Analysis Clarko in 2019 “We’re a middle of the road team”

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Realist

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We were second on the ladder at the time, bit of a difference.
I don’t like to justify my posts but the point was would the Clarkson circa 2021 still do the same thing if he was coaching the 07 side, NOT the rabble he is coaching in 2021. I think not.

Sorry if it was too subtle for you to pick up. I’ll try to be more obvious next time.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com
 

theiaofseed

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Didn't see it coming that quickly I'll admit, but I was alot more bullish about our under 23 players in 2005, eg Hodge, Mitchell, Franklin, Roughead and Lewis.

I was actually rather annoyed in 2010 as I thought we'd be a top 4 side going into that season, so no whilst I didn't think a 3 peat would arrive I was very bullish about our list and top end talent then.
2005 Mitchell and Hodge were nothing super special and this point in 2005 Franklin, Roughead and Lewis had shown less than Kosi, Day and Worpel suggesting other wise is playing captain hindsight
 

HODGEYROAD

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2005 Mitchell and Hodge were nothing super special and this point in 2005 Franklin, Roughead and Lewis had shown less than Kosi, Day and Worpel suggesting other wise is playing captain hindsight
Hodge was an All Australian in 2005 at the age of 21 so stop talking nonsense for a start. Then again aren't you the poster that tried to justify our current top players being as good as our top players in the 3 peat in another thread ? lol. So I shouldn't be suprised.
 

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Jazzfan

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2005 Mitchell and Hodge were nothing super special and this point in 2005 Franklin, Roughead and Lewis had shown less than Kosi, Day and Worpel suggesting other wise is playing captain hindsight
Hodge was All-Australian in 2005 and won the Crimmins medal. Mitchell may have even won the Crimmins if not for getting injured and only playing 14 games (where he averaged 25 touches a game).

Franklin, Roughead and Lewis had just been taken picks 2, 5 and 7 in the 2004 draft. I guess you might be too young to remember how exciting they looked from early on. Lewis averaged 16 touches a game in 2005. Buddy a goal a game as an 18 year old key forward, and Rough showed plenty playing CHB, as an 18 year old.
 
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darthmann

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i think it is more meritious to discuss the moves we've made since the end of 2019 than 2017-19, that's been done, it's failed, let's look at the current rebuilding strategy and see what comes of it.

By the end of next year we will hopefully have 5 top 25 kids running around in our best 22. It's a start. We need a couple of other pieces to complement them. Are they the Henderson's, Frost's of the world, or can we snag a Zezz, Cerra type player? Will a Morris, Downie type come in and take their spot the way Smith, Breust and Shiels did?
 

H00t

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I hate that I think this, even as hard as I try and push it away, but fck, Essendon are showing us in every way what a rebuilding team should look like. You can take losing watching your team playing with the boldness and attacking nature of youth. It feels like the bombers kids are out there enjoying themselves without the worry of making mistakes, without being overcoached in every facet of the game. As we are.
Their kids are playing and doing some very exciting things for them. Perkins and Cox especially. Some of their other high draft picks playing well also.

Not necessarily planned by them but like Port before them showing the benefit of hitting the draft hard. Lucky it’s Essendon and they will stuff it up. (Getting pick 7 for Daniher rather than picks 3 and 9)

Just look at the excitement Day brings to our fans. Who doesn’t want more of that? Build a strong core to drive us up the ladder in a number of years. This floundering in no mans land doesn’t work. And we are running low on bargaining chips and talent half due to trading for the 3-peat and half the car crash after it.

So it’s time to start low and hit the draft pick, get players than are way undervalued at other clubs. Think your Amon, Scrimshaw, Impey etc. let’s not go for people injured. See what extra draft picks we can get. Then play those younger guys we see a future in. If we win 2-3 more games with older guys but the youngsters don’t get game time or played out of position. Worps and Finn on the half forward flank for instance. Did we really win? Move the older heads around.

Let’s face it full team in and we aren’t good, let alone with a couple of injuries.
 

Lethality

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Clarko has been slow to play youth after 2008. We should have continued playing our draftees after 2016, with a few judicious trades like Tom Mitchell; at least I think that would've yielded better results than throwing all our draft picks at Wingard and OMeara.

Playing a few kids doesn't necessarily mean taking a step back. It often reinvigorates a side.

