Coach Grumpy

[frankrizzo]

"You guys just pretend it's make believe".
Don't know where you pull that from TBH.

My main concern is that a large majority blame him for selections or when we lose, yet he hardly gets any credits for when we do well. Just like you have done.

It's pretty hard for a coach to be judged when using that criteria TBH.

It's not about results though anyway its just reality that if the skipper and coach don't work well together one of them will have to make way, bob simpson was a far more successful coach than langer yet was moved aside to allow taylor to run the team his way.

if cummins tells CA langer is our guy i can work with him then of course sign him to a long term but he clearly hasnt done anything like that or langer would already be signed back up, if cummins wants a new direction why wouldn't we back him?

 

[anchor man]

what is? hazlewoods quote or the story after story saying exactly that? the player mutiny actually happened you know this right? langers role was reduced after the mutiny this is widely known outside of it some WA blokes on bigfooty believing langers abrasive coaching style was what won them the 20/20 wc and ashes.

Gee I could have sworn that there was much more to it than just that simpleton answer.
Langer along with Tim Paine led Australian cricket out of the dark depths of the South African drama when CA couldn't.
If he ruffled a few precious feathers on the likes of Cummins Warner and a few others, then he and Paine did their job.
If he had to be abrasive to burst the overly large egos of the self righteous, then abrasive it should have been. Maybe they have been like the school yard bullies that have been taken on and taken down. They couldn't handle being told they were dicks.
Australian cricket blossomed because of Langer Paine.

 

[anchor man]

Gee I could have sworn that there was much more to it than just that simpleton answer.
Langer along with Tim Paine led Australian cricket out of the dark depths of the South African drama when CA couldn't.
If he ruffled a few precious feathers on the likes of Cummins Warner and a few others, then he and Paine did their job.
If he had to be abrasive to burst the overly large egos of the self righteous, then abrasive it should have been. Maybe they have been like the school yard bullies that have been taken on and taken down. They couldn't handle being told they were dicks.
Australian cricket blossomed because of Langer Paine.
Oh and if Cummins and the others who are getting sore arses from fence sitting about Langer, show some balls and say, "He is not the man for the job". stop pissing things about by not standing by your convictions, as Langer has all along.

 

[Tugga27]

It's not about results though anyway its just reality that if the skipper and coach don't work well together one of them will have to make way, bob simpson was a far more successful coach than langer yet was moved aside to allow taylor to run the team his way.

if cummins tells CA langer is our guy i can work with him then of course sign him to a long term but he clearly hasnt done anything like that or langer would already be signed back up, if cummins wants a new direction why wouldn't we back him?

If you don't think it's about results, you're kidding yourself.
It's always about results.

Cummins has been captain for all of 5 tests.
I don't agree with letting the tail wag the dog.

They might not agree on everything, but I'm sure they're mature enough to make it work.

 

[LukeParkerno1]

If you don't think it's about results, you're kidding yourself.
It's always about results.

Cummins has been captain for all of 5 tests.
I don't agree with letting the tail wag the dog.

They might not agree on everything, but I'm sure they're mature enough to make it work.

Happy enough for the new captain and VC to get the coach they want. The one thing I want is the coach removed for good with selections.

 

[anchor man]

Happy enough for the new captain and VC to get the coach they want. The one thing I want is the coach removed for good with selections.

As long as they are from NSW!!!

 

[LukeParkerno1]

As long as they are from NSW!!!

I’d be happy with Bayliss if that’s the way they want to go, MCDonald I’d be happy enough with. Honestly coaches do very little they are mentors they shouldn’t be coaching at test level otherwise we are picking blokes that aren’t ready or have flawed techniques

 

[Tugga27]

Happy enough for the new captain and VC to get the coach they want. The one thing I want is the coach removed for good with selections.

I agree with the coach not being a selector.

The captain and VC shouldnt be selecting a coach.
Have an opinion, but that's about it.

 

[LukeParkerno1]

I agree with the coach not being a selector.

The captain and VC shouldnt be selecting a coach.
Have an opinion, but that's about it.

They do have to reasonably get on. That doesn’t mean they have to be in love with each other but they have to get on.

 

[frankrizzo]

I agree with the coach not being a selector.

