Analysis Clarko in 2019 “We’re a middle of the road team”

Remove this Banner Ad

bigbuddyboy

All Australian
Oct 10, 2009
730
352
Ivanhoe
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Other Teams
Liverpool
I compared 2000-2009 draft/trade period to the 2011-2020 draft/trade period. None of Gibson, Hale, Lake, Big Boy, Gunston, Burgoyne were at the club so why would I have them included??
Well, to respond; we were discussing the talent of our threepeat team vs the talent of our current team. Therefore, it would be fair to include the above mentioned players in any sort of comparison. But even with your list; you also included JOM, TOM, Chad, Frost, Phillips, Scrimshaw etc in the year they were drafted, not the year they arrived at Hawthorn... so if, again, you applied the above logic to the above players they would be 'included' in the 2001-2010 list.

But look - I'm think I'm going around in circles a bit and I don't think I need to. The results speak for themselves. Talent wise, our threepeat team was among the best ever. It's not shameful to say that our current list doesn't match that - very few teams in the history of AFL could say that they matched our team from 2012-2015. I really do hope for a bolus injection of young talent sooner, rather than later, as I think that, coupled with natural improvement, will see us start to look ominous again.

Peace out.
 

Log in to remove this ad.

Judd2Sewell

Brownlow Medallist
Aug 31, 2008
13,590
19,557
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Other Teams
Nuggets
Well, to respond; we were discussing the talent of our threepeat team vs the talent of our current team. Therefore, it would be fair to include the above mentioned players in any sort of comparison. But even with your list; you also included JOM, TOM, Chad, Frost, Phillips, Scrimshaw etc in the year they were drafted, not the year they arrived at Hawthorn... so if, again, you applied the above logic to the above players they would be 'included' in the 2001-2010 list.

But look - I'm think I'm going around in circles a bit and I don't think I need to. The results speak for themselves. Talent wise, our threepeat team was among the best ever. It's not shameful to say that our current list doesn't match that - very few teams in the history of AFL could say that they matched our team from 2012-2015. I really do hope for a bolus injection of young talent sooner, rather than later, as I think that, coupled with natural improvement, will see us start to look ominous again.

Peace out.
If the talent now is comparable to arguably the GOAT team, and certainly the most skilled team to ever play the game, then does this mean we have a coaching issue? Are the coaches holding us back? Perish the thought.
 

hk89

Norm Smith Medallist
Jul 12, 2009
7,880
9,578
Melbourne
AFL Club
Hawthorn
No one has ever assembled so much talent without some sort of draft advantage like priority picks etc. both pies and hawks won flags after receiving priority picks. Dogs and tigers won flags but I don’t think any of the priority picks made it into their premiership teams so not clear it was a factor. The draft is also way more compromised. It is going to be hard to go close to emulating that kind of list.
Good points. Just wanted to mention that Rance was an end-of-first-round priority pick for Tigers in 2007 after they finished last, so they also benefited, despite Deledio sadly (for him) jumping ship early.
 

Collins-Langford-Ayres

Hall of Famer
Mar 23, 2007
34,113
22,194
Where Premiership dreams are made...
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Other Teams
Man U, Canucks and 49ers
No one has ever assembled so much talent without some sort of draft advantage like priority picks etc. both pies and hawks won flags after receiving priority picks. Dogs and tigers won flags but I don’t think any of the priority picks made it into their premiership teams so not clear it was a factor. The draft is also way more compromised. It is going to be hard to go close to emulating that kind of list.
And yet we did it with the Giants and Suns getting huge bundles of early picks in the same period.

I have hope ! :)
 

Milkshaker

Club Legend
Nov 6, 2014
2,276
4,848
24 Barrack Street
AFL Club
Hawthorn
As the days roll by I become more and more perplexed with the Brooksby pickup.
Have to agree. Surely there was a fringe player somewhere, that could be enticed over from another club? One who had a few years development under their belt? McEvoy ageing, Cegs a stop gap at best, Pitt traded, Reeves a project ruck. A big opportunity existed for someone to come over, partner up with Reeves and stake a claim for the number one ruck spot? The door is wide open.

All I can think of is we wanted mature body and experienced player on the list to support Reeves or McEvoy is cooked and Cegs flakey, so we wanted a ruck who could match it with AFL ready bodies?

It is certainly hard to describe it as an 'aiming for another premiership' decision.
 

Timo pez

Debutant
Aug 31, 2018
121
96
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Have to agree. Surely there was a fringe player somewhere, that could be enticed over from another club? One who had a few years development under their belt? McEvoy ageing, Cegs a stop gap at best, Pitt traded, Reeves a project ruck. A big opportunity existed for someone to come over, partner up with Reeves and stake a claim for the number one ruck spot? The door is wide open.

All I can think of is we wanted mature body and experienced player on the list to support Reeves or McEvoy is cooked and Cegs flakey, so we wanted a ruck who could match it with AFL ready bodies?

It is certainly hard to describe it as an 'aiming for another premiership' decision.
He is a journeyman who has never been able to mix it at AFL level. We gave him a season where he played one game against Sydney (and looked a lonnng way off it) and then offered him another year. Once again, our whole ruck philosophy is way off the way the league is going.
 

Lickmesocks

Club Legend
Oct 2, 2019
1,235
4,401
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Jeff’s letter was very clever and well crafted.

He was basically admitting what we all knew that it’s going to be a really tough season and the expectations are low......

