Current Claremont Murders - The Bunker

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Girlnextdoor

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Thinking about it, JC went missing in 1988 and the HH attack took place in 1990. Was BRE working within the vicinity two years beforehand? He might have been. JC went missing in a similar manner to SS - they both simply vanished.

When young women were abducted from Claremont the media instantly made the public aware, which prompted pressure to apprehend the VC (vile creature). Abducting women off the street was a challenge, thinking something the accused CSK needed to fulfil a specific fantasy.

After the Claremont killings most people took notice and precautions were put in place, such as CCTV, and extra security guard presence who would escort women to their cars etc. There were precautions in all suburban hotspots, not just Claremont.

Due to the attention the accused CSK was smart enough to cease killing. During the years after the Claremont SKs Perth had several street workers, that we know of, who were attacked or killed. We know very little of these ladies who would have been such easy targets. For all we know there may have been lots of street workers killed, because they don't seem to get a mention on the Crime Stoppers website. The media hasn't mentioned much about them either.

In WA there's word that the Claremont killings were very organized and whoever performed them was far from an amateur. Meaning, the manner in which the two victims were found was the work of someone who was highly skilled - appearing as though he'd done it beforehand.
Yes, LAM all really great observations. I like how you've adopted VC, think that was my name for BRE wasn't it?😁
I saw this report about police in USA not pursuing missing persons too thoroughly, if at all, when the missing are "marginalised" (ie prostitutes, drug addicts). Horrible consequences of their attitudes! It appears it's pretty similar here in Oz?
"Shenher, formerly the lead investigator of Vancouver police’s investigation into missing women from the Downtown Eastside, was given a tip about serial killer Robert Pickton in July 1998, after he’d stabbed and nearly killed a sex worker. The attempted murder charge against him was stayed. But Pickton wasn’t arrested until February 2002, when cops first obtained a warrant to search his pig farm for illegal guns. There, they found personal items belonging to some of the missing women. Between the stayed charge and the time of his arrest, police believe Pickton killed an additional 21 women, many of them sex workers."😥
 

Power Raid

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I will add, there are many reasons why I'm intrigued by the CSK case:

1) I share an office with a lawyer caught up in the case, who was a boss of one of the victims
2) A navy mate who lived in Huntingdale in the 80s and 90s complained about the prowler
3) Just being a young guy, new to Perth and partying in Claremont in those days

and the one that bugs me.........did I pick up BRE as a hitchhiker?

4) I turned up to Perth and it took weeks for the military to get my car across, as such I hitch hiked from HMAS Stirling to everywhere often requiring two to four hitch hikes just to get to freo. As such I returned the favour when my car came across.

I picked up one hitch hiker in my car who looked like BREs as per his pic on the ship (but such a long time ago now - 1994(?)). I picked him up near Mosman and he said he wanted to go to Rockingham central. We spotted another hitch hiker, on cockburn road, and I asked him if it was OK we offered the second guy a lift.

Then the first guy asked to stop the car and wanted to get out on a dark stretch of Rockingham Road before Thomas. I thought it was a weird spot to get out but nothing more. The second guy sh*t himself thinking he was about to get mugged, given the dark spot we stopped but jumped in the front and we finished the journey.

We haven't heard of BRE hitch hiking, to date, so may be not but I can't help but feel it was.
 

Girlnextdoor

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I agree, you can't discount or exclude young male victims. After all, I don't feel any bloke smashing himself with home made dildos whilst wearing panties is 100% straight.

Further sexual violence may be the interest rather than women, attested to by being a cuckold and not performing in an intimate setting. So if it's sexual violence that gets a rise, does it need be a women or a man. He also chose petite women, as he could over power them and a boy would be no different in the dominance factor.

I don't know enough about the GR crime to say whether there are similarities.
Agree PR. I saw this article about Ted Bundy and perhaps his earliest victim. I'm trying to find the quote again as i read it recently, that Ted Bundy said something along the lines that killers never admit their child victims, some things are just "too dark" to talk about. I'll keep looking for it.

