our home and away results suggest that they are doing something right...
Our finals results suggest there are things that are not going right, and need fixing.
Back to the original point: is Scott Selwood a good coach in the making?
I honestly don't know, but I wouldn't be making a decision based on the fact that he is Joel's brother, and I don't think the club should either.

 

[Ricketz]

What a difference it would make if we could more consistently go fwd with confidence. Many plays are hamstrung by going stodgy as we can’t transition fast into the fwd line. We frustratingly slow it up.

Now if you bang it in there with confidence that at least with a crazy ball coming in that 50-60% of the time we’ll get a goal then the team will move it faster and with confidence. Rather than waiting to get picked off or trying to set it up for hawk.

Games where we threw off stodgy for a qtr and looked like a completely different side I can remember clearly were;
1.Richmond
2. Melbourne (q2-1st game; q4-2nd game)
3. Hawks 2nd last qtr
4. Dogs q4
5. Swans (q2&3-1st game; q1-2nd game)
6. WstCst q3

Was there ever a thread for tactics and game style? There’s people who intimately understand how this all works (like CE, Nakia,TC to name a few) but I suspect our game style was a way of protecting so many younger or players carrying injuries such as Danger. When all is lost we go for broke.

Actually in that first hawks game (second one terrible) Parsons played well as did CGuth.



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I agree, it certainly looked like we were trying to take the pressure off the inexperienced backline in the first half of the season by moving it carefully out to retain possession.

Not sure about the slow first quarters in the second half, but some habits can be hard to break.

I am of the camp that believes we need to go direct down the guts, play attacking football. It's better to watch, and will expose us to some bigger losses, but hopefully a lot better wins. There is no need to molly coddle the young backs again.

Maybe it is why so many are underwhelmed by our youth, too. Kept on a short leash, it is hard to stand out.

 

[David the Cat]

so the best (assistant) coach happens to be the captains brother who was a Geelong player for 4 years?

Not sure you're in any position to assess Selwood's abilities to qualify as an assistant coach...unless you are involved with the inner workings of the club, which you're clearly not, given the "flavour" of your posting history.

That said, I tend to agree some new outside "blood" added to our coaching ranks wouldn't be a bad thing.

 

[Ricketz]

1. Yes all rebuilding clubs? what is your point? in 3-5 years they will all be above us
2. The old guys that are left
3. Melbourne will win multiple premierships with their current list.
4. Richmond built their list around guns like Martin, Cotchin, Riewoldt and Rance all whom have played a lot of footy together.
5. Our core group stinks. Stewart hasn't even played 50 games (good player). Henderson is a journeyman who might not even be best 22. Tuohy and Stanley are B grade topups. Guthrie is a big disappointment. Menegola is selfish and cant hit a target under pressure. In 3 years half of those guys wont be at the club.

You think that is a foundation for a premiership tilt?

1. They have all lost key core players during their rebuild phases, disproving your theory of stability. They have all brought in mature age recruits.
2. So a stable core of older players, regardless of how they are recruited, or how badly they perform? How do you reckon they feel about their whole career being a launch pad for somebody who was 6 when they were drafted?
3. Lol, no they won't. They will be lucky to win one. For one of the supposedly toughest midfields and strongest forward lines, their list average age is only 0.21 years younger than ours. They aren't a developing side, they should have already won at least one GF if they were ever going to win one.
4. As opposed to Selwood, Hawkins, Blicavs, Taylor, Stanley. Special case again.
5. That's just rubbish. There is not an ounce of legitimate analysis in your response here. Go follow a club you can be proud of.

 

[you pick one]

so the best (assistant) coach happens to be the captains brother who was a Geelong player for 4 years?

the Geelong coaching group is basically Chris Scott and friends

Knights, Lappin, Rahilly and O'Bree have been there forever, Enright hasn't been anywhere else and Scarlett was at the Bulldogs for a few years and they were Geelong 2.0

have to bring in some outsiders

most at the club are far too secure

 

[Catman]

1. Yes all rebuilding clubs? what is your point? in 3-5 years they will all be above us
2. The old guys that are left
3. Melbourne will win multiple premierships with their current list.
4. Richmond built their list around guns like Martin, Cotchin, Riewoldt and Rance all whom have played a lot of footy together.
5. Our core group stinks. Stewart hasn't even played 50 games (good player). Henderson is a journeyman who might not even be best 22. Tuohy and Stanley are B grade topups. Guthrie is a big disappointment. Menegola is selfish and cant hit a target under pressure. In 3 years half of those guys wont be at the club.

You think that is a foundation for a premiership tilt?

Bookmarked.

Also, I'm still waiting for your analysis on how our under 26 players are the worst in the competition.

 

[David the Cat]

The concession that AA Stewart is a "good player" brought tears to my eyes.

Such a nice change to the shitcanning the list endures from that poster.