I like where we're at right now. There's a few senior players who should have their papers stamped, but we can hang our hat on a few new guys who are showing they have what it takes.
 

theiaofseed

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Hodge was an All Australian in 2005 at the age of 21 so stop talking nonsense for a start. Then again aren't you the poster that tried to justify our current top players being as good as our top players in the 3 peat in another thread ? lol. So I shouldn't be suprised.
No I've never stated that, try again buddy

Hodge won an All Australian selection in round 7? If you want to be fair with comparison but lets face you when are you ever balanced and fair. We can only compare round 7 2005 to round 7 2021. Again Hodge and Mitchell were good but not special and no one single AA doesnt make you special, nor would any sane person think Mitchells and Hodges 2005 would ever lead to the careers they had.
 
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PhatHQ

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Do lots of the mournful posters just have this saved for copy and paste each week, year in, year out?
Mournful... come on mate. I’m pretty sure I have been rather optimistic throughout the duration but have always been pushing a line of getting to the top end of the draft for 3-4 years.
I’m happy with the trades that have been made just not then ones that didn’t happen.
I wonder if at the end of 2017 with 2018 in mind we made a trade and picked up Bailey Smith and another trade in the same period for a future pick and landed Anderson, Jackson or Serong.
Hawthorn are middle of the road not because they didn’t try. It’s because they didn’t see what was coming and didn’t try hard enough.
 

Harper_Hawk

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Got similar mail.
Wouldn't surprise me if Buckley ended up coaching Hawthorn one day. I know many will cringe. I think he needs a change away from Collingwood and maybe we need some new ideas. Maybe even Clarkson would take a director of football at the club . Sam Mitchell is not our answer and he's buying his time to coach another new regime in his own right. Maybe just maybe we need new ideas. Clarkson is magnificent. But nothing is forever.
 

Judd2Sewell

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No I've never stated that, try again buddy

Hodge won an All Australian selection in round 7? If you want to be fair with comparison but lets face you when are you ever balanced and fair. We can only compare round 7 2005 to round 7 2021. Again Hodge and Mitchell were good but not special and no one single AA doesnt make you special, nor would any sane person think Mitchells and Hodges 2005 would ever lead to the careers they had.
Mitchell and Hodge in particular were superb in 2005.

Mitchell was being likened to Diesel Williams by coaches such as Malthouse during that season (early, as in May 2005 in fact).

Hodge also averaged just under 28 touches per game. 30 touches back then is the equivalent of 40 now.

I think it was pretty clear to anyone paying attention that their careers were going to be special.

Roughie, Franklin and Lewis also generated a lot of excitement too.

There was a feeling that we were on to something special back then.
 

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darthmann

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Mitchell and Hodge in particular were superb in 2005.

Mitchell was being likened to Diesel Williams by coaches such as Malthouse during that season (early, as in May 2005 in fact).

Hodge also averaged just under 28 touches per game. 30 touches back then is the equivalent of 40 now.

I think it was pretty clear to anyone paying attention that their careers were going to be special.

Roughie, Franklin and Lewis also generated a lot of excitement too.

There was a feeling that we were on to something special back then.
i reckon you could argue the same about worpel in 19, but unfortunately hasn't panned out as well as that

I think we still definitely outperformed our overall list talent in 08 (our top end was as good as any in the comp bar geelong though), which is why its such a ******* good grand final. Beating Geelong who only lost 1 game all year, getting Crawf the flag, it was so sweet
 

Strapping Young Lad

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Wouldn't surprise me if Buckley ended up coaching Hawthorn one day. I know many will cringe. I think he needs a change away from Collingwood and maybe we need some new ideas. Maybe even Clarkson would take a director of football at the club . Sam Mitchell is not our answer and he's buying his time to coach another new regime in his own right. Maybe just maybe we need new ideas. Clarkson is magnificent. But nothing is forever.
Buckley is done, mate. He won’t get another senior gig.
 

Harper_Hawk

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Buckley is done, mate. He won’t get another senior gig.
Don't be sure about that mate. He has the weight of Collingwood fraternity and expectations on his back and a noose around his neck at all times even if they aren't top 4. He's a good coach. It's not a coaching gig anyone would want to take on.
 

almuz

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I feel like our team is without identity as a playing group re game plans etc. Anyone with a little more tactical knowledge feel free to correct me (I could be way off the mark here), but it seems we do not have a readily recognisable play style.

