Opinion Chris Scott's coaching - Part II [NEW POLL ADDED]

For how long will Chris Scott be Geelong coach?

  • For as long as he wants the job

  • 5+ more years

  • Somewhere between 2020 and 2022 (i.e. beyond his current contract)

  • He will be sacked/resign in 2019

  • He will be sacked/resign in 2018

  • The Nuclear Option: sacked/resign in 2017


Results are only viewable after voting.
Status
Not open for further replies.

barmy44

BigFooty Guy
Joined
May 14, 2009
Posts
7,569
Likes
10,393
Location
Brisbane
AFL Club
Geelong
Other Teams
Man City, England Test Team, Sturt
Could argue with justification that Hawthorn in 2014 and Sydney in 2016 were superior outfits (as both had comprehensively beaten us during home and away late in each year. But they should never have lost the 2012 or 2013 finals, plus the 2014 semi final to North.
i dont disagree wirh much of that, except to say there are very few finals that are or should be considered 100% certainties. 'should never have lost' is a bit strong. 'should have done better' is a bit general and nebulous i know, but how i probably see it.

personally, only the 2012 EF is one i see as inexplicable. the other finals losses i thought were all distinct possibilities or probabilities. we were very ordinary throughout 2014.
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

Partridge

Hall of Famer
Joined
Nov 12, 2002
Posts
35,395
Likes
37,291
AFL Club
Geelong
i dont disagree wirh much of that, except to say there are very few finals that are or should be considered 100% certainties. 'should never have lost' is a bit strong. 'should have done better' is a bit general and nebulous i know, but how i probably see it.
To an extent yes. But if you're facing an opponent you've previously beaten, or even better have beaten on every occasion during that season, I'd expect to win.
 

barmy44

BigFooty Guy
Joined
May 14, 2009
Posts
7,569
Likes
10,393
Location
Brisbane
AFL Club
Geelong
Other Teams
Man City, England Test Team, Sturt
To an extent yes. But if you're facing an opponent you've previously beaten, or even better have beaten on every occasion during that season, I'd expect to win.
sport is never won or lost on past results, though. in that scenario id expect based on prior results the team can win, but never that they will win.
 

Gee Class Loco

All Australian
Joined
Oct 14, 2012
Posts
938
Likes
1,269
Location
"G" Town
AFL Club
Geelong
Other Teams
Denver Broncos, Boston Celtics
Sick of hearing that shit mate
Why because it is FACT???

Bomber didn’t have a chance to redeem himself because he left so how do you or anyone else know he couldn’t have come out and also won the 2011 flag.
Bomber left of his own free will. So yes he did have a chance. And chose not to. FACT.

Bombers last year was full of turmoil at the club,
What are you implying?? That... He Couldn't handle the pressure?? Couldn't handle his player or players?? His People skills-management not good enough?? You are probably right, he couldn't thats why he walked away?? Lucky for us hey that he walked and Chris Scott came in.

being written off by Melbourne scribes who knew xxxx all about the ins and outs of what was happening means shit, lucky we even made the finals let lone lose to the pies.
Says who?? Scribes who knew Jack Shyte?? or JumpyHolden?? Not FACT just OPINION for both of us. That's fine thats what it's all about.

and that is a lack of winning finals when we’ve had sides capable of winning home & away games at an exceptional rate as you put it but then failing in finals.
Mmm you do know winning H & A games at a high rate when you play Suns-Giants-Demons-Bombers-Lions twice is a little different to playing Hawks & Swans in the Finals. If not I'll give you the heads up. It is. But you cannot ever take away the fact he just churned out wins at an exceptional rate. When i last looked it was at about 72% over a 6 year period. Yep! and that is FACT.

Did he have the side capable? To some extent yes. They were all good sides.
GREAT sides?? No not of the caliber of 2008-2009-2010(which Bomber won 1 and lost 1 and got knocked out in straight sets in the last one).
2011 Losing Ablett hurt us deeply but we did have a chance and we did. One of the greatest coaching feats that will be more appreciated as years go by.
2012 Top 5-6 team with a slight chance, walked into a Elimination final v the Dockers and got a belting.
2013 Top 4 team. We were in it up to our teeth albeit under dogs(-12pt) against the Hawks in the Prelim. Right up to the last 10-15 minutes into the last quarter. With bad-panicked play by players that should-would of known better kept turning the ball over and lost by a KICK to the eventual Premiers. Lady luck left us halfway thru the last quarter. Golden opportunity missed to play off in a GF vs the Dockers. STILL KILLS me to watch to this day.
2014 there were 4 teams in it. Us, Hawthorn, Sydney & Freo. We got smashed by the Hawks and then lost by a kick to North, out in straight sets as did the Dockers. Not good enough to win it all.
2015 Not good enough side PERIOD. The last year of SJ Kelly Stokesy, our Great core of players from 09-11 was now completely gone.
2016 Top 5 team. We were in the mix... Along comes 6th placed Bulldogs and win it ALL... sort of sums it up.

