Christchurch Terror Attack

[db26]

Totally agree.I'm astonished by some of our politicians in parliament and there comments nothing short of disgusting how on earth are they up there embarrassing to our beautiful country while the world is watching.

 

[Tygrys]

Atrocities have been committed by all sides of all denominations. NZ is much closer to home than anywhere else, and 50 people is an awful lot. So it is almost in our own backyard so to speak, so people feel more attached. Should we feel any less attached when 'we' bomb a wedding ceremony in Afghanistan and kill everyone there due to shoddy intelligence (which has happened so many times), it seems we do. Not sure why, but it seems human nature to empathise more with things closer to home.

Not sure about that anymore, there is no part of the world that in theory isn't reachable within 24 hours flight travel and mobile phones, the internet and 24 hour news services have made communications instantaneous. I have never been to Christchurch but neither have I ever been to Paris. Both have experienced terrorist attacks that seem as real to me, both feel as tragic. Do I feel more inclined to do a minutes silence more than the other? Absolutely not. Would I have been happy to do both - fine. If one had more Australian deaths than the other, well I think that's a relevant consideration. But if you are just talking 'closer' to home thing, in 2018 three churches were simultaneously attacked by a family of Islamic terrorist in Java with a heavy loss of life and all a distance approximately the same as Christchurch from the Australian mainland, but we allowed that to pass uncommemorated. Just saying be prepared to do more foreign minute silences if we do this one. The argument 'oh but it happened in New Zealand' is not quite the argument it use to be.

 

[hognogger]

I guess it was a matter of time, sadly, before a reprisal terror attack in the West.
I was in Europe at the time of the Nice truck attack in July and met someone from there.
There are some no-go zones for westerners in Marseilles, I was told, a fatal stabbing at the railway station.
There would be one minute's silence at the footy, I would guess, and of course enhanced security cordons at venues.

Not a reprisal attack. If you read the guy's manifesto, he is a self-described racist and white nationalist. What he was worried about was that Muslims, who are mostly non-white, have a high birth rate and will outbreed the whites, and take over the country. His primary concern was with race, not religion.

An indescribably terrible act, but since much of the media is not reporting what was in his manifesto, it's easy to get the wrong idea about why he did what he did.

 

[Hans McGregor]

I'll give a moment's silence for Fraser Anning's political career

 

[Bojangles17]

Not necessarily, the NRL has a New Zealand team, the AFL does not. No doubt the NRL did a minutes silences in the aftermath of the Christchurch earthquake but does anyone remember if the AFL did? Did 9/11 get a minutes silence? (Be shocked if it didn't?). I know individuals have eg John McCarthy, Phillip Walsh, but just wondering what's the history of the AFL and minute silences for disasters that happen in foreign countries?

We did for 9/11 prior to our final in 2001

 

[RFCGloryJC]

Yes. They said he sent the "manifesto" to Ardern's office just before the attack.
I think he is trying not to be pinned down as left or right wing, because the use of the word "manifesto" is a communist term.

 

[KiwiTiger]

Posted yesterday.

As an Australian who’s lived in NZ for 10 years, some things posted in here disturb me.

Haere Ra

 

[jumpinjimmy]

The Fulani Muslim terrorist group have killed 120 Christians over the last 3 weeks in Nigeria and more than 1 thousand over the past 2 years. Where is the outrage and worldwide sympathy for them! There is not enough compassion on 10 Earths to fill the hole left by a conflict that began 1400 years ago when a political ideology was born that declared war on all others. That said, violence against non-combatants is never justified.

 

[SunshineBoy]

Have given it some more thought. If we do do something, be it a minutes silence or whatever, I hope it's not simply because Muslims were attacked and Houli is a Muslim. The inference is that if this gunman had attacked a christian church for example we would be doing nothing (as puzzling as that might be considering how many players and club employees would be Christian). Likewise it would mean by that logic that if a Kingdom Hall were attacked and having the highest profile Jehovah Witness in the league in Alex Rance we'd be balls deep Again the religious affiliations of the players or staff should not be a consideration in any decision and I trust it won't be. It's too arbitrary, too random and there is too much room for perceived hypocrisy.