 

[cynical]

1. They have all lost key core players during their rebuild phases, disproving your theory of stability. They have all brought in mature age recruits.
2. So a stable core of older players, regardless of how they are recruited, or how badly they perform? How do you reckon they feel about their whole career being a launch pad for somebody who was 6 when they were drafted?
3. Lol, no they won't. They will be lucky to win one. For one of the supposedly toughest midfields and strongest forward lines, their list average age is only 0.21 years younger than ours. They aren't a developing side, they should have already won at least one GF if they were ever going to win one.
4. As opposed to Selwood, Hawkins, Blicavs, Taylor, Stanley. Special case again.
5. That's just rubbish. There is not an ounce of legitimate analysis in your response here. Go follow a club you can be proud of.

1. I'm talking about stability during a premiership window, why would a club care so much about stability when they are rebuilding? To win a flag you need stability.
2. Who cares about the older players on their last legs, it's about what is best for the club not individuals.
3. I'd bet my left nut the Dees will at least win 1 flag in the next 5 years. Throwing up useless raw data? the core of their list is 23 and under and a lot of them are already guns at that age.
4. The Richmond guns were all around 25-28 when they won a flag. Selwood, Hawkins, Blicavs, Taylor and Stanley? Selwood and Hawkins are 30, Taylor is 32. Blicavs has become a good player but he isn't a gun and neither is Stanley. Richmond also have a much better 2nd tier.
5. The truth hurts. I'll follow the club I have followed since a kid, whether they do well or not.

 

[Ray Donovan]

Former Carlton Assistant Coach Marcello Truzzi said that "An extraordinary claim requires extraordinary proof."

Do you have any evidence supporting your extraordinary claim?

Explain how it's an extraordinary claim, you think he has two carjis because he is the best most consistent player all year.

So this year he was better than Hawkins, Tom Stewart who was AA and dangerfield ?

No he does what the coaching panel asks of him every single week. And then studies the role does the work in the film room prepares on track.

So you can tell me its extraordinary or what happens game day is the only best and fairest point scoring factor. The coaches are dictating the roles players play and he seems to be racking votes up.

This isn't the brownlow medal it's a club medal

I mean seriously he was a category B rookie a steeple chaser his work on his game is obviously first class. He played his first season in the ruck he is the no.1 exceptional example of hard work on the training track pays off

 

[Jhye Clark 13]

Mitchell, Wingard and O'Meara are a lot better than our batch

they are the second worst and will join us at the bottom of the ladder in 3-4 years

its not trolling if its the truth

let me know the other teams

Geez mate, go take a cold bath if you really believe that.

 

[Spazz Cat]

No, I'm not being silly. Your argument relies on a special case that a core group developed from the ground up is somehow magically more stable than an older core group.

1. Western Bulldogs, Fremantle, Saints, Sun's, Carlton, Brisbane all beg to differ.

2. Before the core group hits 27, what stabilises them for the previous ten years?

3. Melbourne. Multiple rebuilds multiple young core failures.

4. Richmond. As above.

5. Our core group is Blicavs, Duncan, Stewart (under 27 but in leadership role), Hendo, Tuohy, Stanley. Guthrie is 26, so if you want to include him, then sure - we also have Menegola to add. 2 quality KPPs, a decent Ruck, 2 excellent mids, and 2 excellent hbfs, 1 underperforming utility.

#5 looks absolutely horrible when you explain it like that.
Couple of very good players but compared to other teams it's shocking.
Looks like Selwood, Danger and Tommy will have some sore shoulders again.
You just answered your own question as to why a few clubs will finish ahead of us.

 

[Shadow89]

You can, and lots of people on here do.
Of course, it's not worth a pinch of Hawthorn.

I see what you did there...Well played

 

[Spazz Cat]

Explain how it's an extraordinary claim, you think he has two carjis because he is the best most consistent player all year.

So this year he was better than Hawkins, Tom Stewart who was AA and dangerfield ?

No he does what the coaching panel asks of him every single week. And then studies the role does the work in the film room prepares on track.

So you can tell me its extraordinary or what happens game day is the only best and fairest point scoring factor. The coaches are dictating the roles players play and he seems to be racking votes up.

This isn't the brownlow medal it's a club medal

I mean seriously he was a category B rookie a steeple chaser his work on his game is obviously first class. He played his first season in the ruck he is the no.1 exceptional example of hard work on the training track pays off

Yeah that's not extraordinary at all, it's the way it is. Of course it is.
I don't really care that much TBH, good on him for a great year. Was stoked with what he was able to do.
If Tommy hadn't already won a B+F I would think it was a bit unfair though.

 

[Spazz Cat]

Former Carlton Assistant Coach Marcello Truzzi said that "An extraordinary claim requires extraordinary proof."

Do you have any evidence supporting your extraordinary claim?

Unfortunately someone found the extraordinary proof and poor old Marcello and the boys had to spend decades at Princess Park being skeptical of their finals chances.

 

[Shadow89]

See this is the level of stupidity that I have to contend with here when this comment is endorsed by a mod <_<

How old are you? You keep using all this bad grammar and crying out for mods to back you up? You can't cry poor when someone (nearly everyone) disputes your opinion on something, and then provides a fact to negate your argument.

If you're going to disparage Josh Hunt for being 'soft' and then saying he shouldn't have been best 22, then you're going to get a conflicting opinion. Pick out Motlop, Smedts, Parsons etc. and you'll most likely get a consensus of support.