Don’t you think if we’re good enough to beat those sides in the home and away season we should also be good enough to beat them in finals or as supporters do we just go along our merry way and be happy that he maintains that winning record and don’t care if we don’t win finals?
Of course i had that view. But i am old enough to know that winning H & A games isn't a reflection of Finals footy. If you've paid attention over the past 40 years you'd come up with the same conclusion. I think Scotty & the team care more about winning finals and Premierships than you, me and John Citizen. Their drive to win is more than that of a member-supporter-barracker sitting in the bleachers or on their couch like you and me.
All the coach & staff can do is prepare a team to compete, win, evolve, adapt, improve and strive to win the LOT. Which he has done on all fronts. The one thing that you need, whether you are Hawthorn, Cleveland Cavs, New England Patriots, Cleveland Indians-Browns is LADY LUCK. The game is played with a fine line of winning & losing. A bounce of the ball (Saints in '09 Scarlo and agin in '10 Milne) A suspension (Warriors-Green v Cavs Game 4) Dumb ass plays by the opposition (Seattle & Atlanta v Patriots) and just plain "The Gods hate Us!!" Browns & Indians of Cleveland.
Just remember one thing you need LUCK to WIN it ALL.


So far this season we've beaten 3 ordinary sides but are good enough to beat most of them, doesn't make him a good coach if we were to win 20 or 21 games only to be kicked out of the finals, but hang on!!!! his record would still be kept intact and that's what really matters.
So you want him to do what?? Lose games?? WTF is this question?? He's there to win games isn't he?? Are you saying that winning H & A games don't really matter?? If so why play? why watch? Let's just play finals... Oh a knockout comp... that might be more to your liking?? Yes??
Your expectations would of got Clarko sacked last year... Longmire would've packed his bags by now... Lyon wouldn't have a job... Blighty would never had been given another gig at Adelaide... And poor old BellyAche from the Storm would be back in Brisbane by now. Please Please give me a break. I just hope you don't place these types of expectations on your family or friends and most of ALL on your sons and daughters.
Because what you seek is a Unicorn, let us know when you've found one.

I appreciate your post, but YOUR views and MY views in who-what-is Chris Scott to the GFC are Poles apart.
I'm glad the GFC management live in the world of reality rather than Utopia.

Cheers Mate & all the best.
Above all... GO CATTERS!!
 

RegHickeyStand

Brownlow Medallist
Joined
Sep 29, 2009
Posts
13,851
Likes
12,844
Location
Belgrave
AFL Club
Geelong
Yet people criticise him for leaving. If he had nothing left to offer, he did the right thing by leaving, no? It's not really comparable to the Ablett situation as some are suggesting.
Agree. Ablett was coming into his peak. Bomber was washed up by his own admission. But Bomber deceived the same as Ablett did in the end. Ablett hurt us worse, obviously.
 
Joined
Apr 17, 2016
Posts
1,233
Likes
1,163
AFL Club
Geelong
Why because it is FACT???



Bomber left of his own free will. So yes he did have a chance. And chose not to. FACT.



What are you implying?? That... He Couldn't handle the pressure?? Couldn't handle his player or players?? His People skills-management not good enough?? You are probably right, he couldn't thats why he walked away?? Lucky for us hey that he walked and Chris Scott came in.



Says who?? Scribes who knew Jack Shyte?? or JumpyHolden?? Not FACT just OPINION for both of us. That's fine thats what it's all about.



Mmm you do know winning H & A games at a high rate when you play Suns-Giants-Demons-Bombers-Lions twice is a little different to playing Hawks & Swans in the Finals. If not I'll give you the heads up. It is. But you cannot ever take away the fact he just churned out wins at an exceptional rate. When i last looked it was at about 72% over a 6 year period. Yep! and that is FACT.

Did he have the side capable? To some extent yes. They were all good sides.
GREAT sides?? No not of the caliber of 2008-2009-2010(which Bomber won 1 and lost 1 and got knocked out in straight sets in the last one).
2011 Losing Ablett hurt us deeply but we did have a chance and we did. One of the greatest coaching feats that will be more appreciated as years go by.
2012 Top 5-6 team with a slight chance, walked into a Elimination final v the Dockers and got a belting.
2013 Top 4 team. We were in it up to our teeth albeit under dogs(-12pt) against the Hawks in the Prelim. Right up to the last 10-15 minutes into the last quarter. With bad-panicked play by players that should-would of known better kept turning the ball over and lost by a KICK to the eventual Premiers. Lady luck left us halfway thru the last quarter. Golden opportunity missed to play off in a GF vs the Dockers. STILL KILLS me to watch to this day.
2014 there were 4 teams in it. Us, Hawthorn, Sydney & Freo. We got smashed by the Hawks and then lost by a kick to North, out in straight sets as did the Dockers. Not good enough to win it all.
2015 Not good enough side PERIOD. The last year of SJ Kelly Stokesy, our Great core of players from 09-11 was now completely gone.
2016 Top 5 team. We were in the mix... Along comes 6th placed Bulldogs and win it ALL... sort of sums it up.



