Opinion Chris Scott's coaching - Part II [NEW POLL ADDED]

For how long will Chris Scott be Geelong coach?

  • For as long as he wants the job

  • 5+ more years

  • Somewhere between 2020 and 2022 (i.e. beyond his current contract)

  • He will be sacked/resign in 2019

  • He will be sacked/resign in 2018

  • The Nuclear Option: sacked/resign in 2017


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You ain't a fool, my wording was awful but you know what i meant.
I don't really. Bomber left a club having been flogged embarrassingly in the 2010 prelim. I don't think he deserves any benefit of the doubt (or whatever it is you're suggesting) that he would have simply turned it around the following year.
 

Nankervis brothers

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We actually had several very good opportunities to move the ball into F50 in the 2nd and 3rd quarters very quickly but broke down with a sloppy possession - get 75% of those right and we are well ahead of the Dees despite their shit kicking for goal. Our fitness looks very good late in games too
Playing less talls overall gives us extra midfield depth and it will be vital we get this mix right come the business end. Agree that SS will be very important and I can see Menegola and GHS playing in the same team as the really good sides have many good inside mids. Added bonus is better depth allows Danger and the skipper more time up forward.
Cockatoo is also very important as he delivers insane pressure up forward and can have a run in the middle.
Our top end talent is fantastic , we will be formidable if the next level down and the young guys all improve.
Exactly, those are the type of incidents I had in mind (re: 2nd and 3rd quarters against Dee's, where disposal broke down during a quick break). We need to make those disposals stick to take advantage of this season's quicker games style.

Our fitness has kicked on from last year - it's excellent! We were the best finishers in 16' and look like we will be in 17'. It's got to a point where I view any 3 quarter time lead as a certain win, and a 2-3 goal deficit as very gettable. Kudos to fitness staff there.

I've liked seeing Scott move Dangerfield forward a bit more this season. I'd like to see him do it more often, at least when the game situation permits. I think it will bring the second-trier into the game. It will put demands on players like Duncan, Guthrie, etc., who must then respond and step up.

I'm not so convinced that Menegola, GHS, and S.Selwood can all play in the same side; i wonder if they are too alike. My feeling is that S. Selwood (if he stays fit) will come to hold down a permanent inside/tagger role, and GHS and Menegola will go head to head for the other 'second tier' inside role.

Agreed, Cockatoo developing is pivotal to our chances and our future, and I'm pleased Scott and match committee have played him green and given him greater opportunities than his form has warranted at times. He shows great potential, and as you say, his ability to keep the ball in contest up forward is first rate. He could also take Motlop's role if he goes (and I hope he doesn't), as they have similar attributes: pace, creativity, goal sense, ability to do the unexpected, etc. Cockatoo is more 'physical', though.

Agree again re our 'top end', which is impressive and makes us a potential contender. Basically, the club is right to have made an 'Indian Summer' push for a premiership, which is reflected in recent trading decisions and hole/list filling. You simply have to do this when you have players like Selwood, Dangerfield, Hawkins, Taylor (though that is another story at the moment), Henderson, Motlop, and Menzel all in the 'sweet-spot' age wise. I mean, Selwood and Dangerfield alone - you aren't going to waste those careers on an old-fashioned draft rebuild. It's a commanding spine and plenty to build a team around. Re our recruitment of mature players, IMO the club is cashing in the 'capital' it accrued through winning flags. We've never been a destination club, but all of sudden we became one. This coincided with FA, so of course the club has tried to make the most of both of these circumstances. Why wouldn't they? Whether it works, and whether our second tier can make the step up and provide the necessary support, remains to be seen. But if we don't win one, well que sera, worth the try.

I'll just fill in a point I made in the earlier post re the team 'clicking'. This probably sounds a bit old fashioned, and not very sports-science-y, but I think synergy is critical in a team sport. 'Synergy' for me means the ability to intuitively understand what your team mates are going to do on the field. Knowing instinctively that player X makes short lateral movements before disposing of the ball; player Y's disposal on his left is flat, on his right it's 'fatter' or loopy; player Z will make this decision when under the pump, and so on. And then there is knowing instinctively who will play what role and when, and the confidence you eventually develop in that role being met. A team only gets this understanding through playing together over time. IMO, Hawthorn's success had a lot to do with this synergy. They read each other beautifully. Last year, Geelong were essentially a new team - not young, or entirely inexperienced, but new to each other. When I read the rd 1 side last March, I thought 'this is a new team, will make the 8 on talent, but not much more'. They exceeded that expectation by a long shot. This year that synergy should be further developed. In fact, Scott has eluded to this, without saying it directly....