 

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zedx

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Not everybody agrees with me but I have BRE strongly for Julie Cutler's disappearance and I also have a slight suspicion for Gerard Ross. Not SM though imo.
Just want to bring up a point about GR 'apparently' not appearing to be sexually molested. (Please note I may be completely naive concerning this) I recently read a book set in the 1960's about a young mans journey discovering he was gay. It described his sexual activities. At no point during his life did he ever have 'penetrational' sex. It was always just 'sliding' between the thighs and apparently this is relatively common between gay men. I always thought there was always penetration involved. My point is, IMO this (along with other obvious types of non-penetrational sex )would leave no signs of sexual activity??
 

Likeamystery

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When I travelled to that end of town from Floreat (close enough to Claremont) I'd usually go up Guildford Road. I'd get there by state route 72 and Vincent St. Sometimes when I came back I'd go via Morley Drive and the freeway - this is longer but about the same time.

A route from Claremont could also be Stirling Highway to Vic Park (State Route 5) and then up great eastern.
An alternative is Railway Rd / Stubbs Tce to Harborne St and then State Route 72/Guildford.

Routes involving State Route 72 are generally quicker.

Edit: on a Sunday morning at 9am it was just on 30 minutes from Floreat to MIdland Gate Bellvue via State route 72. From Claremont it would be another 5-7 minutes.
And for your reference downtown Perth to home in Huntingdale could be done in 19 minutes at 2am without breaking the speed limit.
Is it possible for a young man to drive to all these places in one morning. Below is a proposed schedule for Sat 27 Jan 1996

2am (approx.) SS last seen waiting for taxi in Claremont
2.30-3am - Mosman park (next suburb to Claremont)
3am-4am - Mosman Park to Darlington (42kms)
4am-5am - Darlington to Huntingdale (30.7kms)
5am-7am - Shower and breakfast
7.20am - arrived at the Cook's house in Thornlie (next suburb to Huntingdale)
7.40am - Huntingdale to Dumas House West Perth (Sat morning, no peak hour traffic - 25kms)
8/8.10am- arrived for work at Dumas House West Perth (supervisor may have permitted ten minutes for being late)
 

Pamcake1

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Agree PR. I saw this article about Ted Bundy and perhaps his earliest victim. I'm trying to find the quote again as i read it recently, that Ted Bundy said something along the lines that killers never admit their child victims, some things are just "too dark" to talk about. I'll keep looking for it.

Yes, you are right they thought Ted Bundy's first victim was a little girl when he was still a boy himself.
 

shellyg

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Agree PR. I saw this article about Ted Bundy and perhaps his earliest victim. I'm trying to find the quote again as i read it recently, that Ted Bundy said something along the lines that killers never admit their child victims, some things are just "too dark" to talk about. I'll keep looking for it.

The general consensus among some professionals on why Bundy won't admit to child victims was embarrassment and fear of other prisoners knowing making him a bigger target.
 

Girlnextdoor

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Further to Bundy and his VERY strange childhood. This jumped out at me, his mother "compartmentalising", are you kidding me? Can a mother be THAT much in that river in Egypt? (Denial) This from a "mother" who pretended to be her son's sister for many years. Like that doesn't mess with a child's mind ever so slightly?

A reporter who had spent over 100 hours taping Bundy had this encounter with "Mommy Dearest"....
BBM (Bolded by Me)
“So I sat down with them in their house and played for her and her husband the audio tapes with the more telling confessions, the descriptions he had shared with us.
“I remember how she listened intently, and as she was listening she started making these little sounds, like someone was squeezing a mouse, it was very bizarre.
“But even more bizarre was when the recording was over and we turned off the tape recorder, and everybody sat there quietly.
“Then Louise suddenly stood up and clapped her hands and announced: ‘Whose for apple pie and ice-cream?’ It was just bizarre."
“She didn’t say any more about it and continued insisting, right up to his execution, that her boy could never have done those things.

Bundy has so many similarities to BRE's progression from the geeky kid that didn't fit in, to Peeping Tom/Ladies underwear fondler to Rapist, to (accused) killer?

 

Deva

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I agree, you can't discount or exclude young male victims. After all, I don't feel any bloke smashing himself with home made dildos whilst wearing panties is 100% straight.