Of course i had that view. But i am old enough to know that winning H & A games isn't a reflection of Finals footy. If you've paid attention over the past 40 years you'd come up with the same conclusion. I think Scotty & the team care more about winning finals and Premierships than you, me and John Citizen. Their drive to win is more than that of a member-supporter-barracker sitting in the bleachers or on their couch like you and me.
All the coach & staff can do is prepare a team to compete, win, evolve, adapt, improve and strive to win the LOT. Which he has done on all fronts. The one thing that you need, whether you are Hawthorn, Cleveland Cavs, New England Patriots, Cleveland Indians-Browns is LADY LUCK. The game is played with a fine line of winning & losing. A bounce of the ball (Saints in '09 Scarlo and agin in '10 Milne) A suspension (Warriors-Green v Cavs Game 4) Dumb ass plays by the opposition (Seattle & Atlanta v Patriots) and just plain "The Gods hate Us!!" Browns & Indians of Cleveland.
Just remember one thing you need LUCK to WIN it ALL.




So you want him to do what?? Lose games?? WTF is this question?? He's there to win games isn't he?? Are you saying that winning H & A games don't really matter?? If so why play? why watch? Let's just play finals... Oh a knockout comp... that might be more to your liking?? Yes??
Your expectations would of got Clarko sacked last year... Longmire would've packed his bags by now... Lyon wouldn't have a job... Blighty would never had been given another gig at Adelaide... And poor old BellyAche from the Storm would be back in Brisbane by now. Please Please give me a break. I just hope you don't place these types of expectations on your family or friends and most of ALL on your sons and daughters.
Because what you seek is a Unicorn, let us know when you've found one.

I appreciate your post, but YOUR views and MY views in who-what-is Chris Scott to the GFC are Poles apart.
I'm glad the GFC management live in the world of reality rather than Utopia.

Cheers Mate & all the best.
Above all... GO CATTERS!!
Hang on!!! They do live in Utopia if they think he's the right coach to lead us to our next flag.
 

00VicWard001

Premiership Player
Joined
Sep 3, 2011
Posts
4,394
Likes
8,074
AFL Club
Geelong
Big deal. Good coaches maximise opportunities, and that's what Chris Scott has done masterfully. Last week he decided not to contest rucks in Geelong's forward line. Masterstroke. This week, efficiency and accuracy won the day. Genius
A few teams tried that out last round. Chris Scott = trendsetter.
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

BlightysCats

Norm Smith Medallist
Joined
Aug 5, 2013
Posts
6,655
Likes
4,076
Location
Northcote
AFL Club
Geelong
Other Teams
The Phil Opiontube Phillies
Thread starter #7,864
we would have been expected to win 2 out of those? granted, in those 2 we were basically out of it at quarter time (3 of them actually, but that was against a superior side) which is a worrying trend.

what do you think should have been done differently?
Actually we went in to 3 of them as favourite (4 if you count the 2013 Qualifying final) with the bookies and another (2013 Prelim) although we weren't favourite we'd beaten them the previous 11 times we'd played them from memory.
 

BlightysCats

Norm Smith Medallist
Joined
Aug 5, 2013
Posts
6,655
Likes
4,076
Location
Northcote
AFL Club
Geelong
Other Teams
The Phil Opiontube Phillies
Thread starter #7,865
Anyway we've played poor footy for the majority of our last two games and such play will catch up with us at some point despite some luck getting us over the line so far.
 
Joined
Apr 17, 2016
Posts
1,233
Likes
1,163
AFL Club
Geelong
So let us in on the big secret. Who is the right coach?
At the minute there aren't many good ones around but I'd be happy with Brendan McCartney, he seemed to surround himself with the right assistants at WB and it's evident he left them in good shape, plus he was always spoken highly of while at Geelong, I'd say Brendan feels like he has unfinished business and would grasp the opportunity to prove so. If McCartney fell through we could always have a crack at Alastair Clarkson, doesn't have as good a winning record as the mighty Chris Scott but has won a few more premierships.
 