Anyway, still not sure we are in the hunt for a flag this year (I think it's GWS' to lose), but another year should mean improvement.

Yeesh, apologies for long post!
 
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Ray Donovan

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Great shot , you have to feel for Chris - the loss of younger sibling would be devastating but he's focused and representing the Club admirably

As a side bar to this thread it's interesting that the anti Scott protagonists are beating on ( or off :) ) to the same old arguments
At least Chris and I dare say the Club are adopting a continuous improvement philosophy - early days but you can see we are moving the ball quicker and have a different forward and mid structure , we have also been shorter in defence and debuted two promising guys - all aspects the anti Scott brigade wanted to see but have so far either ignored or have been too blinded to notice.
Long , long way to go to see how effective it turns out to be but to ignore the paradigm change makes me question how genuine or open to change some people are :)
Nice post goggin i have had my question marks on his gamestyle and structure we have used in the previous seasons. All you can ask is they try and improve it and all the signs this season point to a coaching panel that is trying to adjust from the mistakes of the prelim final last season. Giving greater opportunity to Duncan, GHS, Murdoch, Parfitt which in turn is attempting to grow a larger midfield group. Which was the biggest issue from the prelim. Duncan particularly has thrived which is great because he is one of our most dangerous disposers of the football. Tom stewart, Parfitt, Parsons have debuted and exposed our list depth which is great.

Menegola was left out early in favour of structure and the form of GHS that is a big one in my eyes guys should be selected on form regardless of the name on the board. The team is and should always be bigger than the name i think the bulldogs showed last season no.1 for injuries to best 22 and a premiership that lists win prenierships not just the 22.

The tall scenario has definately been adjusted playing one less just makes the world of difference to the mobility of our side and makes blicavs more effective. They should stick with One and blic for the majority of the season i believe.

Taylor forward has been not very effective to date although we are winning and it allows for a settled structure without including a black or stanley, smith combo having to attempt to play CHF.

Dangerfield spending more time forward gives us another dangerous avenue fwd. A marking target a creative player that draws defenders with him hawkins, menzel forward we look very dangerous and mobile and we can defend our f50 better.

So you can see all the areas i believed we were really struggling with last season midfield depth, tall structure is being worked on i still firmly believe our list is right in the middle talent wise so this is the perfect example of a coaches year. He will need to work extremely hard to get us inside the 8 and he couldnt have started better. But its a long season and we have a sample size of data we have not rolled through any of the heavies yet to really evaluate where we are at. And if this changes will stand up.

Our run home from round 11 onwards will be our maker i believe tricky to say the least. Adelaide and gws 4 ( games) sydney and a trip to perth wedged in. Throw in unpredictable sides we like richmond and the pies if we make it we will earn it these early wins will be like gold !

Adelaide ( ss ) ( round 11)
West Coast ( domain )
Fremantle
GWS ( SPO )
Brisbane
Hawthorn
Adelaide ( adel )
Carlton
Sydney (ss)
Richmond (ss)
Collingwood
GWS (ss)
 

Ray Donovan

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I would call it concerning that they recruited two ruckmen and don't seem to know when to play them, or in what combination.
Because they recruited stanley to become a ruckman worked out he probably isnt either one a great ruckman and average forward. So they brought in smith by chance and worked out he is a better ruckman than stanley but struggles forward. So its no surprise really when you bring in two guys who were not playing regular AFL football smith was in the Neafl behind tom nicholls. A lot was patched over with blicavs, danger in the 3rd man up role now this department is much more exposed
 

Farmer2Goggin

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Exactly, those are the type of incidents I had in mind (re: 2nd and 3rd quarters against Dee's, where disposal broke down during a quick break). We need to make those disposals stick to take advantage of this season's quicker games style.

Our fitness has kicked on from last year - it's excellent! We were the best finishers in 16' and look like we will be in 17'. It's got to a point where I view any 3 quarter time lead as a certain win, and a 2-3 goal deficit as very gettable. Kudos to fitness staff there.