Further sexual violence may be the interest rather than women, attested to by being a cuckold and not performing in an intimate setting. So if it's sexual violence that gets a rise, does it need be a women or a man. He also chose petite women, as he could over power them and a boy would be no different in the dominance factor.

I don't know enough about the GR crime to say whether there are similarities.
This has got me thinking on a few things, the Karrakatta victim was raped twice and one time anally, i wonder if back in the day seeing no DNA was found on JR and CG ( a lot to do with decomposition too) if this area was tested as well? Not being up with this stuff, is it tested regardless?
Maybe dressing up like he does, he does have gay tendencies as well?
 

Likeamystery

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Double time makes it all worth going in tired or sick.
Management were probably sick and tired of hearing him whinge that he had no money, so gave him some extra work.

Thinking back to being in my twenties sleep wasn't always a priority as long as I managed to get a couple of early nights over the following days. It's only alcohol which is problematic and the affects can last for days afterwards, and worse as we get older. As the accused didn't drink, he probably felt fine.

In addition: Yes LAM thanks to you we've got an appropriate nickname (VC = Vile Creature).

No one commented on my Avatar. I thought it looks so funny 🤣 .
The Wonder Woman one was so unlike me (LOL).
 
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Girlnextdoor

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Management were probably sick and tired of hearing him whinge that he had no money, so gave him some extra work.

Thinking back to being in my twenties sleep wasn't always a priority as long as I managed to get a couple of early nights over the following days. It's only alcohol which is problematic and the affects can last for days afterwards, and worse as we get older. As the accused didn't drink, he probably felt fine.

In addition: Yes LAM thanks to you we've got an appropriate nickname (VC = Vile Creature).

No one commented on my Avatar. I thought it looks so funny 🤣 .
The Wonder Woman one was so unlike me (LOL).
Oh i was going to comment LAM about the smoking of the Peace Pipe isn't it? 😉 That's one Groovy Granny!
Oh and glad the VC stuck, think he's well and truly earned that title!
 

Girlnextdoor

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Regarding Julie Cutler, I remembered she had a break in at her flat prior to going missing. She was also almost run off the road, an incident she reported to WAPOL and her father. The break in intrigues me, as i said before, BRE having access to private information via his job, like addresses. I wonder if any of Julie's underwear was stolen, this might not have even been noticed at the time? Julie was another Iona girl as well. Would be interesting to know if there are any other rape victims at the time of CSK (or earlier) who had and reported a break in at their homes prior to the rape? Just thinking perhaps one of BRE's MO when younger might have been chatting to women at their workplace, in a pub, just general chat, name, phone number if possible, what school did you go to, then getting all info he could from his job, stalking them, breaking in and stealing underwear, then following and raping them, graduating eventually to opportunistic blitzing/murder?
I wonder if any of the undies BRE had "adapted" that WAPOL found in his Kewdale house were from his victims?

I know this is not a media site, but it does have information from news reports.

 

Likeamystery

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Regarding Julie Cutler, I remembered she had a break in at her flat prior to going missing. She was also almost run off the road, an incident she reported to WAPOL and her father. The break in intrigues me, as i said before, BRE having access to private information via his job, like addresses. I wonder if any of Julie's underwear was stolen, this might not have even been noticed at the time? Julie was another Iona girl as well. Would be interesting to know if there are any other rape victims at the time of CSK (or earlier) who had and reported a break in at their homes prior to the rape? Just thinking perhaps one of BRE's MO when younger might have been chatting to women at their workplace, in a pub, just general chat, name, phone number if possible, what school did you go to, then getting all info he could from his job, stalking them, breaking in and stealing underwear, then following and raping them, graduating eventually to opportunistic blitzing/murder?
I wonder if any of the undies BRE had "adapted" that WAPOL found in his Kewdale house were from his victims?

I know this is not a media site, but it does have information from news reports.

Lorrin Whitehead from Bannockburn Victoria also went missing in Feb 2013. Lorrin was originally from Cottesloe and had attended Iona College in WA.
I've read beforehand that prior to going missing her house was broken into. She had recently changed back to her maiden name.