The captain and VC shouldnt be selecting a coach.
Have an opinion, but that's about it.

mark taylor got to hand pick his coach and that worked out just fine didnt it? Look if cummins and senior guys cant work with langer but CA want langer then sack cummins bring back paine then but if they dont have a good working relationship something has to give.

if they can all work well together langer will be offered a new deal and cummins stays skipper which is fine with me.

 

[Tugga27]

mark taylor got to hand pick his coach and that worked out just fine didnt it? Look if cummins and senior guys cant work with langer but CA want langer then sack cummins bring back paine then but if they dont have a good working relationship something has to give.

if they can all work well together langer will be offered a new deal and cummins stays skipper which is fine with me.

Where do you get the idea Mark Taylor picked Simpson as coach?
Pretty sure Simpson was already the coach when Taylor was made captain but happy to be proved wrong.

Bringing back Paine is silly and I'm sure a joke.
The bottom line is, the board picks the coach with a few senior players input.

Let's face it, it's not like AFL where the player can change clubs.

I seriously doubt the relationship is that toxic that they can't work together TBH.

 

[to1994]

"You guys just pretend it's make believe".
Don't know where you pull that from TBH.

My main concern is that a large majority blame him for selections or when we lose, yet he hardly gets any credits for when we do well. Just like you have done.

It's pretty hard for a coach to be judged when using that criteria TBH.

You basically ignored what he said though?

The results were ordinary outside of a drawn series against England while Langer had full control of the side.

The players basically said, get rid of him and Cricket Australia responded by moving him to the side-lines, suddenly results improved.

I find it odd that your takeaway from that is basically that people are blaming failures on Langer and praising the assistants when we win, missing all context.
I'd also be interested to see how many backers of Langer don't live in WA or didn't previously play with him.

 

[frankrizzo]

Where do you get the idea Mark Taylor picked Simpson as coach?
Pretty sure Simpson was already the coach when Taylor was made captain but happy to be proved wrong.

Bringing back Paine is silly and I'm sure a joke.
The bottom line is, the board picks the coach with a few senior players input.

Let's face it, it's not like AFL where the player can change clubs.

I seriously doubt the relationship is that toxic that they can't work together TBH.

taylor wanted simpson out and his pick marsh in, simpson wanted a new deal and certainly had results on the board but was denied and the skipper was given his man.

Taylor and beyond by malcolm knox goes into detail about it and is a good read if you are interested.

 

[Phone]

Where do you get the idea Mark Taylor picked Simpson as coach?
Pretty sure Simpson was already the coach when Taylor was made captain but happy to be proved wrong.

Wrong way around

I n cricket, the coach is the head of the support staff, helping prepare the team to then be handed over to the captain on the field. And depending on whom that captain is, the coach may also need to take much more of a peripheral role off the field also.

It’s patently clear that with Paine as Test captain, the dynamic with Langer was similar to that of Allan Border and Bob Simpson, where the coach was a major decision-making figure. But when Mark Taylor replaced Border in 1994, Simpson first saw his role reduced – after the board consulted the senior players Taylor, Steve Waugh, David Boon and Ian Healy – and then concluded in 1996. His replacement, the amiable Geoff Marsh, was a much less dominant figure.

“I’d been thinking about who I would like ideally as a coach,” Taylor revealed some years later. “And it was someone who would keep the side lively, keep the drills interesting. But in terms of the tactics, I didn’t think I needed a Bob Simpson-style coach. I had Waughs, Warne, Healy; some very smart cricketers. We didn’t need too much extra.”

A couple of decades on, and there is plenty of evidence to suggest that the men’s captains, Cummins and Finch, are open to a similar change. Langer, much as he did last year when publicly challenged about his management style, is responding as an inveterate fighter does. Matthew Hayden, Ricky Ponting, Adam Gilchrist and even Shane Warne have followed suit.

Role player or coach for life? The Justin Langer disconnect

Justin Langer has reached what he sees as the pinnacle of coaching and wants to remain in the job for a long, long time.

www.smh.com.au

 

[Tugga27]

You basically ignored what he said though?

The results were ordinary outside of a drawn series against England while Langer had full control of the side.

The players basically said, get rid of him and Cricket Australia responded by moving him to the side-lines, suddenly results improved.