I've liked seeing Scott move Dangerfield forward a bit more this season. I'd like to see him do it more often, at least when the game situation permits. I think it will bring the second-trier into the game. It will put demands on players like Duncan, Guthrie, etc., who must then respond and step up.

I'm not so convinced that Menegola, GHS, and S.Selwood can all play in the same side; i wonder if they are too alike. My feeling is that S. Selwood (if he stays fit) will come to hold down a permanent inside/tagger role, and GHS and Menegola will go head to head for the other 'second tier' inside role.

Agreed, Cockatoo developing is pivotal to our chances and our future, and I'm pleased Scott and match committee have played him green and given him greater opportunities than his form has warranted at times. He shows great potential, and as you say, his ability to keep the ball in contest up forward is first rate. He could also take Motlop's role if he goes (and I hope he doesn't), as they have similar attributes: pace, creativity, goal sense, ability to do the unexpected, etc. Cockatoo is more 'physical', though.

Agree again re our 'top end', which is impressive and makes us a potential contender. Basically, the club is right to have made an 'Indian Summer' push for a premiership, which is reflected in recent trading decisions and hole/list filling. You simply have to do this when you have players like Selwood, Dangerfield, Hawkins, Taylor (though that is another story at the moment), Henderson, Motlop, and Menzel all in the 'sweet-spot' age wise. I mean, Selwood and Dangerfield alone - you aren't going to waste those careers on an old-fashioned draft rebuild. It's a commanding spine and plenty to build a team around. Re our recruitment of mature players, IMO the club is cashing in the 'capital' it accrued through winning flags. We've never been a destination club, but all of sudden we became one. This coincided with FA, so of course the club has tried to make the most of both of these circumstances. Why wouldn't they? Whether it works, and whether our second tier can make the step up and provide the necessary support, remains to be seen. But if we don't win one, well que sera, worth the try.

I'll just fill in a point I made in the earlier post re the team 'clicking'. This probably sounds a bit old fashioned, and not very sports-science-y, but I think synergy is critical in a team sport. 'Synergy' for me means the ability to intuitively understand what your team mates are going to do on the field. Knowing instinctively that player X makes short lateral movements before disposing of the ball; player Y's disposal on his left is flat, on his right it's 'fatter' or loopy; player Z will make this decision when under the pump, and so on. And then there is knowing instinctively who will play what role and when, and the confidence you eventually develop in that role being met. A team only gets this understanding through playing together over time. IMO, Hawthorn's success had a lot to do with this synergy. They read each other beautifully. Last year, Geelong were essentially a new team - not young, or entirely inexperienced, but new to each other. When I read the rd 1 side last March, I thought 'this is a new team, will make the 8 on talent, but not much more'. They exceeded that expectation by a long shot. This year that synergy should be further developed. In fact, Scott has eluded to this, without saying it directly....

Anyway, still not sure we are in the hunt for a flag this year (I think it's GWS' to lose), but another year should mean improvement.

Yeesh, apologies for long post!
Awesome post
Understand the clicking comment - you only have to look at us in 2007 - 2009 to realise how powerful that can be- just knowing what and how your teammates will react is liquid gold
I'm very bullish on us but a huge amount will depend on the next generation and how they progress
Go you good things:)
 

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Nankervis brothers

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Awesome post
Understand the clicking comment - you only have to look at us in 2007 - 2009 to realise how powerful that can be- just knowing what and how your teammates will react is liquid gold
I'm very bullish on us but a huge amount will depend on the next generation and how they progress
Go you good things:)
We've every reason to be bullish. It's a good time to be Geelong fan. But then it always is, rain or shine :)
Carn' the Cats!
 

Sttew

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Sick of hearing that shit mate, Bomber didn’t have a chance to redeem himself because he left so how do you or anyone else know he couldn’t have come out and also won the 2011 flag. Look at the results below, there’s a clear pattern when losing the previous year we’ve come out firing the next. Bombers last year was full of turmoil at the club, the Ablett saga was playing out, his private life was rife with problems and Essendon’s approach would also have been on his mind, being written off by Melbourne scribes who knew xxxx all about the ins and outs of what was happening means shit, lucky we even made the finals let lone lose to the pies.