 

JezzaPerth

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Is it possible for a young man to drive to all these places in one morning. Below is a proposed schedule for Sat 27 Jan 1996

2am (approx.) SS last seen waiting for taxi in Claremont
2.30-3am - Mosman park (next suburb to Claremont)
3am-4am - Mosman Park to Darlington (42kms)
4am-5am - Darlington to Huntingdale (30.7kms)
5am-7am - Shower and breakfast
7.20am - arrived at the Cook's house in Thornlie (next suburb to Huntingdale)
7.40am - Huntingdale to Dumas House West Perth (Sat morning, no peak hour traffic - 25kms)
8/8.10am- arrived for work at Dumas House West Perth (supervisor may have permitted ten minutes for being late)
Your travel times are a bit conservative for the predawn bits. He'd have been able to average close on 60 km/h by driving on district distributor or higher class roads with lights set for through traffic, so closer to 45 minutes Mosman Park to Darlington, and 35 minutes Darlington to Huntingdale.

Huntingdale to Dumas house would be under 50 km/h - there is traffic from shop staff as well as saturday morning shift workers, so perhaps 35 - 40 minutes. The optimal route then would be Warton Rd, Spencer Rd, Nicholson Rd, Albany highway, Shepparton Rd, Foreshore, and weave up to Dumas via Mounts Bay Rd and spring st.

Anyway, plenty of time for a Darlington drop.
 

Likeamystery

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Your travel times are a bit conservative for the predawn bits. He'd have been able to average close on 60 km/h by driving on district distributor or higher class roads with lights set for through traffic, so closer to 45 minutes Mosman Park to Darlington, and 35 minutes Darlington to Huntingdale.

Huntingdale to Dumas house would be under 50 km/h - there is traffic from shop staff as well as saturday morning shift workers, so perhaps 35 - 40 minutes. The optimal route then would be Warton Rd, Spencer Rd, Nicholson Rd, Albany highway, Shepparton Rd, Foreshore, and weave up to Dumas via Mounts Bay Rd and spring st.

Anyway, plenty of time for a Darlington drop.
I’ve amended the schedule as per your input, and of course darkness was needed for the abduction/killing. There was ample time to get to Darlington and then back to Huntingdale in time for work. Proposed schedule for Sat 27 Jan 1996

2am (approx.) SS last seen waiting for taxi in Claremont
2.30am-3am - Mosman park (next suburb to Claremont)
3am-3.45am - Mosman Park to Darlington (42kms) 45mins
4am - Regional Forest near Darlington (1.5hrs before sunrise)

5.30am – Sunrise (Darlington residents start to waken)
5.30am-6.05am - Darlington to Huntingdale (30.7kms)35mins
6.10am-7am - Shower and breakfast

7.20am - arrived at the Cook's house in Thornlie (next suburb to Huntingdale)
7.20am–7.40am Worked on air-conditioner
7.40am - Left Thornlie for Dumas House West Perth 25kms 35/40mins - Sat morning, no peak hour traffic - Warton Rd, Spencer Rd, Nicholson Rd, Albany Hwy, Shepparton Rd, Foreshore, Mounts Bay Rd then Spring St

8/8.10am- arrive for work at Dumas House West Perth (supervisor may have permitted ten minutes for being late)

9.45pm Finished work at Dumas House (that’s such a long….. day, but as I say he didn’t have to bullock, just be there).

Sunday 28 1996 – time to sleep all day
 

Girlnextdoor

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I know we've talked about this creep before, but wanted to show how the burglary aspect (of lingerie) was also a huge part of the MO for the preparation to rape, and eventually torture and murder for this perpetrator. Perhaps it could have also been for BRE in earlier days? Wonder if BRE has any "selfies" like these? 😖
 

JezzaPerth

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I know we've talked about this creep before, but wanted to show how the burglary aspect (of lingerie) was also a huge part of the MO for the preparation to rape, and eventually torture and murder for this perpetrator. Perhaps it could have also been for BRE in earlier days? Wonder if BRE has any "selfies" like these? 😖
Thank goodness for digital cameras. Those photos would have been quite embarrassing to pick up from the chemist ;)
 
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