I think there are some murky waters here. For example if a Christian church is attacked in retaliation with large numbers killed (as has been common practice by Muslim terrorists around the world), would we also have a minutes silence for them, and if not why not? As recently as late January 20 people were killed in a cathedral in the southern Philippines by bombs planted by Islamic fundametalist. To my knowledge neither the AFL nor the NRL nor the Richmond Football Club made any statements in regards to that attack. The response might be 'well it's different, it's New Zealand'. Well, they are constantly reminding us that they are not Australians. They tell themselves, they tell us, they tell the world and act offended if they are mistaken for Australians to be point where it all becomes kind of wearisome. It's a foreign country, that just can't be ignored as a consideration. Just because something happens in New Zealand doesn't mean we automatically respond as if it were in Australia.

Finally, some have argued we should do something because it was done by an Australian. Over 200 Australian muslims have gone to Syria and Iraq to fight for Isis. No doubt a significant number have participated in despicable acts of rape, torture and murder. When the final figure is worked out (if ever) will we have a minutes silence for this in recognition of the culpability of Australian passport holders in ISIS's crimes against humanity? And if not why not? Not totally against the idea, but there will be more attacks in the future, probably very nearby. And to be honest I don't feel any more personally attached to the victims of Christchurch than I do to those in the Phillipines, or the Mid-east or Europe. But fine do it, but having set the precedent be prepared to keep on doing it on a regular basis, this isn't stopping anytime soon.

Just to put it into context a Catholic Church was bombed in the Phillipines 20 dead , are we doing a minutes silence there?

Not saying either action should be endorsed but BOTH should be condemned, my only surprise is it has happened sooner than now.

ALL these actions are disgusting , but condemnation has to be in both directions.

Sport and politics and religion is a cocktail that doesn’t taste good.

Is the outrage because westerners don’t do this sort of thing?

Just my 5 cents worth

 

[Tiges1229]

The Fulani Muslim terrorist group have killed 120 Christians over the last 3 weeks in Nigeria and more than 1 thousand over the past 2 years. Where is the outrage and worldwide sympathy for them! There is not enough compassion on 10 Earths to fill the hole left by a conflict that began 1400 years ago when a political ideology was born that declared war on all others. That said, violence against non-combatants is never justified.

Unfortunately media will pick and choose which and what to saturate the world with . It was bit like when those school children in the school in Pakistan were murdered by the taliban from memory i think it was like 80+ people , it happened around the same time as the Paris attacks, every man and there dog including media etc went with the # about Paris on twitter, hardly a mention about the attacks in Pakistan .

 

[KeilorUnder9s]

This attack will be the catalyst for something far worse I fear.

 

[Tiges1229]

This attack will be the catalyst for something far worse I fear.

Yes agree retaliation coming . I mean how many attacks have the AFP and agencies already stopped in the last 5 years already , bucket loads , and that’s without something like this even happening .

 

[Grrr]

Not sure about that anymore, there is no part of the world that in theory isn't reachable within 24 hours flight travel and mobile phones, the internet and 24 hour news services have made communications instantaneous. I have never been to Christchurch but neither have I ever been to Paris. Both have experienced terrorist attacks that seem as real to me, both feel as tragic. Do I feel more inclined to do a minutes silence more than the other? Absolutely not. Would I have been happy to do both - fine. If one had more Australian deaths than the other, well I think that's a relevant consideration. But if you are just talking 'closer' to home thing, in 2018 three churches were simultaneously attacked by a family of Islamic terrorist with a heavy loss of life and all a distance approximately the same as Christchurch from the Australian mainland, but we allowed that to pass uncommemorated. Just saying be prepared to do more foreign minute silences if we do this one. The argument 'oh but it happened in New Zealand' is not quite the argument it use to be.

I agree, a life is a life. We tend to feel it more, when it is within our shores. NZ is a pretty close neighbour with a lot in common. When this sort of things happens in Indonesia, certainly there is less emotion felt even though the distance is the same. I guess the distance is cultural, not that I'm agreeing with it.

 

[Grrr]

This attack will be the catalyst for something far worse I fear.

So far if anything it has brought good will and empathy, something amiss especially in the Murdoch Press. How long it will last I don't know, but let's just hope it is a signal to extremist from both sides that it is just a senseless waste.

 

[tora tora tora]

Just to put it into context a Catholic Church was bombed in the Phillipines 20 dead , are we doing a minutes silence there?

Not saying either action should be endorsed but BOTH should be condemned, my only surprise is it has happened sooner than now.