I find it odd that your takeaway from that is basically that people are blaming failures on Langer and praising the assistants when we win, missing all context.
I'd also be interested to see how many backers of Langer don't live in WA or didn't previously play with him.

When he first took over, he had team bereft of confidence minus his best two bats.

You can't take out a series because it doesn't suite your narrative.
He has to judged on all of the games he's coached so far.
So far, we've been improving, especially this last 12 months.

I don't know why you think I find it odd about people blaming him for losses and getting no credit for wins because you're doing it.

You want to discount the Ashes away and the WC.

I've stated before, I don't care who coaches the team.
It's not like an AFL team.

But I think there has to be a balance when it comes to judging him which there doesn't seem to be a lot of.

If he's so bad and his relationship with the players is that toxic, just get rid of him.

 

[Tugga27]

taylor wanted simpson out and his pick marsh in, simpson wanted a new deal and certainly had results on the board but was denied and the skipper was given his man.

Taylor and beyond by malcolm knox goes into detail about it and is a good read if you are interested.

Apologies mate.
Thought you were saying Taylor picked Simpson.

 

[BStaff17]

As long as they are from NSW!!!

Who was the last Australian cricket coach from NSW probably Bob Simpson.

This rhetoric that NSW run CA or CA only pick NSW people is rubbish.

Langer, Lehmann, Mickey Arthur, Neilsen, Buchanan, Geoff Marsh are all from other states.

Mark Waugh was the only selector from NSW thats been on the NSP in the past 20 years as well.

 

[anchor man]

Who was the last Australian cricket coach from NSW probably Bob Simpson.

This rhetoric that NSW run CA or CA only pick NSW people is rubbish.

Langer, Lehmann, Mickey Arthur, Neilsen, Buchanan, Geoff Marsh are all from other states.

Mark Waugh was the only selector from NSW thats been on the NSP in the past 20 years as well.

The happenings of now are coming from NSW. The Captain is not happy. Or so we read. We have not heard from Cummins. Is he letting other do his dirty work!!!
The smiling silent assassin it seems. Or so would appear.

 

[LukeParkerno1]

The happenings of now are coming from NSW. The Captain is not happy. Or so we read. We have not heard from Cummins. Is he letting other do his dirty work!!!
The smiling silent assassin it seems. Or so would appear.

Why does he even have to? Let CA sort it out.

 

[anchor man]

Why does he even have to? Let CA sort it out.

He needs to clear the air. Langer is in need of having Cummins knife out of his back.

 

[LukeParkerno1]

He needs to clear the air. Langer is in need of having Cummins knife out of his back.

Or he can enjoy his break which he deserves and look forward to the IPL auction

 

[anchor man]

Or he can enjoy his break which he deserves and look forward to the IPL auction

If you are talking about Cummins, will he need the knife again.
He needs to clear the air.

 

[BStaff17]

The happenings of now are coming from NSW. The Captain is not happy. Or so we read. We have not heard from Cummins. Is he letting other do his dirty work!!!
The smiling silent assassin it seems. Or so would appear.

Well pat cummins is the captain. He should have some say on weather he wants Langer to stay on.

Aaron Finch hasn't exactly endorsed Langer either.

You cant have your captain and coach not on the same page in any sporting team its not going to work.

I remember the test documentary when Usman Khawaja called Langer out that everyone was on eggshells because of his demeanour.

Both home summers we have lost to india at home have been brutal losses and going off the media reports after last year the players have had enough of Langer's volatility and mood swings.

Having been in a workplace before when the boss is volatile and unpredictable. Its nothing worse then being in an environment not knowing how the boss will react over how something is said and your in the background anxious of when he the timebomb will explode.

Not saying Langer is exactly that but there is plenty of leaks out there suggesting that Langer's emotions aren't stable enough for that role.

 

[LukeParkerno1]

If you are talking about Cummins, will he need the knife again.
He needs to clear the air.

No he doesn’t that isn’t his job. Let CA deal with it. I’m sure he’s given his thoughts to CA. Doesn’t need to do more than this

 

[Voice of the G]

The best test captain for Australia and will never happen,Glen Maxwell.Future beyond cricket a Australian coach or even better in the media.Love his work when miked up in the T20 crap.