It’s the first time I have heard anyone from higher up lower the expectations for all members/supporters.
 

Hawk_francais

Premiership Player
Sep 20, 2015
3,427
6,807
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Out of contract this year:

Hardwick
Koschitzke
Moore
Morrison
Cousins
Howe
Hanrahan
O’Brien

Reckon it’s only the last four who might be worried about their spot. The more I think about Gunston coming back, Lewis a lock with Kosi and Jeka emerging... the more I think the time has come for Timmy. Without an injury to any of the above, I can’t see him staying. Kind of makes it clear why he’s being given the opportunity to put together a strong campaign. His inconsistency is killing him though.
 

The hands of stone

All Australian
Sep 13, 2020
921
2,215
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Jeff’s letter was very clever and well crafted.

He was basically admitting what we all knew that it’s going to be a really tough season and the expectations are low......

It’s the first time I have heard anyone from higher up lower the expectations for all members/supporters.
He did an interview on Talking Hawks last night , fair to say he said it was always going to be a tough season without exactly saying it .
Certainly gave the impression of fairly low expectations within the club about our prospects this season .
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

cryptor

Premium Gold
May 11, 2008
19,089
41,541
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Out of contract this year:

Hardwick
Koschitzke
Moore
Morrison
Cousins
Howe
Hanrahan
O’Brien

Reckon it’s only the last four who might be worried about their spot. The more I think about Gunston coming back, Lewis a lock with Kosi and Jeka emerging... the more I think the time has come for Timmy. Without an injury to any of the above, I can’t see him staying. Kind of makes it clear why he’s being given the opportunity to put together a strong campaign. His inconsistency is killing him though.
I don't think Hanrahan should be worried. Pretty safe I reckon.

Howe and O'Brien likely to get offered extensions if they're still getting regular games. But hopefully only modest ones. They'd still be good depth once the younger players pass them.

Cousins I can see being offered an extension but ultimately getting picked up by another club with a better offer for more opportunity. Unless he starts getting that opportunity with us over the rest of the season.
 

TylerDurden

Premium Platinum
Mar 5, 2007
13,618
39,468
Lou's Tavern
AFL Club
Hawthorn
I don't think Hanrahan should be worried. Pretty safe I reckon.

Howe and O'Brien likely to get offered extensions if they're still getting regular games. But hopefully only modest ones. They'd still be good depth once the younger players pass them.

Cousins I can see being offered an extension but ultimately getting picked up by another club with a better offer for more opportunity. Unless he starts getting that opportunity with us over the rest of the season.
If Ollie produces the same pressure he did v Dees, on a constant basis, he'll get an extension.
 

Hodgey 15

Club Legend
Aug 2, 2013
1,992
4,632
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Out of contract this year:

Hardwick
Koschitzke
Moore
Morrison
Cousins
Howe
Hanrahan
O’Brien

Reckon it’s only the last four who might be worried about their spot. The more I think about Gunston coming back, Lewis a lock with Kosi and Jeka emerging... the more I think the time has come for Timmy. Without an injury to any of the above, I can’t see him staying. Kind of makes it clear why he’s being given the opportunity to put together a strong campaign. His inconsistency is killing him though.
I agree about TOB. I reckon he's gone end of season unless some unforeseen circumstances force the club to keep him.
 

The hands of stone

All Australian
Sep 13, 2020
921
2,215
AFL Club
Hawthorn
If you read a lot of oppo fans comments on the neutral threads, one thing they all say is this:
Hawthorn have a backline that is stacked for young talent for years.

It's exciting.

Time to build the forward line and add a few planks to the midfield.
Part of the reason I think we can rebound/rebuild fairly quickly .
Cant wait to see Sicily added into mix , very exciting just got to be patient to see it .
 

HODGEYROAD

Brownlow Medallist
May 10, 2007
18,567
20,263
Bonbeach
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Other Teams
Arsenal Fc Portland Trailblazers
If you read a lot of oppo fans comments on the neutral threads, one thing they all say is this:
Hawthorn have a backline that is stacked for young talent for years.

It's exciting.

Time to build the forward line and add a few planks to the midfield.
Just need a quality Full Back, that's the only think the Backline is missing.
 

mustang

All Australian
Oct 8, 2004
892
589
Melbourne
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Other Teams
Leeds United
Hopefully DGB can develop in to that given the fact another intercept defender is the last thing this team needs. Would of preferred drafting Holland given how our midfield lacks class and goal kickers.
Will probably be turned into a Fwd


“The definition of insanity is playing some players over and over again, but expecting different results and performances.”
 

Easy Slips Catch

Norm Smith Medallist
Jun 10, 2006
5,367
3,786
Fringe
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Other Teams
Melbourne Storm
We definitely are a mid table team. I'd rather be good or bad. Clarko's comments came across as flippant. It should have been as a stark warning.
 

Hawk_francais

Premiership Player
Sep 20, 2015
3,427
6,807
AFL Club
Hawthorn
We're getting there. Already made inroads into the forward line - Kosi and Lewis coming along nicely - Jeka to get a crack sooner or later.

Next up in the "how to stop being a middle-of-the-road team" handbook is to work out what we're doing wrong around the ball. Jom and Mitchell getting through a power of work in there, was confused at Cousins' inclusion into the side only to see him attend less than 1/4 of centre bounces. With Jom, Tom, Worpel, Wingard - we just need one more who can get it going our way.
 

Remove this Banner Ad