This isn't an arena where you can just stipulate something and then run away and ask the mods to defend you because you don't like the responses. Especially when what you're provided with is articulated facts and measured responses.

Hunt played 198 games in 12 seasons. He won 2 premierships and he stomped on that mutt, Ballantyne's hand. He's a champion and as tough as they come. Don't like that response, then find me something that's evidence to the contrary. If you're going to use an isolated incident (like a Hawthorn supporter with Worpel v Sel), then it proves nothing. Give me a career of pulling out of contests (Motlop springs to mind), then you have a case. At this point, you don't.

 

[Max Milburn]

Yeah that's not extraordinary at all, it's the way it is. Of course it is.
I don't really care that much TBH, good on him for a great year. Was stoked with what he was able to do.
If Tommy hadn't already won a B+F I would think it was a bit unfair though.

I thought Blicav's year was every bit as good as Hawkins'.
Could have been either, as well as Kelly.

 

[Shadow89]

1. Yes all rebuilding clubs? what is your point? in 3-5 years they will all be above us
2. The old guys that are left
3. Melbourne will win multiple premierships with their current list.
4. Richmond built their list around guns like Martin, Cotchin, Riewoldt and Rance all whom have played a lot of footy together.
5. Our core group stinks. Stewart hasn't even played 50 games (good player). Henderson is a journeyman who might not even be best 22. Tuohy and Stanley are B grade topups. Guthrie is a big disappointment. Menegola is selfish and cant hit a target under pressure. In 3 years half of those guys wont be at the club.

You think that is a foundation for a premiership tilt?

1. Carlton Saints and Suns have been saying that for a while...
3. They won't
4. Then they added Nankervis, Caddy and Prestia...then they won a flag. With just the previous 4, they never won a final and languished for years. This is not a good argument.
5. Tuohy is not B grade, that's stupidity. Stewart is a gun. Duncan is a gun. Blicavs is a gun. Parfitt has potential to be A grade. Ratugolea also has potential to be A grade.


The amount you sh!t on Geelong is astounding. If I didn't know otherwise, I'd be convinced you were a Hawks spy lol.

 

[Spazz Cat]

I thought Blicav's year was every bit as good as Hawkins'.
Could have been either, as well as Kelly.

Fair enough. I hear ya. I looooved Tommy's year though. Even the games he was getting s**t for not doing enough, I still thought he was playing well.
I wouldn't have Kelly up there, was good but had a slump mid season.
Danger always gets underrated IMO. Had another great year.

 

[FredLeDeux]

Explain how it's an extraordinary claim, you think he has two carjis because he is the best most consistent player all year.

So this year he was better than Hawkins, Tom Stewart who was AA and dangerfield ?

No he does what the coaching panel asks of him every single week. And then studies the role does the work in the film room prepares on track.

So you can tell me its extraordinary or what happens game day is the only best and fairest point scoring factor. The coaches are dictating the roles players play and he seems to be racking votes up.

This isn't the brownlow medal it's a club medal

I mean seriously he was a category B rookie a steeple chaser his work on his game is obviously first class. He played his first season in the ruck he is the no.1 exceptional example of hard work on the training track pays off

Your claim is that he gets B&F votes not for what he does on the ground during the game, but for what he does off the ground during the week.

The logical conclusion of that claim is that a player doesn't even have to play in the game to get votes.

That's an extraordinary claim by any standard.

But never mind, I'll consider any evidence, any evidence at all, of which you have not provided a skerrick so far.

The off-season is nearly finished, and posts are clearly approaching peak stupidity.

 

[Gavin Excell]

Former Carlton Assistant Coach Marcello Truzzi said that "An extraordinary claim requires extraordinary proof."

Do you have any evidence supporting your extraordinary claim?

Had a laugh at the former Carlton assistant coach line

 

[Ray Donovan]

Your claim is that he gets B&F votes not for what he does on the ground during the game, but for what he does off the ground during the week.

The logical conclusion of that claim is that a player doesn't even have to play in the game to get votes.

That's an extraordinary claim by any standard.

But never mind, I'll consider any evidence, any evidence at all, of which you have not provided a skerrick so far.

The off-season is nearly finished, and posts are clearly approaching peak stupidity.

I made no claim to that what so ever you completely just made that up. Use your own words peak stupidity season is ending.

It's not just turn up gameday grab the votes and go home.

This is a club best and fairest if you do great work on the track and it correlates into games doing exactly what the coaching panel asks of you the 1%. The blocks of the ball the creating space for others. Be the undersized ruckman taking a belting then going to CHF and the CHB a full time utility.

You will do well in club best and fairests the coaches will absolutely love your work. And if you want to take my words and twist them to say he is getting votes on the training track fine run away and enjoy it.

I said he does the work on the training track and once you have done the work the game is the easy part. That hard work will translate to the field and the coaching panel will identify with that work because it's a team effort and therefore it will be rewarded in club awards!

You can tell me all day training makes no difference. But the guys who give the votes also watch you all week at training and select you!!!!

So anyways I'm done said my bit