Analysis Coaching discussion 2017

[Marc_Remillard]

TBH I agree with Marc_Remillard that we've been looking for too many excuses for the team.

Do I think we're screwed? No, but you'd want to see serious improvement next year. Sick of people saying stuff like 'We would have lost that by 10 goals two years ago' and 'North aren't a bad side'. The 22 we've had out on the park had had more talent in it than the opposition in at least 7 of 9 games this year and they simply aren't performing.

Goodwin has impressed me with a lot of his tactical stuff but the fact we are still getting performances like Sunday worries me.

That's fair and very generous to me

 

[saj_21]

Big tick for Goodwin? He allowed us to enter the season with only one genuine ruckman on our list, it was always going to be a massive risk, even people here on BF saw the dangers of it. But what did he do? He went and got a HBF'er, and yes Hibberd as performed well, but a HBF'er was not what we desperately needed. Our list is badly unbalanced and we're paying the cost of it.

Also the decision to give Viney the captaincy was extremely poor and it caused problems in the club. It was completely unnecessary.

But I suppose that was another tick for Goodwin

One genuine ruckman what do you call spencer?

We needed someone like hibbered without him there is no one attacking or reliable enough to kick out of defence it's still an issue with our talls.

You have every right to question what is going on but your original post was hinting at whether Goodwin was the right option which is ridiculous as this is his first season as senior coach being promoted from senior assistant coach.

Not all is going well, some things are working and some things aren't. But it's not all doom and gloom.

 

[Dark Avenger]

Goodwin is into his third year of the succession plan. If he is considered a straight up first year coach then what was the whole point of having the succession plan in the first place?

I think the club erred by not sacking him last season.

 

[Cannon82]

One genuine ruckman what do you call spencer?

The most gainfully employed temp in the world?

 

[saj_21]

The most gainfully employed temp in the world?

still a back up ruck man

 

[Toump Ass]

The 22 we've had out on the park had had more talent in it than the opposition in at least 7 of 9 games this year and they simply aren't performing.

Shame so much of that talent is invested in players like Oliver, Hunt, Harmes, Hannan, Petracca, ANB, Stretch, Weed etc. etc... when they've all played 50 games let's hope they're showing the consistency they're not capable of now.

FWIW I think you're underestimating the loss of both Gawn and Gawn as well; "every team has injuries", but what other team is without a recognised ruckman and has to improvise with their full back and best forward?

I'm keen af to see the Dees in the finals but 2017 was never a certainty. 2018- baring catastrophe- we'll be in it for sure.

 

[Sando22]

Shame so much of that talent is invested in players like Oliver, Hunt, Harmes, Hannan, Petracca, ANB, Stretch, Weed etc. etc... when they've all played 50 games let's hope they're showing the consistency they're not capable of now.

FWIW I think you're underestimating the loss of both Gawn and Gawn as well; "every team has injuries", but what other team is without a recognised ruckman and has to improvise with their full back and best forward?

I'm keen af to see the Dees in the finals but 2017 was never a certainty. 2018- baring catastrophe- we'll be in it for sure.

In the nicest way possible.....

 

[Toump Ass]

In the nicest way possible.....

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

WTF is Billy Madison anyway?

 

[stretcharmstrong]

In the nicest way possible.....

Er what? Bit over the top? Thought Toump Ass's post was pretty on point...

 

[Marc_Remillard]

One genuine ruckman what do you call spencer?

We needed someone like hibbered without him there is no one attacking or reliable enough to kick out of defence it's still an issue with our talls.

You have every right to question what is going on but your original post was hinting at whether Goodwin was the right option which is ridiculous as this is his first season as senior coach being promoted from senior assistant coach.

Not all is going well, some things are working and some things aren't. But it's not all doom and gloom.

Spencer is not, and has never been, a valid option as a ruckman. If he hasn't shown something by now I doubt it will happen during the twilight of his career, the only reason why he is still on the list is because we have no one else.

 

[saj_21]

Spencer is not, and has never been, a valid option as a ruckman. If he hasn't shown something by now I doubt it will happen during the twilight of his career, the only reason why he is still on the list is because we have no one else.

Haha that's funny, you can argue he is not a good footballer but to say he isn't a ruckmen is laughable. That's all he is, secondly most would agree up until this year he hasn't looked up to AFL standard but he showed signs in the pre season he has improved and was serviceable in his one game against Freo.

 

[ThePuppetMaster]

Goody you star!