ALL these actions are disgusting , but condemnation has to be in both directions.

Sport and politics and religion is a cocktail that doesn’t taste good.

Is the outrage because westerners don’t do this sort of thing?

Just my 5 cents worth

The the major difference in this shooting is the fact he is Australian. A lunatic fascist one at that. And has killed 50 people.

 

[Toadvine]

Yes, let’s once again use the game to force everyone to pander to the pc factor.
I have no intention of bowing or remaining silent for any religion.

Though I would for a few of my fellow humans.

Nothing "PC" about standing against hatred, Nazis and White Supremacy.

Yes. They said he sent the "manifesto" to Ardern's office just before the attack.
I think he is trying not to be pinned down as left or right wing, because the use of the word "manifesto" is a communist term.

I have no idea how you came to this conclusion. Manifesto is a Latin word and the attacker is certainly extremist right wing. You only need to read that he championed Anders Behring Breivik to understand that.

 

[captain cotch 9]

because the nrl has done it, the afl will too

poor comment IMO.

 

[Wacko23Jacko]

Considering New Zealand’s relations with Australia through tourism, trade, economy, landscape, history, politics, etc it’s perfect obvious why this would draw more attention than other incidents around the world.

Not to take anything away from any of the other tragedies at all, but our relationship with New Zealand has and is considerably stronger and more relevant to the every day Australian.

The biggest take away from this issue is further highlighting the damage that careless and dangerous media/internet culture can have on disenfranchised individuals.

Just like individuals who are isolated, segregated and mistreated by media/news outlets and the wider community are picked up and radicalised by religious extremists, people can also be drawn in and radicalised by far right extremism in online communities.

The root issue is not that there are radicals out there on every side, but rather that the way that our society/world operates in contemporary times is creating more and more isolation, segregation and creating disenfranchised, lonely and vulnerable individuals.

 

[SunshineBoy]

Nothing "PC" about standing against hatred, Nazis and White Supremacy.



I have no idea how you came to this conclusion. Manifesto is a Latin word and the attacker is certainly extremist right wing. You only need to read that he championed Anders Behring Breivik to understand that.

Why only quote Nazis and White Supremacists?

Are radical islamists ok?

 

[RFCGloryJC]

The word manifesto is most famously used as the title of the Communist Manifesto, by Marx and Engels.
All I am saying is the shooter is deliberately trying to mix various ideologies, left and right, including "eco-warrior" which is traditionally left-wing.

 

[Toadvine]

Why only quote Nazis and White Supremacists?

Are radical islamists ok?

Of course not.

It was in response to fumbler who said a minute's silence to show unity and oppose the attacks in NZ was "pandering to the PC factor".

Did I offend you by not listing every single hate group that exists even though it wasn't relevant to our conversation?

 

[SunshineBoy]

Of course not.

It was in response to fumbler who said a minute's silence to show unity and oppose the attacks in NZ was "pandering to the PC factor".

Did I offend you by not listing every single hate group that exists even though it wasn't relevant to our conversation?

Read my earlier post

 

[Toadvine]

The word manifesto is most famously used as the title of the Communist Manifesto, by Marx and Engels, everyone knows.
That's all I was saying.

Marx called it a Manifesto because that's what he published by definition.

Manifesto
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Jump to navigationJump to search
For other uses, see Manifesto (disambiguation).
A manifesto is a published declaration of the intentions, motives, or views of the issuer, be it an individual, group, political party or government.[1][2][3][4] A manifesto usually accepts a previously published opinion or public consensus or promotes a new idea with prescriptive notions for carrying out changes the author believes should be made. It often is political or artistic in nature, but may present an individual's life stance

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manifesto

 

[RFCGloryJC]

That's all I am saying.
In Western history, the word manifesto is most famously linked to the Marx and Engels' political document.
We cannot enter the mind of the shooter, but I guess he is trying to mix and blend various ideologies.
Certainly, "eco-warrior" is a left-wing term.

 

[Toadvine]

That's all I am saying.
In Western history, the word manifesto is most famously linked to the Marx and Engels' political document.
We cannot enter the mind of the shooter, but I guess he is trying to mix and blend various ideologies.
Certainly, "eco-warrior" is a left-wing term.

That's interesting. When I heard it I thought of the Unabomber...