2006
Geelong v Magpies Loss 102

2007
Geelong v Magpies Win 16
Geelong v Magpies Win 5

2008
Geelong v Magpies Loss 86

2009
Geelong v Magpies Win 27
Geelong v Magpies Win 73

2010
Geelong v Magpies Win 36
Geelong v Magpies Loss 22
Geelong v Magpies Loss 41

2011
Geelong v Magpies Win 3
Geelong v Magpies Win 96
Geelong v Magpies Win 38

2012
Geelong v Magpies Loss 12
Geelong v Magpies Loss 31


We all know what he’s done what we’re complaining about is the lack of what he’s done, and that is a lack of winning finals when we’ve had sides capable of winning home & away games at an exceptional rate as you put it but then failing in finals. Don’t you think if we’re good enough to beat those sides in the home and away season we should also be good enough to beat them in finals or as supporters do we just go along our merry way and be happy that he maintains that winning record and don’t care if we don’t win finals? So far this season we've beaten 3 ordinary sides but are good enough to beat most of them, doesn't make him a good coach if we were to win 20 or 21 games only to be kicked out of the finals, but hang on!!!! his record would still be kept intact and that's what really matters.
Sorry, but Bomber was burnt out and bereft of a game plan capable of winning a premiership in 2011. That is fact. Hawks and Pies had completely picked apart the Bomber game plan
 

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I would call it concerning that they recruited two ruckmen and don't seem to know when to play them, or in what combination.

In your opinion. But CS is making his decisions based on ALL the inside info he has and it isn't a superficial, rushed, reactive process necessarily. He might make it sound like they are working it out as they go, but he is very shrewd and will not divulge any more than he wants to.
 

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Sorry, but Bomber was burnt out and bereft of a game plan capable of winning a premiership in 2011. That is fact. Hawks and Pies had completely picked apart the Bomber game plan
Yet people criticise him for leaving. If he had nothing left to offer, he did the right thing by leaving, no? It's not really comparable to the Ablett situation as some are suggesting.
 

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where did that stuff about scotts
Is that the same burn out and bereft game plan CS has been suffering from in finals since 2011?
of course it isnt the same 'burn out amd bereft game plan CS has been suffering from'... they are different coaches and different people with different plans.

youre absolutely entitled to think CS is burnt out and bereft when it comes to finals game plans, but the above response is basically 'i know you are, i said you are...' and doesnt achieve much of anything.
 

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Yes he can.
2012 Elimination final - Loss
2013 Prelim final - Loss
2014 Qualifying final - Loss
2014 Semi final - Loss
2016 Prelim final - Loss
we would have been expected to win 2 out of those? granted, in those 2 we were basically out of it at quarter time (3 of them actually, but that was against a superior side) which is a worrying trend.

what do you think should have been done differently?
 
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Yet people criticise him for leaving. If he had nothing left to offer, he did the right thing by leaving, no? It's not really comparable to the Ablett situation as some are suggesting.
I always looked at Bomba leaving as a favour. He knew he had nothing left to give (mentally and physically burnt out) and was bereft of ideas so did the right thing by going at the end of 2010.

This is somewhat similar to those supporters who lambaste Ayres for being a mediocre coach but are still crying that he betrayed us by leaving to coach Adelaide. :drunk: Even after all these years they probably don't realise how contradictory those views are.
 

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I always looked at Bomba leaving as a favour. He knew he had nothing left to give (mentally and physically burnt out) and was bereft of ideas so did the right thing by going at the end of 2010.

This is somewhat similar to those supporters who lambaste Ayres for being a mediocre coach but are still crying that he betrayed us by leaving to coach Adelaide. :drunk: Even after all these years they probably don't realise how contradictory those views are.
I cheered the day he up and left. Clueless coach.
 

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we would have been expected to win 2 out of those? granted, in those 2 we were basically out of it at quarter time (3 of them actually, but that was against a superior side) which is a worrying trend.

what do you think should have been done differently?
Could argue with justification that Hawthorn in 2014 and Sydney in 2016 were superior outfits, as both had comprehensively beaten us during home and away late in each year. But they should never have lost the 2012 or 2013 finals, plus the 2014 semi final to North.
 
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Sttew

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Yet people criticise him for leaving. If he had nothing left to offer, he did the right thing by leaving, no? It's not really comparable to the Ablett situation as some are suggesting.
It was the right move. But people criticize Bomber because he gave Ablett hell yet at the same time he was plotting his own departure. Remember Bomber was issued a club owned mobile phone and there, during the season, were countless calls to Essendon people
 
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