 

[d33my]

He's a weird dude. Haven't seen him truly melt yet. He obviously has unwavering faith in the game plan, and somehow can impart that to the players even when they're having a 'mare. Good sign for a senior coach I would have thought.

 

[Marc_Remillard]

Haha that's funny, you can argue he is not a good footballer but to say he isn't a ruckmen is laughable. That's all he is, secondly most would agree up until this year he hasn't looked up to AFL standard but he showed signs in the pre season he has improved and was serviceable in his one game against Freo.

He has yet to show anything to suggest that he is a viable option as a ruckman, using a pretty season game as evidence is ridiculous

 

[saj_21]

He has yet to show anything to suggest that he is a viable option as a ruckman, using a pretty season game as evidence is ridiculous

I'm not arguing he is a good ruckman but you said he isn't a ruckman at all. 200cm suggests otherwise.

And once again up until this year he looked off the pace at AFL level. But this year he looked more comfortvake at afl level to provide a contest. His pre season was good, a lot of commentators weee debating whether to play him and Gawn. That wouldn't be the case if Spencer wasn't upto it at all

 

[Marc_Remillard]

I'm not arguing he is a good ruckman but you said he isn't a ruckman at all. 200cm suggests otherwise.

And once again up until this year he looked off the pace at AFL level. But this year he looked more comfortvake at afl level to provide a contest. His pre season was good, a lot of commentators weee debating whether to play him and Gawn. That wouldn't be the case if Spencer wasn't upto it at all

That's ridiculous, you need more than height to be a viable AFL ruckman

 

[saj_21]

That's ridiculous, you need more than height to be a viable AFL ruckman

Agreed, but to say spencer isn't a back up ruckman is rediculous. To say he isn't good enough is a fair call.

Very few clubs carry two star rucks, generally it's one gun with a serviceable back up with spencer can be.

 

[Marc_Remillard]

Agreed, but to say spencer isn't a back up ruckman is rediculous. To say he isn't good enough is a fair call.

Very few clubs carry two star rucks, generally it's one gun with a serviceable back up with spencer can be.

When has Spencer ever proven at AFL that he is serviceable?

 

[saj_21]

When has Spencer ever proven at AFL that he is serviceable?

The freo game this year. Look I'm not saying he is gun at AFL level, but he is a serviceable backup. A lot of clubs will only have two rucks on there list, if you need a ruckman clubs will cherry pick rucks form other lists as oppposed to developing their own.

 

[stretcharmstrong]

Haha that's funny, you can argue he is not a good footballer but to say he isn't a ruckmen is laughable. That's all he is, secondly most would agree up until this year he hasn't looked up to AFL standard but he showed signs in the pre season he has improved and was serviceable in his one game against Freo.

Spencer hasn't played a bad game this year, including JLT. He is a legitimate ruckman and would be a starting ruckman in about 7 or 8 teams.

 

[stretcharmstrong]

When has Spencer ever proven at AFL that he is serviceable?

Every game he has played in 2017, including JLT.

 

[Marc_Remillard]

Every game he has played in 2017, including JLT.

Yeah nah

 

[Jordie_tackles]

On topic Goodwin changed another game.

Off topic Spencer is a good enough second ruck, actually kicked some goals this year in top. Would not be a first ruck in any team but as good as many second options.

 

[Dory_77]

Gee whiz lads ease up on each other. The last couple of pages has been a pain to read all this tit for tat over whether Spencil is a serviceable ruck, and when to sharpen the knives for Goody's back, etc.

Anyways, onto the topic: it's still so frustrating how inconsistent we are in games. Pus in the first half then all over them in the 2nd. Gah. Also still leaking like a sieve when teams get balls long over our zone/press. The defensive structure needs some work.

That said, credit where it's due, I love the way Goodwin changes things up to get us going again. The 2 mobile forwards in Watts and Garlett with numbers streaming through the middle was a clever play, as both those guys love space and have speed and smarts to actually use it. It'd be nice if he didn't have to resort to this kind of left field strategy to get us playing well, but I'm really liking his aggressiveness in changing things up. It will be quite a test to see if he can get us switched on from the start after the bye, especially after a big win like this where blokes might be inclined to have a tipple of their own bathwater during the next fortnight.

 

[Sylvia Saint]

It's good to see Goodwin has plan B and an innovative plan A and not just copying the previous year model (Daniher with Brisbane, Bailey with Geelong and Neeld with Collingwood)