Coach Chris Scott re-signs to 2022 (aka the Chris Scott discussion Part IV)

[geelong_crazy26]

We did not play an average side in the ‘07 PL, but a team on the rise that would win one within 36 months. That same team won in the west as well that finals series but probably were at the end of their tether.


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They had a very average midfield that year and we’re just a decent side with no stars in it just yet. They only even made the prelim because west coast had a horrid injury run and went out straight sets, they should have been way out of their depth against us but instead we’re up to their eyeballs in it because we struggled with the pressure they applied on the night. We almost choked and were seconds away from never winning 2007

 

[Nickoo]

Collingwood's mythology is half built on working class persona , in supporter and in player from 58 against Melb thru the 70's with the Richardsons and Thompson and Rose to the Hafey's army of battlers then Malthouses .... I mean win finished op top in 80 and didn't get to a GF becuase of the Pies and because of VFL Park... so it was hardly an unusual situation that night in 07. The last time I was truely nervious at the footy .us being super duper dominant team that year ..yet , a bit like melb is atm , haunted by ghosts of christmas past. Our control was "The Lid". Once we did it it really was a different rep for us.

Likewize , once Melb actually do it , and get over their know role that everyone has them pegged as ..they will be one heck of a club to climb over ..90,000 2 weeks in a row tells you they have dormant support. I have never seen a Melb side with the type of dominance potential that this one has.... as long as they dont let bad lucky etc start them down the path of stress and lowered performance.

Its probably another reason to not just tinker at the edges.. the side the beat us this year , imo ,has the potential to be a lot better..but so has Ess and North ... if we think or if CS thinks that we are only 5% winning it .. i beg to differ. We could finisher higher next year but do we really look the most likely side to worry the comp next year. A step back & reload is not such a bad thing ..cause in this comp you must plan your run.

Agreed. Just wish we’d done it a bit earlier like 2014. But then melb tanked allot to be where they are now.

The other thing is we can not muster 50k of people to the G. Very annoying given 380k of support- that is supporters who’ve bought a membership at least once in the past 7 years at least.


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[joe444]

We can muster 50k to the MCG on a Saturday afternoon after years of failure.

(and, seriously, scrolling through pages of three posters arguing over semantics ... ? some posters should know better)

 

[Stan The Caddy]

The thing is, it clearly is NOT Scott's fault that Menegola is poor under pressure. You can't blame a coach for that. No coach can teach poise.

But you can blame him if he continually selects him. That's the issue. Among others of course.

I disagree. You can teach a player to take the first option which Scott hasn't done.

You can teach a player to be less selfish which Scott hasn't done.

IMO Scott has his hands all over the failure of Menegola as a finals player. He played really well in his first final against the Hawks don't forget...

 

[David the Cat]

All of that is your subjective spin. Hawthorn’s three years (2016-18) are objectively worse than Geelong’s 2012-14.

What do you expect from a Hawthorn apologist......

 

[Partridge]

All of that is your subjective spin. Hawthorn’s three years (2016-18) are objectively worse than Geelong’s 2012-14.

Their finals record is definitely worse. Zero wins is self explanatory.

I will say Geelong in 2013 were also far stronger than Hawthorn have been in any of the last three seasons.

Shows what a month of footy can do. Hawthorn looked just a finals side the last fortnight and Melbourne look comfortably top 4. Somehow Hawthorn finished above them.

 

[Stan The Caddy]

There is clearly a broader issue of finals losses. It sucks. But the reasons for those losses vary the further you go back. The stuff cynical listed above is true enough (unfortunately) for recent finals, but if you go back a couple of years the pattern changes.
Can't argue that this year and last year are distressingly similar though.

Mmm... well in 2012 against Freo we stunk it up in the first quarter. In 2014 against NM we stunk it up in the first quarter. In 2016 against Sydney we stunk it up in the first quarter. In 2017 against Adelaide we stunk it up in the first quarter. This year against Melbourne we stunk it up in the first quarter.

Sure, there have been other finals losses that have presented a different set of circumstances but it is clear over a number of years that Scott has failed to consistently get the team prepared sufficiently for what they're about to face. It's no fluke.

 

[Stan The Caddy]

Bearing in mind we already have - we dropped six places down the ladder this year.

Whilst extending the coaches contract for another 3 years on top of the 1 that he already had left...

 

[Gavin Excell]

I think he is doing a good enough job. Eventually we might need to get someone else in just to freshen things up a bit.

And this is why i was so disappointed with the extension. Now is the right time to freshen things up as you say.

4 more years of this is depressing

 

[RegHickeyStand]

Question:

Who did the Tigers get in that won them the 2017 GF?
Who did the Bulldogs get in that won them the 2016 GF.
Hell, who did we get in for 2007?

 

[Max Milburn]

One of my favorite all time games. But let’s not fool ourselves; they should have and could have easily won that game. They kicked themselves out of it early and had their chances. They didn’t take their opportunities and we did, The Hawkins poster....

We had a far better list and more talent, yet they had the fate of the game in their hands. Why is that?? Because they had a much better game plan than pressured us and would have won the game if they took their full chances.