We aren't a control the ball team like Cats, Weagles or '21 Port or a pressure/surge team like Tigers, Brisbane, Lions or '20 Saints. It probably comes with the territory of being a young side without all pieces in place but I would love to see us slowly aim towards some semblance of a brand of footy over the next season or two.

The grind teams down and scrap goals of the past couple seasons has been grim watching. We have been playing on a bit more this season which is great - in five years time I'd love for us to be an attacking team that plays a good brand of footy. I really think an overlapping style would suit our backline well with spread from contests similar to what (sort of can't believe I am saying this) the Dees are doing this year.
 

Hawk_francais

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I feel like our team is without identity as a playing group re game plans etc. Anyone with a little more tactical knowledge feel free to correct me (I could be way off the mark here), but it seems we do not have a readily recognisable play style.

We aren't a control the ball team like Cats, Weagles or '21 Port or a pressure/surge team like Tigers, Brisbane, Lions or '20 Saints. It probably comes with the territory of being a young side without all pieces in place but I would love to see us slowly aim towards some semblance of a brand of footy over the next season or two.

The grind teams down and scrap goals of the past couple seasons has been grim watching. We have been playing on a bit more this season which is great - in five years time I'd love for us to be an attacking team that plays a good brand of footy. I really think an overlapping style would suit our backline well with spread from contests similar to what (sort of can't believe I am saying this) the Dees are doing this year.
I have total faith in Clarko about the game plan. Between he, Bolton, Mcrea there is plenty of tactical know-how.

The only part we need to be worried about is whether we have the time and talent to make it work. Some of our special players like McEvoy, Gunston, Bruest and Shiels might run out of the former before we have the latter.
 
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TylerDurden

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Wouldn't surprise me if Buckley ended up coaching Hawthorn one day. I know many will cringe. I think he needs a change away from Collingwood and maybe we need some new ideas. Maybe even Clarkson would take a director of football at the club . Sam Mitchell is not our answer and he's buying his time to coach another new regime in his own right. Maybe just maybe we need new ideas. Clarkson is magnificent. But nothing is forever.
Most believe the Mitchell transition was agreed to long ago. I'd be staggered if Sam goes to another club now.
 

HODGEYROAD

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Mitchell and Hodge in particular were superb in 2005.

Mitchell was being likened to Diesel Williams by coaches such as Malthouse during that season (early, as in May 2005 in fact).

Hodge also averaged just under 28 touches per game. 30 touches back then is the equivalent of 40 now.

I think it was pretty clear to anyone paying attention that their careers were going to be special.

Roughie, Franklin and Lewis also generated a lot of excitement too.

There was a feeling that we were on to something special back then.
It's personal opinion I suppose and my personal opinion is I had a lot more excitement about our club in 2005, largerly due to the fact we had a lot more young talent IMO and we also had a hungry ruthless young coach ready to make his mark.

It would be handy for us now if PP was still a thing for winning 5 or less games, Picks 2 and 4 this year would be a godsend.
 

Billyc

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2005 Mitchell and Hodge were nothing super special and this point in 2005 Franklin, Roughead and Lewis had shown less than Kosi, Day and Worpel suggesting other wise is playing captain hindsight
Mitchell won the rising star and Hodge was the first pick in the super draft and an All Australian. Hodge polled 15 Brownlow votes in 2005 and Mitchell 9 before getting injured mid season. You are just making stuff up. They always looked great
 

theiaofseed

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Mitchell won the rising star and Hodge was the first pick in the super draft and an All Australian. Hodge polled 15 Brownlow votes in 2005 and Mitchell 9 before getting injured mid season. You are just making stuff up. They always looked great
I never said they didn't :drunk:
 

Bruno Oresar

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No I've never stated that, try again buddy

Hodge won an All Australian selection in round 7? If you want to be fair with comparison but lets face you when are you ever balanced and fair. We can only compare round 7 2005 to round 7 2021. Again Hodge and Mitchell were good but not special and no one single AA doesnt make you special, nor would any sane person think Mitchells and Hodges 2005 would ever lead to the careers they had.
Cmon man. You get rolled with contradictory and incontrovertible facts time after time and still dig in. You are starting to look very foolish.
 

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