Rockford

Norm Smith Medallist
Joined
Aug 22, 2006
Posts
8,913
Likes
3,080
Location
Halls Head
AFL Club
Geelong
At the minute there aren't many good ones around but I'd be happy with Brendan McCartney, he seemed to surround himself with the right assistants at WB and it's evident he left them in good shape, plus he was always spoken highly of while at Geelong, I'd say Brendan feels like he has unfinished business and would grasp the opportunity to prove so. If McCartney fell through we could always have a crack at Alastair Clarkson, doesn't have as good a winning record as the mighty Chris Scott but has won a few more premierships.
I can't tell if you're being serious. McCartney didn't leave the Dogs in good shape at all. There's a reason he only lasted a few seasons and that with Beveridge coming in they went from strength to strength (Wallis started being played on the ball, Picken was given license to play as opposed to tag etc.. Bontempelli and Stringer developed under Beveridge's watch and they brought in Boyd, drafted Daniel, Dunkley, McLean etc..). It boggles the mind that anyone would suggest we get rid of Scott and bring in McCartney!

The better coaches than Scott in the league at the moment are Simpson, Bolton, Beveridge and probably Clarkson. Clarkson could never coach the Cats, wouldn't happen. There's no chance Beveridge leaves or Simpson for that matter so unless you're envisaging Bolton walking or the Blues somehow freeing Bolton up we're much better off leaving Scott at the helm. Realistically we're in either the first or second year of a list refresh as we aim to continue challenging for a Flag. I'd rather leave Scott there while we have Selwood, Dangerfield and Hawkins and see what we can do than trying to change course now. There's so little he's given credit for and the criticism is so one-eyed and parochial that you can't help but think he could win a Flag still and that wouldn't have been enough for the detractors.
 

barmy44

BigFooty Guy
Joined
May 14, 2009
Posts
7,569
Likes
10,393
Location
Brisbane
AFL Club
Geelong
Other Teams
Man City, England Test Team, Sturt
Actually we went in to 3 of them as favourite (4 if you count the 2013 Qualifying final) with the bookies and another (2013 Prelim) although we weren't favourite we'd beaten them the previous 11 times we'd played them from memory.
'bookies favourites' lose all the time, though... i wasnt talking about geelong being 'favoured' to win, i was talking about 'they really cannot lose this one'. in all of those games, losing was a fair possibility, and in a few it was a probability, based on form lines.

theyre finals, man. none of the teams we lost to were mugs. all good to great sides. i was disappointed by all, but only really surprised by the 2012 EF. and that surprise was about being 48 points down or whatever in the second quarter, not the actual loss.

anyway, we disagree, no problems there.
 

Vdubs

Brownlow Medallist
Joined
Jan 1, 2008
Posts
27,405
Likes
25,184
Location
48 J 09
AFL Club
Geelong
Other Teams
Arsenal
I can't tell if you're being serious. McCartney didn't leave the Dogs in good shape at all. There's a reason he only lasted a few seasons and that with Beveridge coming in they went from strength to strength (Wallis started being played on the ball, Picken was given license to play as opposed to tag etc.. Bontempelli and Stringer developed under Beveridge's watch and they brought in Boyd, drafted Daniel, Dunkley, McLean etc..). It boggles the mind that anyone would suggest we get rid of Scott and bring in McCartney!

The better coaches than Scott in the league at the moment are Simpson, Bolton, Beveridge and probably Clarkson. Clarkson could never coach the Cats, wouldn't happen. There's no chance Beveridge leaves or Simpson for that matter so unless you're envisaging Bolton walking or the Blues somehow freeing Bolton up we're much better off leaving Scott at the helm. Realistically we're in either the first or second year of a list refresh as we aim to continue challenging for a Flag. I'd rather leave Scott there while we have Selwood, Dangerfield and Hawkins and see what we can do than trying to change course now. There's so little he's given credit for and the criticism is so one-eyed and parochial that you can't help but think he could win a Flag still and that wouldn't have been enough for the detractors.
What makes you say these are better than CS?
Zero evidence.
Agree with you re McCartney.
It seems that supporters outside Geelong rate our coach more highly than our own supporters.
Win or lose this Monday, CS is doing an awesome job, is honest, is aware of his limitations, our team's limitations, and has methods to keep us in contention.
Hawks are currently 0-3, and people are talking about Clarko losing the plot which is just as ridiculous as the ongoing criticism about CS.
There is just too much analysis and scrutiny about this game- more than ever before, but despite that, forming an opinion that there are better coaches around like Simpson, Bolton, Beveridge and Clarko is interesting but baseless, imho.
 

barmy44

BigFooty Guy
Joined
May 14, 2009
Posts
7,569
Likes
10,393
Location
Brisbane
AFL Club
Geelong
Other Teams
Man City, England Test Team, Sturt
Anyway we've played poor footy for the majority of our last two games and such play will catch up with us at some point despite some luck getting us over the line so far.
this is absolutely true, and i doubt anyone would argue. if we play at the same level as against north and melbourne, we will start losing games and barely threaten the 8.

'luck' and 'randomness' plays a part in every teams season though, successful or otherwise.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top Bottom