Nope. St Kilda were the chokers. It was their year and they folded under our pressure.

 

[Max Milburn]

Mmm... well in 2012 against Freo we stunk it up in the first quarter. In 2014 against NM we stunk it up in the first quarter. In 2016 against Sydney we stunk it up in the first quarter. In 2017 against Adelaide we stunk it up in the first quarter. This year against Melbourne we stunk it up in the first quarter.

Sure, there have been other finals losses that have presented a different set of circumstances but it is clear over a number of years that Scott has failed to consistently get the team prepared sufficiently for what they're about to face. It's no fluke.

Sure, it's hard to argue against that.
There's also the bye issue. It's too glaringly evident that it's not a coincidence. But it's not like they haven't tried different approaches.
Maybe it's like when a player gets the yips in front of goal.
Everyone knows what you can do to fix it, including the player. But it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy...

 

[Gavin Excell]

Nope. St Kilda were the chokers. It was their year and they folded under our pressure.

Which we did the year before

 

[Gavin Excell]

Sure, it's hard to argue against that.
There's also the bye issue. It's too glaringly evident that it's not a coincidence. But it's not like they haven't tried different approaches.
Maybe it's like when a player gets the yips in front of goal.
Everyone knows what you can do to fix it, including the player. But it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy...

But doesnt this sit squarely with the coaching group.

The reality is they have failed

 

[Partridge]

Question:

Who did the Tigers get in that won them the 2017 GF?
Who did the Bulldogs get in that won them the 2016 GF.
Hell, who did we get in for 2007?

Do you mean off field? I know there were eerie similarities with Balme at Geelong and then Richmond. Both teams had been improving, went massively backwards for a year, then Balme came in to help the senior coach focus exclusively on coaching.

Dogs I'm not sure.

 

[Gavin Excell]

Their finals record is definitely worse. Zero wins is self explanatory.

I will say Geelong in 2013 were also far stronger than Hawthorn have been in any of the last three seasons.

Shows what a month of footy can do. Hawthorn looked just a finals side the last fortnight and Melbourne look comfortably top 4. Somehow Hawthorn finished above them.

List wise is Hawthorn better placed than we are?
Its actually a tough question

 

[Mr Meow]

Do you mean off field? I know there were eerie similarities with Balme at Geelong and then Richmond. Both teams had been improving, went massively backwards for a year, then Balme came in to help the senior coach focus exclusively on coaching.

Dogs I'm not sure.

Is he talking about ruckman (Ottens, Boys and Nank)?

 

[Partridge]

List wise is Hawthorn better placed than we are?
Its actually a tough question

It is. Very hard to say.

 

[Max Milburn]

But doesnt this sit squarely with the coaching group.

The reality is they have failed

Well, this is the Scott thread. Why bring in the rest of the group? We may as well blame him for everything.

 

[cynical]

List wise is Hawthorn better placed than we are?
Its actually a tough question

pretty similar positions but their last flag was 4 years after ours, so we should be well ahead in a rebuild

 

[Spazz Cat]

Well, this is the Scott thread. Why bring in the rest of the group? We may as well blame him for everything.

He only wants ex teammates and colleagues as coaches. He deserves the criticism.
He gets all the credit when we do well, the big money contract and the media gigs.
He can also cop the heat when we f**k up.
That's the job!

 

[Turbocat]

Question:

Who did the Tigers get in that won them the 2017 GF?
Who did the Bulldogs get in that won them the 2016 GF.
Hell, who did we get in for 2007?

Graham
Dunkley
Selwood

 

[Mr Meow]

He only wants ex teammates and colleagues as coaches. He deserves the criticism.
He gets all the credit when we do well, the big money contract and the media gigs.
He can also cop the heat when we f**k up.
That's the job!

I get the "buck stops with the coach" thing, I really do. I'm not that happy with Scott. However this is a really lazy, narrow lens to view things. People above and below him need to be held just as responsible. There's no way I'm just giving the players a pass because Scott can't prepare them for finals. Responsibility lies everywhere.

 

[Spazz Cat]

I get the "buck stops with the coach" thing, I really do. I'm not that happy with Scott. However this is a really lazy, narrow lens to view things. People above and below him need to be held just as responsible. There's no way I'm just giving the players a pass because Scott can't prepare them for finals. Responsibility lies everywhere.

Oh yeah for sure the players deserve at at least as much as the coach.
I didn't read the whole discussion sorry. I thought it was about assistants sharing equal responsibility. Nah.

 

[BIGANT]

He only wants ex teammates and colleagues as coaches. He deserves the criticism.
He gets all the credit when we do well, the big money contract and the media gigs.
He can also cop the heat when we f**k up.
That's the job!

Spazzy where do you get info from re ex team mates & colleagues as coaches !?!?
just your pov or observation !?
Knights, Rahilly aren't ex team mates....
Nige Lappin is one that isn't on the mc but i think he holds the floor pretty well when he's sought out or has a pov. Yet he likes his role as the runner. My pov is i think lappo is up there with Carracella!?!?


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